What would YOU want to hear at church?

[lone wolf]

See? You just took an abstract message - a mere dozen words - and interpreted it into what you wanted it to say. Now ask why the Bible, a book that has passed down as legend for several generations, then scribed, interpreted, translated through several tongues (languages for literalguy) then manipulated to suit how many powers of the day, isn't quite the perfectly preserved document it's claimed to be.

KISS

 

[Niflmir]

I walk into various RC Cathedrals I find around Europe. Sadly the confessionals are never open.

What I really want to know is how the Priest responds when I confess to being an atheist. (Bear in mind I qualify as a Catholic.)

 

[Spade]

For your penance, three Hail Marys, one Our Father, and promise to disbelieve no more.

 

[lone wolf]

Gotta be worth at least one lap around the worry beads.... ;-)

 

[Spade]

Whoops, Adopted is going to froth at the mention of Catholic. Pea soup incoming! Call the exorcist!

 

[Niflmir]

For your penance, three Hail Marys, one Our Father, and promise to disbelieve no more.

That's what I always imagine, but come on, how could I not laugh at the priest if he said that?

Do you think he would forgive me for being an atheist if I asked for it?

 

[Serryah]

Of course those things matter. I said Christ is the solution to all those problems, and more. You're complaining about the state of things, but remain among the ranks of those who reject the solution, the medication -- the Savior.

By your beliefs, Christ is dead, yet Risen again and now with your version of God (or is your God). Why would he care about the state of the earth now? How does he plan to solve it?

I reject your VERSION of your ideal solution. Yes, I doubt Christ cares, I doubt your God cares. I think the whole situation is something like "man screwed it up, man has to fix it" kind'a thing. And since the child analogy gets thrown around a lot with your type of people, kind'a like how you expect kids to do things on their own to learn, not go in and save them even if they make a profound mess of something.

 

[Spade]

That's what I always imagine, but come on, how could I not laugh at the priest if he said that?

Do you think he would forgive me for being an atheist if I asked for it?

Your promise and a heartfelt Act of Contrition would do it, I'm sure. Your confession would reveal nothing that the priest himself would not have thought.

Go, Niflmir, and doubt no more.

Does the Infinite care a wit for the finite?

 

[darkbeaver]

​

"What profit hath not that fable of Christ brought us!"​

—Pope Leo X​

Who is this​

King of Glory?​

Alvin Boyd KuhnWho is thisThe primary truth of human culture which is presented by all sage religions of antiquity is the fact that there resides deeply embedded in the core of man’s constitution a nucleus of what, for want of a better designation, must be called a divine spark or sun. The glow of Christliness--a thing at once both chemically radio-active and intellectual--in us is indeed the hope of our glory. Modern science, through the work of Dr. George W. Crile, late head of the Cleveland Medical laboratories, has rediscovered what the ancient sages were familiar with--the radiant SUN in man. "Every man," proclaimed the ancients and the Medieval "Fire Philosophers," "has a little SUN within his own breast." This sun is the Christ in man, a nucleus of fiery divine spirit-energy. All the Christs in antiquity were denominated "Sun-
xii
Gods." The names of nearly all of them are the immediate words for the sun, or epithets appropriate to the solar orb. "All things are the products of one primordial Fire," assert the Chaldean Oracles. Life nucleates glowing centers of this fire throughout the universe in the radiant cells of its physical body, which are the suns. Every creature that his life shares a portion of this pervasive fire, which is the rock of its hope for evolution to its greater glory. St. Paul avers that Christ--in man--is the Rock. And so ancient drama represented the Christ figure himself as saying to Peter, whose name means "Rock" in Greek, "Thou art Peter and on this Rock will I build my church." There is no other enduring Rock in man’s life on which the assembly of deified mortals--the church--could be founded. And obviously the community of Christified beings could not be established on any spiritual Rock external to man’s own immanent subjectivity.
The rock of human culture thus being established as a fiery power within man’s own breast, Christianity becomes chargeable with the most opprobrious of all possible accusations. It can be indicted for the crime of being the only religion that in large measure destroyed the force of man’s inspiration and incentive to cultivate this divine solar light within his own bosom. It did this by diverting the direction of its followers’ effort from the inner self-culture of a purely subjective consciousness to the worship of the Christ as embodied in one man in history. Granted that there is a powerful and effective psychology in the adoration of an ideal model of perfection, the main issue here involved can never be dodged. No matter how emotionally, how fanatically the worshipper pours out adoration to a person in objective life, the work of his own evolution is not accomplished until he effectuates the ultimate divinization of the nuclear potentiality of deific fire within his own self-controlled area of consciousness.

 

[Ron in Regina]

...Just try to stay on topic and discuss these things with me, without going into rants about the obvious nature of individual points of view and interpretations. Every debate is subject to these things. Please just deal with the content of the discussion.

..;-)..

 

[Spade]

I would like to hear why, outside the Gospels authored after 70 CE, there is no written evidence of Jesus? The Romans were excellent historians.

 

[Cliffy]

I would like to hear why, outside the Gospels authored after 70 CE, there is no written evidence of Jesus? The Romans were excellent historians.

Doubly troubling since it was the Romans, under Constantine, who created the religion about the deified Jesus.

I would like to know when they are going to fess up to the hoax of fundamentalist literal interpretation.

 

[darkbeaver]

I would like to hear why, outside the Gospels authored after 70 CE, there is no written evidence of Jesus? The Romans were excellent historians.

If you will allow me, I believe I can shed some light on the mystery. Satan, yes it's just that nefarious time schemer who went back and removed all the evidence surrounding the truth of the nativity.

 

[MHz]

Well since most Christians that I've ever heard speak use both when it pleases them and if they can, why can't I? But wait, didn't Jesus make the OT go away? So why do Christians to use OT teachings for excuses for their hate? If the OT didn't matter, why even put it in the Bible to begin with? I think the whole OT vs. NT is a cop out myself and both are used as the person sees fit.

Is it a trait you admire? then by all means go ahead.
Jesus finished the bruise to the heel as far as prophecy and deed. Some of the things that happened back then were about the bruise to the head, and that is still coming up at some point in the future. Most of the OT and the 4 Gospels have to do with the cross (the heel bruise). Most of the NT is about the bruise to Satan's head (chained in the pit for 1,000 years) and the OT and the 4 Gospels have many prophecies that are still just words, unlike the cross.
Good question, I can't recall the last time anybody has been compared to being a 'false Christian' publicly, like the National news, can you?
The OT does matter but why not actually quote the text for both, most of the time believers and non-believers rely on a summary done by somebody else or by their own recall that may/may not be accurate. The slacker the 'time involved' the less important, from the little bit you have posted, well the reading you have done wasn't from the Bible, if it was I apologize and would like the reference if you don't mind. If the last days are said to be like it was before the flood then just what was it like back then? (insert answer here)
What if God is the one that saw fit to put it together, after all, the 12 Tribes were the most important in the OT and in the NT after the time of the Gentiles started (70 AD). For the bruise to the heel one person died, in the other bruise billions will die in a few years, is that a good enough reason to actually look at the words themselves rather than take the path most people take.

I think maybe you should read WHY I made the post I did, as in read adopted's quote. "But the pagans fuss about a solution to gender discrimination, to racism, or to environmental preservation -- How petty and underdeveloped! Our Lord has resolved all of these problems." I was pointing out that his Lord hasn't solved jack. And if the Lord is purposefully letting our world go to hell in a handbasket, then again, that's a sadistic God you've got there when there's no care for the lives of his "followers".

You mentioned that, so, ..... here we are. I'll try to quit stumbling around.
The words are there for a better banking practice by just including Gentiles as being given the same interest free loan, the Vatican should have been the Bank and she was in the non-corrupt days. I would consider that a solution to the many crisis over money in the last 1600 years, don't ever expect to see it this side of the 1,000 year reign. The Church failed, the Bible didn't ignore the issue or have a 'unworkable approach'.

If you want Him here to do those things then join the waiting list.

I don't know what I'd do with someone holding a sword over my head; depends on what they plan to do with it and why. As it is, again, I'll "Bend knee" to someone worthy, not a sadist. But I guess I should amend that a little: if bending knee would save someone's life, then yes, perhaps I would bend knee to the sadist. But in all honesty, I can't say what I'd do exactly if someone held a sword to me. Since I doubt your version of God gives two rat's behinds about me, I'm not gonna worry 'bout it.

My point was you are not the most powerful that is around today and you can be made to kneel in acknowledgement by threat alone. Does that fit the words in the verse below because that is when God expects man to kneel.

Re:7:9:
After this I beheld,
and,
lo,
a great multitude,
which no man could number,
of all nations,
and kindreds,
and people,
and tongues,
stood before the throne,
and before the Lamb,
clothed with white robes,
and palms in their hands;
Re:7:10:
And cried with a loud voice,
saying,
Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne,
and unto the Lamb.

Don't honestly see what you're getting at here. What am I clinging to that the Bible doesn't promote? I reject the Bible because it was written by Man not God. Even if it was God inspired, it's been toyed with by man after the original writings, making that message worthless. That's why I reject the Bible. And what's your fascination with swords, anyway? Not that I mind, like them myself but really what's your point?

False Christian promote that they can have an influence on who the sword (laws and justice organizations ruled by the Governments) are a 'sword', when Jesus returns His 'sword' kills many, More of a keyword in a group of specific verses than anything else at the moment. Diving knives are pretty cool and they can be smacked with a hammer if you are building some kindling.

Actually, seeing as I don't follow your version of God, I don't have to worry. As it is, I've had some discussions with my Creator over the past few years to help deal with some problems and it's greatly helped. Which in the end, is the point to even talk to God, isn't it? I even have more faith now than I did before, because of things happening recently that I asked help with, and that help came. And I'm sure that the Creator knows my thanks and how deep it goes.

So why leave that death clause in there, after all that is something in the old God's book/kingdom?

Don't know and don't really care because Revelation is a boogy-man story to scare people into being good little sheeple and do what they're told and they'll get into heaven where it's rainbows and candy and everything's oh so much better! Yes, that's sarcasm.

Ever actually read the 7 letters? Yes, that's not sarcasm. It tells how those very things cease to be around. It doesn't say if they are laughing when they prank somebody or when they see somebody do something painful they laugh and point and then worse happens to them. 1/3 of all angels and 4 generations of children that were born in more than 1,000 years is not a small number but it should be similar to the 1st woe which is painful events but no death, even suicide goes wrong and the coffee on the crotch is always scalding. If I was a gambler and you read Re:10 and Re:16 I would lay odds that you would prefer to witness ch.10 rather that partake in ch.16. All people end up alive and well in the new earth anyway, this whole earth is like a big seed bank that gets used when all the 'trial runs' are over and the next one is for keeps.

Again, you have your faith in your God and that's great. Why can't I be allowed to have my faith in my God and be in peace? Why do I have to put up with "you're going to hell" or "It's not Jesus and so it's not God" and so on and so forth? I'm not preaching to you to have faith in my God.

Basically because it isn't over, the most you should be inconvienced by Christianity is a quiet word by a passing stranger about 'Sorry for the inconvenience to you and all your loved ones but, ..... the ones behind me are not what you would call kind, but my Master is kind and He will reward you many times over and He will wipe away all tears.

I'm not trying to convert you, just explain who my God is and what He has up His sleeve as far as the future goes. I assume you would put it past the ability of mankind to build a valley that is several miles wide between the Med Sea and the Dead Sea (and then to make it fake proof the water in the Dead Sea is made into fresh. Without that being real (and on schedule as start to finish/finish = same day delivery)

Doubly troubling since it was the Romans, under Constantine, who created the religion about the deified Jesus.

I would like to know when they are going to fess up to the hoax of fundamentalist literal interpretation.

And look what happened to them after they decided to 'improve it', same as , well, ........ you know who.
Might take a whole 6 days to get through the list, the reward is their wives get control of the Rothschild Conglomerate with a cash prize valued at $500T, about $100,000 for everybody on the planet. Compare the Rothschild entity doing that or God doing that which would come last?. If that is a 'rainy day fund' ........ Just sayin ........... glug, glug

Till the cows come home.

Ho:2:18:
And in that day will I make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field,
and with the fowls of heaven,
and with the creeping things of the ground:
and I will break the bow and the sword and the battle out of the earth,
and will make them to lie down safely.

 

[Cliffy]

Ho:2:18:
And in that day will I make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field,
and with the fowls of heaven,
and with the creeping things of the ground:
and I will break the bow and the sword and the battle out of the earth,
and will make them to lie down safely.

Who is the ho in Ho:2:18?

 

[Serryah]

Basically because it isn't over, the most you should be inconvienced by Christianity is a quiet word by a passing stranger about 'Sorry for the inconvenience to you and all your loved ones but, ..... the ones behind me are not what you would call kind, but my Master is kind and He will reward you many times over and He will wipe away all tears.

And that right there is the problem. So your "Master" is Kind, big deal. You're assuming that any God I have isn't as kind, nor is It/She/He/They rewarding, or that It/She/He/They wipes away my tears, as it were.

You're in essence saying my God - my faith - is less than yours. I know YOU might not see it that way, but that's how it does come across to me, and to others. Christianity is more than an "inconvenience", it's dangerous when people of that faith tell others they are not worthy, they're doomed to hell and so on, for either not being of their faith, or because they have broken the Christian laws, which that person might not even follow or believe in. That is my problem with Christianity. And no, that doesn't mean I have a problem with Christ, either. I think Jesus was - if he lived - a good man, smart, caring and even loving. It's just too bad the people that came after him mucked up the messages.

In reality (and getting back to the point), the point should be your God isn't any better, or worse, than mine, just as your faith isn't any better, or worse, than mine. It's just different. As such, to avoid any kind of conflict or argument, why push your God on me or other people? Let us all believe as we wish, or not. It's not up to you to decide anyway, but "God". You have your version, I have mine, we're both happy, just keep your faith to yourself.

 

[petros]

If you walked into a Christian church off the street, what question would you like to hear answered

I have one...wait...make that two.

Why are Christians the only ones who go to Church and what is the Bingo prize for a blackout in 55 numbers or less?

 

[MHz]

You have your version, I have mine, we're both happy, just keep your faith to yourself.

You have been commenting on my version (the Bible's) and you basically got everything wrong, perhaps you should concentrate on explaining who your god is and can the trying to explain other things.. when you are just regurgitating things you have heard but never checked it out for yourself. Just out of curiosity, why didn't you eliminate dying? The day I stop commenting on stuff like that is two days after I bite the dust. I'll try not to be openly rude but if your feathers get ruffled that that is an issue you have to accommodate, that isn't my responsibility, mine is try to make sure my own feathers can take some 'heat' and not get ruffled.

In reality (and getting back to the point), the point should be your God isn't any better, or worse, than mine, just as your faith isn't any better, or worse, than mine. It's just different. As such, to avoid any kind of conflict or argument, why push your God on me or other people? Let us all believe as we wish, or not. It's not up to you to decide anyway, but "God".

Yes He is, He is much worse than yours could ever be, the flood killed all but 8 people. 1/3 of all Angels end up in the fiery lake so I think God take the 'who's bad' award. That He can (and has) brought people back from the grave pretty much take the other side's award for 'who is kind'. However if you wish to concentrate on the negative, go for it and I'll keep replying, sound fair?

If you have to believe in a false version of hell in order to even justify looking for another God then you have a slant on the Bible that isn't there. Unless you are in Jerusalem holding a 'sword' (ant weapon used to kill a man) you won;t be be in hell. If Satan is there in chains and his most loyal followers are there and both are aware and Satan can't get at his followers while they mock him for all the boasting he did about how powerful he was when one person put him in chains and send his two most powerful companions to the lake (big breath) . Who is having the worst time, the ones who were cursing God just prior being killed and sentenced to 1,000 years in hell or Satan who is in chains and his freedom from the chains is his time to go to the lake. The men in hell know they will be released so they are in hell but they are believers so perhaps the sting of the locusts doesn't affect them as it doesn't affect certain people in the 5th trump.

If you are going to reference hell why not use the right definition that all the various passages point to? Do you want to give God a bad name?

I have one...wait...make that two.

Why are Christians the only ones who go to Church and what is the Bingo prize for a blackout in 55 numbers or less?

This is a mulit card game in that the blackout uses 666 numbers.

Who is the ho in Ho:2:18?

Speak up I never 'herd' you? This is the one you want,

Da:11:6:
And in the end of years they shall join themselves together;
for the king's daughter of the south shall come to the king of the north to make an agreement:
but she shall not retain the power of the arm;
neither shall he stand,
nor his arm:
but she shall be given up,
and they that brought her,
and he that begat her,
and he that strengthened her in these times.

 

[lone wolf]

Somebody got a hug at a funeral?

I can interpret too....

 

[In Between Man]

why did heaven watch humanity struggling and suffering and dying for the better part of at least 100 millennia, possibly as many as 200 (not that it makes any real difference), and only then decide to intervene, by sending a message not to anyplace with a civilization that can read and write and has figured out something about how to think and spread a message, but to one of the most ignorant and least literate groups of people on the planet?

Because God is unorthodox. He enjoys taking people we would call "weak" or the illiterate and making champions out of them. Also, God looks at a person's heart, not their education. Look at David. His brothers could flex their muscles all they want, but God chose the scrawny youngest brother who was a simply shepherd because he "had a heart after God's own heart".

And there's many more examples in the bible that prove God is unorthodox. March around the city walls of Jericho six times, and on the seventh blow your trumpets? Think about it, if you were a military commander trying to overtake a city that had huge walls as an obstacle, simply marching around the city walls and blowing your trumpets is about as unorthodox as it gets. Yet, the walls came tumbling down!