Healthcare system disintegration

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
75,301
548
113
Vernon, B.C.
*groan*...

I had a couple good years. Because I have a clear perspective on what standard of living I want, and because I had achieved that, I bonused the surpluses to the staff.

Then times got tough, and when I needed help the most, they bailed.

Who was being greedy?

Hmm... why am I bothering you with this.

I think the point is, not everyone is greedy, but if I had been, it would have been easier to survive the bad years.

99% of the human race is greedy (me included at times) but some are more sickening than others. My wife has a relative who is worth over a $million and he spends his whole day tracking the stock market and when he makes a second pot of coffee he runs the water through the previous grounds. There has to be more to life than that.
 

Angstrom

Hall of Fame Member
May 8, 2011
10,659
0
36
I'd like to see rebates for those who live healthy lifestyles and bonuses for those who improve their health.

$10 a kg for every kg lost and kept off over two years.

Give Drs bonuses for patients who have been encouraged to improve their health with diet and excerise rather than pills.

If you do high risk activities there should be a small yearly fee for extra insurance.

I don't want to have to pay extra to have a waterski pulled out of someone's ass.


You can make this big complicated system that cost billions to keep track of people's health, and payouts.
Or use the simple system of, everyone takes care of themselves, you are responsible to pay for your own healthcare.

Keep free health care for children under 18.

If you make bad decisions, you should live with them.
As soon as our social system take away "good judgment"
and responcible thinking its counter productive and makes
things worst.

Canada is a welfair state.

You're calling someone else twisted and then post this????? ROFLMFAO, rich, oh so rich.


Oh MY !!! never thought Id see you defending me lol

You're twisted. What the heck do you think civilization is for anyway?

.


Are you saying Civilization only exists to bail out all the dumb decisions everyone make?
Tell me why Civilization is there for.
 

SLM

The Velvet Hammer
Mar 5, 2011
29,151
5
36
London, Ontario
There is no singular solution because there is no singular problem. There is enough blame to go around, from wasteful government bureaucracies to individual's who clog the system needlessly.

Recently I brought my daughter down to our local Urgent Care Centre. She checked in, gave her name, her health card was taken. We waited about 10 minutes, then we were called to the Triage Nurse for an intial assessment. Back to the waiting room. Then we were called to desk 3, where a file for the doctor was finally created. Finally we were called and planted in an examination room, where we waited about 3 hours.

Urgent Care Centres, to my understanding, were created to help the congestion problems in our emergency rooms. Great idea, in principal. You have a health issue that isn't an emergency but can't get in to your own doctor right away, you can go there instead of taking up valuable real estate in the ER. But was there really a need for three separate people to check us in? Is there no way to streamline that process and perhaps toss some of the savings towards doctors or even nurse practioners so that we can reduce waiting 3 hours in an examination room? That just looked and smelled so much like government waste to me, it was ridiculous.

Conversely, my mother, who has a disability, has the odd occassion where she needs assistance in her home. She takes as much precautions as possible, but there are times where, in an effort not to fall, she lowers herself to the floor because she cannot find the strength to right herself on her own. I cannot lift her and she cannot lift herself, so she requires assistance from paramedics. Because she does not actually go into the ambulance, since she is not actually injured, there is no charge for this. However, some poor guy who has a heart attack or stroke and calls an ambulance for transport to the hospital will get a bill for $45.00. How does this make any kind of sense at all?
 

Tonington

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 27, 2006
15,441
150
63
As soon as health care is taken out of the hands of bureaucrats.

That will never happen. Public and private, just different forms of bureaucracy. The main difference is the purpose and scope of the corporation, or government department.
 

taxslave

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 25, 2008
36,362
4,342
113
Vancouver Island
That will never happen. Public and private, just different forms of bureaucracy. The main difference is the purpose and scope of the corporation, or government department.
That is the sad part. My experience with big companies is much like dealing with the government. Mostly bad. That is why GM failed. Nothing to do with cars but lots to do with empire builders that forgot that the initial objective was to build a vehicle that customers would want at a price they would pay.
 

Tonington

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 27, 2006
15,441
150
63
I think before any meaningful change can occur, those who are responsible for our health care system must have serious conversations about the challenges ahead. We haven't even met the goals of the 2004 health accord, much less stared to consider the long term challenges...We need to start looking outside our borders at the policies that have been working, and those which haven't, and seriously consider what good looks like, for Canadian health care now, and in the future...

Harper has a majority, he can tackle issues with longer lead times now. Rebuilding the military is great, but I don't see how that is the largest priority...my generation will not be able to fund the system the way it's going...there are too few of us, and too many who will require long-term care.
 

Omicron

Privy Council
Jul 28, 2010
1,694
3
38
Vancouver
You can make this big complicated system that cost billions to keep track of people's health, and payouts.
Or use the simple system of, everyone takes care of themselves, you are responsible to pay for your own healthcare.

Keep free health care for children under 18.

If you make bad decisions, you should live with them.
As soon as our social system take away "good judgment"
and responcible thinking its counter productive and makes
things worst.

Canada is a welfair state.




Oh MY !!! never thought Id see you defending me lol




Are you saying Civilization only exists to bail out all the dumb decisions everyone make?
Tell me why Civilization is there for.

You'd hate living in Norway, wouldn't you.

Would you hate it enough to run for government in order to get power in order to tear everything down in order for everyone to feel the same misery that motivates you, like what Harper is doing to Canada, because you think everyone needs to be miserable in order to be motivated?

What you're saying is that you are lazy and selfish, and if you didn't have misery, then you wouldn't do anything, and you're presuming everyone else is the same way.
 
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Unforgiven

Force majeure
May 28, 2007
6,770
137
63
You can make this big complicated system that cost billions to keep track of people's health, and payouts.
Or use the simple system of, everyone takes care of themselves, you are responsible to pay for your own healthcare.

The problem with that is that people then avoid getting the health care they need in a timely manner and end up waiting until it's a crisis to deal with their health care. That of course cost far more than the original problem.
As well when someone has a catastrophic medical situation, you end up turning people away because they don't have the funds to pay for the medical care.

Keep free health care for children under 18.

Health care isn't free. Someone pays for it. So why do I have to pay for both my health care and the health care of your kids?

If you make bad decisions, you should live with them.
As soon as our social system take away "good judgment"
and responcible thinking its counter productive and makes
things worst.

Canada is a welfair state.

People make mistakes, that's how we learn many important lessons in life.
A few lessons may go a little like this.

If you have a car accident, the rules of supply and demand kick in and peeling you out of what's life of your driver seat is negotiated while you sit there with the car smoking. Once done, we can move on to getting you stable and moving what's left of you and your passengers to the hospital. Since the other driver offered to pay more, (dude is loaded) him and his slightly injured passengers get dibs on the first arrivers. If you simply chose to make more money maybe this wouldn't happen to you.

So now that the B team has arrived, you can get your butt to the hospital. Which one can you afford? There is the good one's then the other ones for the budget minded. As it looks like your party is going to need care costing into the millions, you might want to go with the budget hospital, though your wife's face is going to take some skill to reattach it and avoid all the scar tissue and infection so maybe for that you want to go with the good stuff. Up to you though just inform the guys carrying you into the truck and they will be able to call ahead to the hospital of your choice to see if they will take you or not.

Of course if we're going to go with this take responsibility for your own actions, we can do away with the police. You can deal with your own problems like everyone else. If someone draws on you without good reason, go a head and shoot them if you can as you're in the right. Put out your own house when it catches fire and school your own kids.

You could of course buy your own security if that is what you want. Same with schools, power generation and water management. Don't forget to take care of your own garbage removal and disposal.

I can see where this is appealing right up until you have to actually start dealing with all of it. Falls apart there but still it nice to dream.

Canada isn't a welfare state. We do take care of keep most from falling too far through the cracks, which is how it should be in a wealthy country such as ours. People shouldn't suffer for the basic needs simply because of greed.

Oh MY !!! never thought Id see you defending me lol

Discussion, like politics, makes for odd bedfellows. Wot

Are you saying Civilization only exists to bail out all the dumb decisions everyone make?
Tell me why Civilization is there for.

No that is simply an added benefit, civilization allows for us to succeed in spite of individual weaknesses. It also allows for specializing in tasks while others supply for our needs. In this way we allow for a higher quality of goods and services as time can be spent to learn and hone the craft, which then can be traded with others for needed services and goods. In theory anyway. ;-)
 

Omicron

Privy Council
Jul 28, 2010
1,694
3
38
Vancouver
When you pay enough dollars to receive it.

Hmm... did you know that in China, which has a Communist government ruling a free-market economy (lots of people confuse Capitalism with free-enterprise, such that they don't know you can have a Communist government with a free-enterprise economy... Communism/Capitalism define how ownership works, whereas managed/free-enterprise defines how work gets done) and in China, health-care is not provided by the state... it's a user-pay system.

They did that along with their one-child policy, in order to control population growth. They knew that allowing for universal health insurance would keep too many people alive.
 

Omicron

Privy Council
Jul 28, 2010
1,694
3
38
Vancouver
Satan gave me stitches.

Me too, so now we're going to figure out how to kill the frikkin' piece of abomination ****.

Heavenly Father guarantees infinite life to anyone able to help Him kill Lucifer, insolong as there is no judgement on either side.

Everyone gets brain farted by the story of how Moses got out of Egypt... as if it was all a dance organized by a God playing out a symphony of dancers.

The fact is they were reacting moment to moment, but it had to be written that way to subscribe new members with the IQ of a hamster.

I know enough to tell God how to kill Lucifer, such that I know my problem from here will be mysterious obstacles.,
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
120,154
14,850
113
Low Earth Orbit
Me too, so now we're going to figure out how to kill the frikkin' piece of abomination ****.
I know enough to tell God how to kill Lucifer, such that I know my problem from here will be mysterious obstacles.,
Silver tipped crossbow bolts through the groin works everytime.
 

Retired_Can_Soldier

The End of the Dog is Coming!
Mar 19, 2006
12,609
1,507
113
61
Alberta
The idea of free healthcare for everyone is very noble,
but its so deeply flawed, it will be our biggest
drag on our way to bankruptcy by 2050.

Free Healthcare? Where do you get free healthcare?
It's certainly not, nor was it ever, free in Canada.

Unless of course you don't pay any taxes, then I suppose it is free.

Canada's Healthcare system has been in trouble for quite some time, but you will be hard pressed to find a politician with the testes to sit
down and have a frank conversation on how to fix it. Even some of the responses I see here is a clear indication that people just don't get the fact that our system needs an overhaul. There will need to be some tough decisions made if we are to continue to have socialized medicine in this Country, but as long as it is treated as some holy grail, things will only get worse.