Goodbye Conservatives and Hello Coalition, it's about time
- Thread starter Adriatik
- Start date
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SirJoe, perhaps I misunderstood (It happens...), but didn't Harper split that vote so that the Non-Confidence
vote on the mini-budget takes place on Dec.8th/08, and a second Non-Confidence Vote will take place in
January/09 with respect to the Pork-Barrel Politics like MP salary cap's & this $1.95/vote/party entitlement
& the limits on expense accounts, etc...SO THAT the public could see what the Dec.8th/08 vote was really about?
If that's the case, it's a shame that's the order the votes will take place in. Should be the Pork-Barrel vote first
on Dec.8th/08 and the other one in January/09...that would truly show whether or not the public funds for the
other parties is really a minor point, or the point. By overthrowing the Government on Dec.8th/08 though...the
NDP & Liberals & Bloc can avoid the second vote about the Pork-Barrel all together. Sad....
If the current maneuvering by the three opposition parties was truly about the budget, wouldn't they have already
overthrown the Government in one of the (I believe) six opportunities they had at Non-Confidence votes in the
last term (the six where the Liberals where always absent)? One of THOSE Non-Confidence votes was over a budget.
The fact that this potential toppling of the current goverment at this time (and not one of the last six times) makes it pretty
clear (at least to me) that the Pork-Barrel portion of this last vote (before the vote was split) is the real & only point
to the three opposition parties.
Hey, news flash- they are all pretty well equally stupid and malicious. Recite after me- THERE IS NO GOOD POLITICAL PARTY.
Just in case you didn't notice, but I'm not aware of a SINGLE Canadian who voted for a coalition of the Liberals, NDP, and the Bloc.
So in fact, more people voted for the Conservatives than for a coalition.
How does you brain justify that?
A government that nobody voted for, led by a guy who's already announced his resignation. Works for me.
If the current maneuvering by the three opposition parties was truly about the budget, wouldn't they have already
overthrown the Government in one of the (I believe) six opportunities they had at Non-Confidence votes in the
last term (the six where the Liberals where always absent)? One of THOSE Non-Confidence votes was over a budget.
Ron, this is the first time that opposition will get a chance to vote on a no confidence motion in this Parliament, what happened before the election is irrelevant. When Flaherty made his statement, I think the opposition parties were expecting a stimulus. When that didn’t materialize, they are talking about getting rid of the government. It is perfectly legitimate; there is nothing wrong with that.
the other one in January/09...that would truly show whether or not the public funds for the
other parties is really a minor point, or the point.
I understand that Harper has backed away form that, there won’t be nay cuts to the public funding of the parties.
If that's the case, it's a shame that's the order the votes will take place in. Should be the Pork-Barrel vote first
on Dec.8th/08 and the other one in January/09.
Now that Flaherty made his financial statement, the vote on that must be held in an expeditious manner. I think government has some flexibility, they can postpone the vote by a week or so, but they cannot postpone it indefinitely. I don’t think they have the authority to delay the vote until January 09, if they could have done it, they would have done.
overthrown the Government in one of the (I believe) six opportunities they had at Non-Confidence votes in the
last term (the six where the Liberals where always absent)? One of THOSE Non-Confidence votes was over a budget.
Ron, this is the first time that opposition will get a chance to vote on a no confidence motion in this Parliament, what happened before the election is irrelevant. When Flaherty made his statement, I think the opposition parties were expecting a stimulus. When that didn’t materialize, they are talking about getting rid of the government. It is perfectly legitimate; there is nothing wrong with that.
the other one in January/09...that would truly show whether or not the public funds for the
other parties is really a minor point, or the point.
I understand that Harper has backed away form that, there won’t be nay cuts to the public funding of the parties.
If that's the case, it's a shame that's the order the votes will take place in. Should be the Pork-Barrel vote first
on Dec.8th/08 and the other one in January/09.
Now that Flaherty made his financial statement, the vote on that must be held in an expeditious manner. I think government has some flexibility, they can postpone the vote by a week or so, but they cannot postpone it indefinitely. I don’t think they have the authority to delay the vote until January 09, if they could have done it, they would have done.
There need not be an election
This has happend before in Canada, I believe it was during the time of Aurthor Mean,(not sure of spelling). The government fell and the Govenor General asked if
the opposition could form a government. Harper thought the opposition was weak and would roll overr, and the have, except they are about to crush him in a large political bed. I think this is great, we are about to get rid of the Tories and any legal method to do this is good. What will likely happen is the old Reform and Tory
sniping will begin and this lot can slink back into the pages of Canadian history, to be forgotten like all the rest of the Conservative attempts to dominate the Canadian landscape. I am just happy they are going out the door. The opposition can in fact, introduce a no confidence vote, on a point of order and go to the govenor general and ask for a chance to form a government. They have already decided the cabinet and positions of influence so there is little left to discuss.
This has happend before in Canada, I believe it was during the time of Aurthor Mean,(not sure of spelling). The government fell and the Govenor General asked if
the opposition could form a government. Harper thought the opposition was weak and would roll overr, and the have, except they are about to crush him in a large political bed. I think this is great, we are about to get rid of the Tories and any legal method to do this is good. What will likely happen is the old Reform and Tory
sniping will begin and this lot can slink back into the pages of Canadian history, to be forgotten like all the rest of the Conservative attempts to dominate the Canadian landscape. I am just happy they are going out the door. The opposition can in fact, introduce a no confidence vote, on a point of order and go to the govenor general and ask for a chance to form a government. They have already decided the cabinet and positions of influence so there is little left to discuss.
Geez Didn't they learn from Joe" We'll rule like we have a majority" Clark- If anything it will be interesting. The Cons brought this upon themselves, soon they'll all be out of work, I bet they wished they'd come up with a better stimulus package. How long can this coalition hold on for? I would say 3 - 6 months before the longknives come out and were back at the polls.
The Cons are definitely not any Devina inspiration, wannabees are a dime a dozen.:smile:
The real deal takes time to cultivate and must be of the same political brand....
That is the quirk of the first past the post system, whether the governing party has a majority or a minority makes a huge difference.
Cons currently have 143 seats. There is a huge difference between 143 and 156 seats. On the other hand, there is very little difference between 143 and 128 seats (as they had the last time).
Being a minority naturally puts some constraints on the governing party. Unfortunately Harper doesn’t realize that, he started governing from day 1 as if he had won a landslide election.
Incidentally, Bush made the same mistake in 2000. Having won a squeaker (and in the end the election being handed to him by a highly partisan, highly political Supreme Court), he tried to govern as if he had won a landslide. We all know how that turned out.
As to the coalition lasting only 3 to 6 months, it all depends upon the budget. If the coalition can pass the budget next year, they are practically assured of staying in power until 2010. Other than he budget, there are very few other bills that can truly be considered a confidence vote. If the coalition loses most of them (I assume by Cons and the Bloc teaming together), that won’t necessarily defeat the coalition.
I'm not really convinced of THAT either. What I do know for sure is the political situation in Canada is a real mess, which may be partly due to low voter turnout indicating apathy. On the other hand I don't think it helps anything when uninformed people vote. A lot of the time I think people vote for whoever will give them the most for nothing- that doesn't work in any society. I don't believe in any of the political parties, once in a blue moon however I come across a politician who appears to have a smattering of sense and credibility- but what real chance does he/she have against the hordes in the system? I think Paul Martin (not totally squeaky clean honest) is head and shoulders above the rest of the pack. Dion and Layton are just a couple of lowlife opportunists- Harper has some scruples but I think he's cooked his own goose by reneging on the decision not to support political parties - so he obviously wishy washy at best and perhaps fraudulent and an opportunist at worst. Forking out another $300 million for another election is insane and forming an opposition with philisophically opposed parties is also insane. Best for everyone to back off, give Harper a couple of years while in the meantime the electorate educates themselves, so the next election is meaningful.
Harpo tried this very thing to get rid of Paul Martin in 2004.
Turnabout is not fair play, according to Harpo
8O
I really can understand why the opposition and others are snivelling about PUBLIC money being cut off from them. It is not the first time that this issue has come up, though, and in spite of what Micahel ignoramustieff said on CTV's Question Period today, Harper's Cons did NOT initiate this issue. (I can also understand his delusion, though, and in saying deluusion I am giving him the benefit of the doubt whether he was outright lying or not). Read this:
IMO, federal funding for political parties, and particularly federal funding that discriminates against other parties is against the 2nd section in the Charter of Rights & Freedoms. Put it this way, if I voted Rhino, having my tax dollar go toward funding the Glibs, or Cons, or Naive Dense Pussies is against my freedom of expression.
I love the idea of parties standing on their own feet without being funded by corporations, lobbies, and taxpayers' money. But, it is typical of Canada's parties to display a lack of spine when confronted by mild opposition to their plans. So the Cons are just as loathsome as the others.
- Elections Canada On-Line | General Information
IMO, federal funding for political parties, and particularly federal funding that discriminates against other parties is against the 2nd section in the Charter of Rights & Freedoms. Put it this way, if I voted Rhino, having my tax dollar go toward funding the Glibs, or Cons, or Naive Dense Pussies is against my freedom of expression.
I love the idea of parties standing on their own feet without being funded by corporations, lobbies, and taxpayers' money. But, it is typical of Canada's parties to display a lack of spine when confronted by mild opposition to their plans. So the Cons are just as loathsome as the others.
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