Tory G8 abortion stance

Liberalman

Senate Member
Mar 18, 2007
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Re: Majority objects to leaving out abortion in G8 plan: poll

regards to the child, there is no child in question, thus its quality of life is irrelevant.

The law already recognizes an unborn child as a separate life.

If one kills a pregnant mother the law charges the killer with two murders instead of one therefore technically if a person wanted to challenge the validity of abortion it would be overturned but no one has.
 

Socrates the Greek

I Remember them....
Apr 15, 2006
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Re: Majority objects to leaving out abortion in G8 plan: poll

PM reignites abortion fight

“This government is not going to reopen or permit anyone to reopen the debate on abortion,” he pledged during the last election.


Harper?s pro-life views on display - thestar.com
display





 

Dixie Cup

Senate Member
Sep 16, 2006
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The position of Canada was (and that of USA, Britian and most other nations is) that it will support abortion where it is legal. I don't think any money is provided to try to change the laws in the country. But family planning money is given with no strings attached and may be used to promote awareness fo abortion where it is legal.

I would say if that's the case, then the support for abortion, as horrid as that is, should be available. I'd rather see better and more access to birth control so that abortions aren't required, but I also would like to see peace and goodwill in the world to - i.e. "stuff happens" and the option should be made available.

JMO
 

SirJosephPorter

Time Out
Nov 7, 2008
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The position of Canada was (and that of USA, Britian and most other nations is) that it will support abortion where it is legal. I don't think any money is provided to try to change the laws in the country. But family planning money is given with no strings attached and may be used to promote awareness fo abortion where it is legal.

I would say if that's the case, then the support for abortion, as horrid as that is, should be available. I'd rather see better and more access to birth control so that abortions aren't required, but I also would like to see peace and goodwill in the world to - i.e. "stuff happens" and the option should be made available.

JMO

That indeed was Canada's policy until now, Dixie (both under liberal and Conservative governments). Harper changed the policy unilaterally, and could not give a good reason for doing so. The reason of course is that he is pandering to the extremist element in his party.
 

In Between Man

The Biblical Position
Sep 11, 2008
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I think its fantastic that Stevie is sticking up for what's right and just.

We should be focusing our hatred toward the terrorizing anti-globalization protesters, not the one world leader who has intelligence and the brass to stand by a principle.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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I think its fantastic that Stevie is sticking up for what's right and just.

We should be focusing our hatred toward the terrorizing anti-globalization protesters, not the one world leader who has intelligence and the brass to stand by a principle.

Yep, there is probably quite a few that would agree with you..:smile:
 

AnnaG

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Jul 5, 2009
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Hey look at reality and be sure you are wearing sunglasses when you do, because it may blind you. Abortion legal in Canada is not a Conservative achievement, but rather the Liberals have made it legal. If the Conservatives had their way they would make it illegal, and you can take that to the bank.

Quite so. Abortion is legal in Canada, not because of Conservatives, but in spite of them.
Actually, reality escapes you two. Abortion became completely legal in Canada in 1988. Turdeau's efforts only made it partially legal (the medical reason for abortion). In 1988, Bullroney was the PM. He was a Conservative.
But it isn't the politicians that ruled abortion legal anyway. It was the Supreme Court of Canada that did that.
And yet again, you people haven't a clue wtf you are babbling about.

Now we are in some form of human understanding, and my logic is, if Harper would go to a war in Afghanistan and put out 148 lives and $50.000.000 with 0 return being that Afghanistan is soooooooo corrupt, and or champion the next G8 get-together in Ontario to help Pregnant women and children of Africa, then surely a reasonable contribution that won't brake the bank here at home, will make Canada SHINE FOR A LONG TIME ABROAD. But as you said IF Harper agrees, in which case he doesn’t, thus the G7 have labelled him a hypocrite because he is.
Again reality escapes you. It was your Gliberals that sent Canucks to Afghanistan.

But don't let the facts get in the way of your inane POVs.

_________________________________________________________________________

L Gilbert attempted to refute my contention that if men's prostate examination is not funded by Canadian health care neither should be abortion, by saying:

"All men have prostates. Not all women who get pregnant want abortions."

True, but all women have breasts and Mammogramms are fully funded. Not to mention the fact that while - indeed - women can not have prostate cancer, men, rarely have been known to have breast cancer.

So, perhaps my comparison of covering costs between PSA test and abortion was not right on, I need to be convinced that if mammograms are fully covered PSA test should not be.
You missed the point by miles.

Actually, what the discussion went like was this: you said,
What could have been said - and wasn't - that far more people die from prostate related problems than from abortion or lack therof.

Mind you, those who die from prostate problems are only males, so who gives a damn?

Yet a male Canadian has to pay out of his own pocket for a PSA teat, while the promiscous female (at least, in most cases) who had no sense to prevent pregnancy gets a free pass.

What's wrong with that picture? SiRJosephPorter, could you please impart your wisdom?
So you leap to the a$$umption that women who get abortions are promiscuous and haven't sense to prevent pregnancies. Sorry, Yukon Jack but not all women are like that.

Anyway, Les replied with pretty good logic that
All men have prostates. Not all women who get pregnant want abortions.

Yep, leave ity up to the "promiscuous female". There are contraceptives for males, too, you know. Besides that, there are also promiscuous males.
 
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JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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Actually, reality escapes you two. Abortion became completely legal in Canada in 1988. Turdeau's efforts only made it partially legal (the medical reason for abortion). In 1988, Bullroney was the PM. He was a Conservative.
But it isn't the politicians that ruled abortion legal anyway. It was the Supreme Court of Canada that did that.
And yet again, you people haven't a clue wtf you are babbling about.

Again reality escapes you. It was your Gliberals that sent Canucks to Afghanistan.

But don't let the facts get in the way of your inane POVs.

_________________________________________________________________________

You missed the point by miles.

Actually, what the discussion went like was this: you said, So you leap to the a$$umption that women who get abortions are promiscuous and haven't sense to prevent pregnancies. Sorry, Yukon JackASS but not all women are like that.

Anyway, Les replied with pretty good logic that

That's telling them, Anna but don't think they hear too good. :lol::lol::lol:
 

YukonJack

Time Out
Dec 26, 2008
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Winnipeg
My question was, simply that if abortion (which is a totally preventable non-medical condition) is covered by health care why a PSA examination is not.

Lacking a valid and coherent answer, the reply was predictable from the usual predictable suspects.
 
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JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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My question was, simply that if abortion (which is a totally preventable non-medical condition) is covered by health care why a PSA examination is not.

Lacking a valid and coherent answer, the reply was predictable from the usual predictable suspects.

I think I can give you a valid answer to that as explained to me by two doctors, but first of all I can't see a connection between abortion and P.S.A. P.S.A. exams are VERY unrealiable, for every true positive you get 20 false positives (which are very costly because they necessitate further testing - 95% of the time for nothing.) The digital method as old fashioned as it may seem and still not totally reliable, is far more reliable than P.S.A. After the digital test has been found positive, P.S.A. is good to check it, as the P.S.A. apparently doesn't normally miss any true positives. Hope you can savvy all that Y.J. Anyway you and I are basically on the same page (with a few exceptions) when it comes to abortion so no use in beating that to death any further.
 
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YukonJack

Time Out
Dec 26, 2008
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JLM, I did a bit of research (you can do same if you are so inclined) and founf that the cost of an abortion - on the average - is about $500.00. The cost of a PSA test - again, on the average - is about $56.00.

While every abortion extinguishes a human life, for the same cost almost 9 (nine) could be saved by a PSA test. Granted, a PSA test may not be 100% reliable, the results of any abortion ARE.

There are signs that the richest provinces - with little or no sense of compassion and/or equal justice - will join the ranks of the poorer, but more responsible provinces/territories who DO value men as much as they do women, and will fund PSA tests.

I hope that both you and I will benefit from that.
 

SirJosephPorter

Time Out
Nov 7, 2008
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My question was, simply that if abortion (which is a totally preventable non-medical condition) is covered by health care why a PSA examination is not.

Lacking a valid and coherent answer, the reply was predictable from the usual predictable suspects.

PSA examination is covered in Ontario, under certain conditions. I don’t know about BC.

JLM, I did a bit of research (you can do same if you are so inclined) and founf that the cost of an abortion - on the average - is about $500.00. The cost of a PSA test - again, on the average - is about $56.00.

While every abortion extinguishes a human life, for the same cost almost 9 (nine) could be saved by a PSA test. Granted, a PSA test may not be 100% reliable, the results of any abortion ARE.

That is your opinion only. You have no scientific evidence to prove it.
 
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YukonJack

Time Out
Dec 26, 2008
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According to SirJosephPorter:

"PSA examination is covered in Ontario, under certain conditions. I don’t know about BC."

I lived in Ontario until 2007. While living there, every time my family doctor instructed me to get a PSA test, I paid for it myself.

If Ontario funds it now, great. I guess I just missed out.
 

Machjo

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 19, 2004
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While every abortion extinguishes a human life, for the same cost almost 9 (nine) could be saved by a PSA test. Granted, a PSA test may not be 100% reliable, the results of any abortion ARE.

False:

Abortion Survivors

Abortion Survivors

Actually, I wonder if these survivors can sue the physician for the damage caused to them? And the hospital if it officially approved the abortion?

That is your opinion only. You have no scientific evidence to prove it, only religious evidence, religious superstition (and that too superstition from right wing extremist religions).

False. His assertion that abortions are 100% reliable has no basis in religion. Nowhere in any sacred text does it guarantee that all abortions will be successful. The following proves him wrong too by the way:

Abortion Survivors
 

YukonJack

Time Out
Dec 26, 2008
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SirJosephPorter opined, regarding abortion:

"You have no scientific evidence to prove it, only religious evidence, religious superstition (and that too superstition from right wing extremist religions)."

Well, if you don't abort, there WILL be human life in a few months/weeks.

If you abort, there will NOT be one.
 
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JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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JLM, I did a bit of research (you can do same if you are so inclined) and founf that the cost of an abortion - on the average - is about $500.00. The cost of a PSA test - again, on the average - is about $56.00.

While every abortion extinguishes a human life, for the same cost almost 9 (nine) could be saved by a PSA test. Granted, a PSA test may not be 100% reliable, the results of any abortion ARE.

There are signs that the richest provinces - with little or no sense of compassion and/or equal justice - will join the ranks of the poorer, but more responsible provinces/territories who DO value men as much as they do women, and will fund PSA tests.

I hope that both you and I will benefit from that.

Money is one of the least of the concerns here, Y.J. Can you imagine the unnecessary worry and anguish a person goes through when mistakenly told they have cancer?
 

Avro

Time Out
Feb 12, 2007
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My question was, simply that if abortion (which is a totally preventable non-medical condition) is covered by health care why a PSA examination is not.

Lacking a valid and coherent answer, the reply was predictable from the usual predictable suspects.

I agree.

A very valid question.
 
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