Anyone that cannot understand that Israel and the Arabs have a lot of emotional hatred- and problems to solve would think they have Mission Impossible if they used most of this thread upon which to base a decision on can they or can't they reach a deal.
Both sides have committed many atrocities. No amount of individual or collective punishment can undue what's been done... Before Palestinians can get a fair deal, the truth must be known.
Which is why I support a truth and reconciliation. For examples those quotes I referenced here came from Israeli leaders:
http://forums.canadiancontent.net/i...tinian-why-mahmoud-abbas-s-3.html#post1682052
As far as I'm concerned if someone speaks the truth in a restorative justice commission, they should get immunity from further prosecution. A get out of jail free card so to speak. In other words motivation to tell the truth. You get caught in a lie or an omission about a crime, you do the time.
A good video.
But both sides provoked each other from time to time. However Israel was the bigger more threatening force.
During 1965-7, Israel's armed forces staged numerous provocations along the Israeli-Syrian border area.[34] This escalation led the Syrians and the Soviets to believe Israel was planning to overthrow the Syrian regime using military force.[34] On April 7, 1967, a serious incident broke out between Israel and Syria over a cultivation problem within the demilitarized zone. Israel took military action against Syria, and eventually both sides employed artillery, tanks, and mortars.[35] During this clash Israeli airstrikes were launched a few miles from Damascus. Israel bombed both Syrian border villages, and Syrian military targets, and had refused a cease-fire proposal by the Chairman of Mixed Armistice Commission. After several hours the United Nations Truce Supervision Organization managed to arrange a cease-fire. Following this confrontation Arab governments pledged their support to Syria, but also complained that the Jordanian air force had done nothing to help Syrian planes even when they were shot down in Jordanian airspace.[36]
wiki
Israel faced a weaker divided enemy. While their forces were smaller they were better armed, trained and coordinated. Israel's clandestine development of the Sampson option probably gave Israel's military planners the confidence they needed to provoke a war. When that didn't happen, they launched a surprise attack.
Most likely Israel had two crude bombs ready for use.
Israel's Nuclear Weapons
The most likely scenario is that Israel war planners were 98% certain they could win a short war on their own. But if events went poorly they could use crude nukes and threaten more to come, getting a ceasefire.
Fer Christs sake there is enough blood, dead, wounded, permanently scarred emotionally to go around. WTF is the problem here-
I doubt few - very few- on this Forum has had anyone close or known to them killed in the incessant wars, bombings terror reprisals- attacks -
So if people here cannot have a some what reasonable discussion - How can you expect the Israelis and PLO to talk.
Lets get off the FFn soapbox here.
This is about making peace. Not assigning blame.
If anyone wants to assign blame for this, that or FFn whatever START your own thread.
Here are some points for discussion
Hamas- Those that want to make a deal
Mashaal: Prepared for peace without blood, weapons - Israel News, Ynetnews
Top Hamas leader to make first visit to Gaza, following successful UN statehood vote | Israel & Middle East | World | News | National Post
In CNN interview professing a desire for peace, Mashaal asks, 'How can I accept Israel? They have occupied my land' | The Times of Israel
You first post reveals that Hamas's would sign an agreement recognizing Israel at the 1967 borders... more or less. But they won't compromise on the right of return to the area (Palestine) and the rights of Muslims to live, worship and travel to Jerusalem. Part of Jerusalem must be part of Palestine.
Israel's current rulers are determined to grab as much of the West Bank as possible. So they have no interest in peace while they continue to gobble up most of the West Bank and turn Jerusalem into a place where only Jews can live legally and everyone else has to get permission from Israel to visit holy sites... which will eventually be confiscated or destroyed and replaced with Jewish religious sites. I'm convinced that's the eventual fate of The Dome of the Rock and Al Aqsa Mosque. Zionists prize that Real Estate above all else and eventually they will destroy these structures. (The Dome is one of the earliest Muslim religious structures and holiest sites).
I'd support building a holy temple on this site... provided it did not replace or harm the existing structures. Maybe a temple of glass?
But the temple is just a trophy and ultimately military commercialism cannot will not lead to peace.
The ugly truth is that the cause of violence and war here is ethnic cleansing. While Palestinians lack freedom and justice, Israelis won't have peace. Its that simple.