Nanny State gone Mad!!! Gun drawing causes arrest....

[L Gilbert]

Which would be justified by the nannyism that would undoubtedly explode, if there actually was, an unlicensed weapon in the home, and it were to be used negatively in the future.

"Ifs"? If everyone reacted this way every time a kid drew a gun, a tank, a flying saucer, a tiger, a battleship, a jet fighter, a sword, a poppy plant it's all justification for raiding her home without warrant, right?

I can just hear the accusations, and demands for answers now.

Me, too, and I'd still be ridiculing people for reacting on such flimsy evidence.

It's a vicious circle.

Yeah, idiocy does tend to generate them.

I fully understand your position, I fully understand EAO'.

So do I. But judging from the Gliberals' over-reaction to a few firearms incidents, I think the whole damned issue about guns has been blown way out of proportion. Like I said, priorities are drastically askew these days.

Somewhere in the middle, there's a happy medium.

Yeah, such as verifying issues using sense and calmness rather than reacting without thought. I doubt anyone thought to even ask the kid if her dad was a cop, military or ex-military, or if he even actually had a firearm.

Stupidity is rampant and abundant.

 

[damngrumpy]

Actually they don't have a right to go into the home without a warrant. Secondly even if and if is the
world, there had been a gun, so what? If it was not an illegal gun there would be no concern. If they
had a suspicion they could handled it so much differently. First they could ask is there a gun in your
house? Your child drew a picture of a gun, and we wondered do you have a gun that is visible or
within reach of a child? Two questions that could be answered easily.
Third question, your child drew the picture of a gun, where would she get that vision from? Answer
ask the child. or none of your business. Your kid will draw what is in their imagination and it best to
encourage them rather than make is an unpleasant experience. This is not a defensible action by
authorities who over stepped their bounds.
Some years ago my grandson was attacked by another kid at school by the lockers. He didn't hit
anyone but he restrained the other boy so he could no longer punch him. Result he got suspended
anyway for defending himself. There was a teacher in the hall who saw what happened and admitted
my grandson only restrained him he did not return aggression. Still a zero policy means both were
suspended. My answer to the Principal and my grandson. Next time beat the **** out of him you are
going to be punished anyway and if the school can't do its job then you might as well do it yourself.
And kid make it hurt. Little did they know my grandson could have mopped the flow with the little punk
he has some serious training in marshal arts and did then too. He kept his cool though. It was a year
later at a theatre in town same kid, with issues who went home missing several teeth.
The schools are full of idiots and people who read the rule book without a single grain of thought.

 

[taxslave]

This is one of the dumbest stories ever told. But what is dumber is bringing left/right politics into it. Almost as dumb as the cops who arrested this guy.

I think taxslaves theme song should be "Mine eys have seen the glory of the coming of the Reds, They are hiding in our closets, they are hiding 'neath our beds."

Commies are everywhere!!!!!!!! DUCK!!!!!

There ain't no glory in the coming of socialist hordes. AKA barbarians at the door. They are a menace to society and the economy.

 

[mentalfloss]

Nannies give good head.

 

[skookumchuck]

This is one of the dumbest stories ever told. But what is dumber is bringing left/right politics into it. Almost as dumb as the cops who arrested this guy.

I think taxslaves theme song should be "Mine eys have seen the glory of the coming of the Reds, They are hiding in our closets, they are hiding 'neath our beds."

Commies are everywhere!!!!!!!! DUCK!!!!!

Methinks yon Cliffy doth protesteth too much.

 

[mentalfloss]

This is one of the dumbest stories ever told. But what is dumber is bringing left/right politics into it. Almost as dumb as the cops who arrested this guy.

I think taxslaves theme song should be "Mine eys have seen the glory of the coming of the Reds, They are hiding in our closets, they are hiding 'neath our beds."

Commies are everywhere!!!!!!!! DUCK!!!!!

This is the funniest thing I've read on these boards.

Well done!

 

[petros]

Draw!

 

[wulfie68]

I agree that everyone over reacted and behaved stupidly. That said, the girl indicated her father had a gun to shoot bad people and other comments which lead the police to believe the father illegally possessed an improperly stored handgun. That would be a crime, with potentially lethal consequences.

A drawing and some verbage from a 4 yr old is now probable cause for a warrant??? Aren't you one of the people who is always railing on about the obligations of those with power and against abuses of authority? Well one of the obligations is to use that power responsibly. Just because a gun was possibly present, also doesn't mean it was unlawfully present OR improperly stored.

The police have to react to that and search for an illegally possessed hand gun which could have been on this person or sitting on the coffee table at home loaded. The main fear is that a child could pick up the gun and shoot themselves or someone else. another possibility is that the person is armed and could resist with lethal force. Police can't know this person wasn't a threat and have to act in a way that everyone is safe from various worst case scenarios.

This is all nice but again it rests on the word and understanding of a 4 year old... who also claimed her father used said weapon to fight "monsters.

Colpy seems to be an expert in this field. I agree the reaction was extreme, but the police have to react to possible criminal activity. How would you suggest the police should have reacted?

The duty of the police is to INVESTIGATE not necessarily react. Said investigation could have obtained the facts of the situation without an over reaction that should result in a lawsuit against a whole whack of people.

 

[Colpy]

I agree that everyone over reacted and behaved stupidly. That said, the girl indicated her father had a gun to shoot bad people and other comments which lead the police to believe the father illegally possessed an improperly stored handgun. That would be a crime, with potentially lethal consequences.

The police have to react to that and search for an illegally possessed hand gun which could have been on this person or sitting on the coffee table at home loaded. The main fear is that a child could pick up the gun and shoot themselves or someone else. another possibility is that the person is armed and could resist with lethal force. Police can't know this person wasn't a threat and have to act in a way that everyone is safe from various worst case scenarios.

Colpy seems to be an expert in this field. I agree the reaction was extreme, but the police have to react to possible criminal activity. How would you suggest the police should have reacted?

It was a DRAWING.

There was NO evidence of criminal activity.

There are a million legally owned restricted weapons in Canada. What exactly gives the police the right to assume that a picture representing a gun represents an illegal gun????????

If my kid draws a picture of a car, does that mean the police have the right to arrest me, handcuff me, strip search me, remove my family from the house, and search for an illegal vehicle????

One is as ludicrous as the other.

The victim here should be consulting a lawyer, and demanding satisfaction.

As far as anyone knows, he doesn't even OWN a gun.

Imagine now, if this had been my house, and the police search turned up my collection........all legally held, but dammit, can you imagine?

I'd have been there a week, refusing to answer their questions.

There is simply no excuse for this.

NONE.

Nannies give good head.

The state does not.

 

[Bar Sinister]

Hmm - it appears that I may have escaped such an incident by a few years. Two decades ago my son and his buddies in daycare made their own guns out of cheese slices, violating the daycare's no firearms (toy or otherwise) policy. I was merely informed of this heinous act. However, as someone who had a .22 at age 14 I was hardly alarmed by it.

 

[Locutus]

This smarmy, weak little pink-tied prick (see video of our man in the link below) is trying to have you believe that they 'co-parent' ( that's right), our children.


Brian Lilley « Lilley



Somewhat similar to another famous 'educator'.



Uncle Buck (8/10) Movie CLIP - Moley Russel's Wart (1989) HD - YouTube

 

[petros]

Buck Melanoma. LOL

 

[Serryah]

I saw this but in article form last night. I still don't get it. It's like common sense has said "Screw you all!" and has fled humanity.

I can understand the cops wanting to be careful and I can sort of understand a concern that the child might be hurt, but instead of arresting the dad AT THE SCHOOL (which probably traumatized the kids causing more damage to the girl's psyche than some drawing of a gun) and strip searching him later, why didn't the cops that were at the school just ask, "Do you have a gun in the home?" and go from there?

I mean, the teacher should have gotten a clue when the girl said "My daddy fights monsters" that it wasn't real, but then I remember common sense, no one has any anymore.

If I were the parent, I'd look at talking to a lawyer.

 

[pgs]

I saw this but in article form last night. I still don't get it. It's like common sense has said "Screw you all!" and has fled humanity.

I can understand the cops wanting to be careful and I can sort of understand a concern that the child might be hurt, but instead of arresting the dad AT THE SCHOOL (which probably traumatized the kids causing more damage to the girl's psyche than some drawing of a gun) and strip searching him later, why didn't the cops that were at the school just ask, "Do you have a gun in the home?" and go from there?

I mean, the teacher should have gotten a clue when the girl said "My daddy fights monsters" that it wasn't real, but then I remember common sense, no one has any anymore.

If I were the parent, I'd look at talking to a lawyer.

He has got a good one.
So lets see that means that the school teacher, her principle, the social services people and the police officers will all need their own lawyers,compliments of the tax payer.
Any compensation or damages awarded will be paid by the taxpayer.
And best of all there will be no job action against any envolved.
Canada eh Pity.

 

[DaSleeper]

It was a DRAWING.

There was NO evidence of criminal activity.

There are a million legally owned restricted weapons in Canada. What exactly gives the police the right to assume that a picture representing a gun represents an illegal gun????????

If my kid draws a picture of a car, does that mean the police have the right to arrest me, handcuff me, strip search me, remove my family from the house, and search for an illegal vehicle????

One is as ludicrous as the other.

The victim here should be consulting a lawyer, and demanding satisfaction.

As far as anyone knows, he doesn't even OWN a gun.

Imagine now, if this had been my house, and the police search turned up my collection........all legally held, but dammit, can you imagine?

I'd have been there a week, refusing to answer their questions.

There is simply no excuse for this.

NONE.



The state does not.

Since the children were at school and the father was there too, presumably to pick them up..there was no eminent danger...so the proper procedure for the police if they could provide reasonable cause for a search was to get a warrant from a judge or a justice of the peace.
Had the father been an ethnic minority or if the child had drawn a marijuana plant....the usual suspects in this forum would be up in arm....but a toy gun....OMG:roll:

 

[mentalfloss]

Ezra and Lilley in one thread.

Now I know the thread is for realz.

 

[earth_as_one]

My point about the complaint being about a black man in the Jane and Finch area is that who and where the person lives makes no difference. The police must react the same way. They can't make assumptions based on race and neighborhood.

Let's suppose you are the police officer and you got a complaint from the staff at an elementary schools that based on a drawing and statements made by a four year old girl, they suspect her father had a loaded gun which was accessible to a 4 year old.

Apparently everyone here would ignore the complaint. So after recording the call and dismissing the complaint as a little girl's imagination, the next call you get regarding this family is something along this lines:

February 27, 2012
A homeowner wasn’t home when two of his neighbor’s children apparently found a shotgun in his bathroom and accidentally fired it, killing one of them. It was unclear whether anyone would face charges after the 5-year-old girl’s death
Man wasn’t home when neighbor kids found gun | mercedes, neighbor, death - Death probe - Brownsville Herald

As the police officer who did nothing regarding the first report, Where is your ass now? I bet Joe Public would complain about your lack common sense, only this time, common sense in hindsight, indicates that you should have investigated the little girls complaint.

Police have no way of knowing what is or isn't real based on a 4 year old's statement. But such statements must be followed up. In this case, the report was a false alarm about a toy gun. I would agree that the police reaction did far more harm than good. But the same complaint under different circumstances with the same police response could have saved lives.

BTW, I'm not saying that the police reacted properly. I'm only saying they had to react. I disagree with those of you who believe that the police should routinely ignore statements by 4 year olds. I'm saying they had to react, taking into account the statement was by a 4 year old and that they could have reacted better.

Since gun accidents kill about 500 children a year, the police doing nothing in response to this report from school staff would have been criminally negligent.

Gun Accidents Kill 500 Kids a Year
August 1, 2008
This week, a toddler fatally shot himself after finding a gun in his parent's car. According to Jackson, Miss., authorities, the 3-year-old was sitting in the car at a gas station when he found the gun in the front seat and shot himself in the face. Police questioned the boy's parents, but no charges have been filed. But these aren't freak accidents. More than 500 children die annually from accidental gunshots. Some shoot themselves, while others kill friends or siblings after discovering a gun.
Gun Accidents Kill 500 Kids a Year | momlogic.com

A police officer gets a report of a 4 year old child playing with a hand gun by the neighbor's 4 year old kid.

Should they:

a) enter the house without a search warrant

b) take a number at the court house and after a few hours, they get their warrant to search the house

c) do nothing, reports of 4 year olds playing with handguns by other children shouldn't be taken seriously

 

[taxslave]

My point about the complaint being about a black man in the Jane and Finch area is that who and where the person lives makes no difference. The police must react the same way. They can't make assumptions based on race and neighborhood.

Let's suppose you are the police officer and you got a complaint from the staff at an elementary schools that based on a drawing and statements made by a four year old girl, they suspect her father had a loaded gun which was accessible to a 4 year old.

Apparently everyone here would ignore the complaint. So after recording the call and dismissing the complaint as a little girl's imagination, the next call you get regarding this family is something along this lines:

February 27, 2012
A homeowner wasn’t home when two of his neighbor’s children apparently found a shotgun in his bathroom and accidentally fired it, killing one of them. It was unclear whether anyone would face charges after the 5-year-old girl’s death
Man wasn’t home when neighbor kids found gun | mercedes, neighbor, death - Death probe - Brownsville Herald

As the police officer who did nothing regarding the first report, Where is your ass now? I bet Joe Public would complain about your lack common sense, only this time, common sense in hindsight, indicates that you should have investigated the little girls complaint.

Police have no way of knowing what is or isn't real based on a 4 year old's statement. But such statements must be followed up. In this case, the report was a false alarm about a toy gun. I would agree that the police reaction did far more harm than good. But the same complaint under different circumstances with the same police response could have saved lives.

BTW, I'm not saying that the police reacted properly. I'm only saying they had to react. I disagree with those of you who believe that the police should routinely ignore statements by 4 year olds. I'm saying they had to react, taking into account the statement was by a 4 year old and that they could have reacted better.

Since gun accidents kill about 500 children a year, the police doing nothing in response to this report from school staff would have been criminally negligent.

Gun Accidents Kill 500 Kids a Year
August 1, 2008
This week, a toddler fatally shot himself after finding a gun in his parent's car. According to Jackson, Miss., authorities, the 3-year-old was sitting in the car at a gas station when he found the gun in the front seat and shot himself in the face. Police questioned the boy's parents, but no charges have been filed. But these aren't freak accidents. More than 500 children die annually from accidental gunshots. Some shoot themselves, while others kill friends or siblings after discovering a gun.
Gun Accidents Kill 500 Kids a Year | momlogic.com

A police officer gets a report of a 4 year old child playing with a hand gun by the neighbor's 4 year old kid.

Should they:

a) enter the house without a search warrant

b) take a number at the court house and after a few hours, they get their warrant to search the house

c) do nothing, reports of 4 year olds playing with handguns by other children shouldn't be taken seriously

Better take your meds again. I couldn't come up something that bizzare with drugs.

 

[DaSleeper]

Better take your meds again. I couldn't come up something that bizzare with drugs.

Yup ......and his last paragraph... a hypothetical to justify a police state...
"Those who don't learn from history are bound to repeat it"

 

[earth_as_one]

So if I understand the source of your ridicule, if a little girl told you that she plays with her Daddy's gun, you would do nothing because 4 year olds claims about playing with handguns shouldn't be taken seriously.

Would anyone else react differently? How would you expect the police to react?