What Should Be The Correct Size Of The Federal Government?

captain morgan

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Mar 28, 2009
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A Mouse Once Bit My Sister

I thought government money helps level the playing field between the classes.



Wow... I mean, wow

Cutting programs that for the most part we neither need nor want. Biggest problem is the volume of high paid people required whenever the government gets involved. Since 60% of program spending gets eaten up in administration it can be shown that public delivery of programs is not about helping various groups but simply to provide good paying jobs to large numbers of people with few if any marketable job skills.

Cut the number of the many and overlapping social services and the high priced admin evaporates with them
 

SLM

The Velvet Hammer
Mar 5, 2011
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Cut the number of the many and overlapping social services and the high priced admin evaporates with them
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Ah, you're speaking of efficiency....I don't think that word exists in the government dictionary.
 

Tonington

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 27, 2006
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They have established wait times for surgeries...for this duscussion it would help if there were the same for other government services. What would be a reasonable time to wait, say for an application for some highly regulated industry? I've brought up this example plenty of times, but the company I work for has now staged multiple projects because we have been waiting for almost 2 years for certification from CFIA of our new labs. That's unacceptable.
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
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Sell the aircraft carriers and buy clippers?

They have established wait times for surgeries...for this duscussion it would help if there were the same for other government services. What would be a reasonable time to wait, say for an application for some highly regulated industry? I've brought up this example plenty of times, but the company I work for has now staged multiple projects because we have been waiting for almost 2 years for certification from CFIA of our new labs. That's unacceptable.

That's reality sonshine. Try the waiting game in resources sometime.
 

SLM

The Velvet Hammer
Mar 5, 2011
29,151
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London, Ontario
They have established wait times for surgeries...for this duscussion it would help if there were the same for other government services. What would be a reasonable time to wait, say for an application for some highly regulated industry? I've brought up this example plenty of times, but the company I work for has now staged multiple projects because we have been waiting for almost 2 years for certification from CFIA of our new labs. That's unacceptable.

What would be a reasonable wait time? I'm not sure we'll ever really know.

One thing that's always struck me is that, in dealing with any governmental or quasi-governmental service, is the layers. There are just too many layers implementing programs and procedures,when government institutes a change or "improvement" all they really do is add more or move around the different layers. It's highly inefficient. And it leaves those seeking out services to navigate a thoroughly confusing maze of bureaucracy, purposefully confusing I believe. It's hard to effectively critique something when one does not truly understand it.

Government should be there to legislate, to provide parameters for services but not to actually run them. They simply aren't good at it. Personally I would rather see most services out sourced, reducing the size of the government that currently provides services, even if it means increasing the size of the personnel needed to provide oversight for compliance.

No method of operations is going to be perfect, but it can be a hell of a lot more efficient than it is.
 

Tonington

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 27, 2006
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What would be a reasonable wait time? I'm not sure we'll ever really know.

One thing that's always struck me is that, in dealing with any governmental or quasi-governmental service, is the layers. There are just too many layers implementing programs and procedures,when government institutes a change or "improvement" all they really do is add more or move around the different layers. It's highly inefficient. And it leaves those seeking out services to navigate a thoroughly confusing maze of bureaucracy, purposefully confusing I believe. It's hard to effectively critique something when one does not truly understand it.

Government should be there to legislate, to provide parameters for services but not to actually run them. They simply aren't good at it. Personally I would rather see most services out sourced, reducing the size of the government that currently provides services, even if it means increasing the size of the personnel needed to provide oversight for compliance.

No method of operations is going to be perfect, but it can be a hell of a lot more efficient than it is.

Yes, well the issue in our case is cuts to the resources. I'd be fine with contracting out the approval process, so long as the contract organization is still independent of the company that they are reviewing. The process of dealing with labs handling pathogens should be rigorous, but we shouldn't have to wait two years or more. There are mostly well defined requirements, so we either meet them or we don't.

What is reasonable? I see little reason why we can't use project management principles. It takes one resource X amount of time to complete a particular type of task. We have historical information on how often all the different types of tasks are required. Build timelines that are aggressive but achievable. Place the individual tasks in a pipeline, so that the resource is only ever working on one task. Add suitable buffer for uncertainty. Monitor the load on the resource. Adjust the amount of resource accordingly, or as above, purchase more from a contractor.

That's building efficiency, and it's not difficult to do. It improves expectations from those who are regulated, and it also allows better business planning. In the end, that's far better for both industry, and the government who is ultimately collecting revenue from the types of activities they are regulating. These blanket cuts of departments without actually looking at this kind of stuff is stupid. It's not good management at all.
 

SLM

The Velvet Hammer
Mar 5, 2011
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These blanket cuts of departments without actually looking at this kind of stuff is stupid. It's not good management at all.

Of course it's stupid, because there's no thought going into it. It's reactionary, blanket cuts are all about optics, meant to appease a voter base. But they make cuts in one area, and implement a new plan in another area....it's just moving the layers of bureaucracy around.

It's all a shell game.
 

JamesBondo

House Member
Mar 3, 2012
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Am i understanding the OP correctly? He sees federal jobs as a way to transfer wealth from corporations to workers?

That is so twisted. Wealth belongs in the hands of job creators not self entitled twats. Federal jobs are supposed to be public service, if the only reason for the job is some sort of communist wealth transfer scheme, that would clearly be a public disservice.
 

taxslave

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 25, 2008
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They have established wait times for surgeries...for this duscussion it would help if there were the same for other government services. What would be a reasonable time to wait, say for an application for some highly regulated industry? I've brought up this example plenty of times, but the company I work for has now staged multiple projects because we have been waiting for almost 2 years for certification from CFIA of our new labs. That's unacceptable.

Try building a pipeline or opening a mine. Figure on a ten year wait. No wonder our econmomy is in the toilet.
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
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RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
Try building a pipeline or opening a mine. Figure on a ten year wait. No wonder our econmomy is in the toilet.

Oh yeah, you would bethe first to howl that the paper work was not in proper order, government is a tedious task, we wish you common citizens would fill in the forms properly, there would be no disorder if you would adhere to the guidelines, peasant, working class underling thgingy

we,re here all summer in the sweltering heat tryuing to preserve the Canadian thingy whilen you do nothing to consumate the arrangment, ask not and you will recieve, subject to competative postal rates

the right size for government is exactly the same size as the citizens dimensions

aint it

I,m assuming a standard three dimensional government of course

Look if you want a good government you have to come up with the money, or someone else will, you don;t get a Tony Blair kind of package cheap you know

why should you have affordable government, cheap bastad,it;s no wonder all the good ones work for banks, taxpayers can be handled by the B teamers, leftovers like Harper.

the man can barely answer the phone, convinceingly

Government sjould fit in a small box that you can hide in your closet
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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Try building a pipeline or opening a mine. Figure on a ten year wait. No wonder our econmomy is in the toilet.


When I worked for Gov't. I found the amount of stuff that got accomplished was inversely proportional to the number of meetings held.
 

Sons of Liberty

Walks on Water
Aug 24, 2010
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Can't speak for Canada but as our Founding Fathers demanded many moons ago, no standing army. By eliminating the military industrial complex we would reduce the huge bureaucracy in Washington DC, reduce needless government wastage of tax dollars, and fulfill the wishes of our Founders. All true conservatives who believe in limited government and our foundational principles should stand up and endorse these ideas.

I have often wondered where the hell you live when you come up with this crap.