A routine flight in international airspace is hardly provocative. The outrage expressed by Canada's leaders is a farce:
Meanwhile:
Meanwhile:
Russian Planes Approach Canadian Airspace
- Thread starter EagleSmack
- Start date
Actually, EAO, I agree fully.
When you regain conciousness, I'll tell you why.
The Russian aircraft did not enter Canadian airspace.
NORAD, yet again, proved its worth warning Canada of the approach of Russiam military aircraft. Canada did the proper thing by intercepting said aircraft, thus expressing its sovereignty in the area, and the Russians turned back.. No big deal.
But then, why has Canada protested?????? They were in INTERNATIONAL airspace, all went as it should, there is no reason to turn up the temperature....it makes us look like idiots.
So it would seem that Canada is totally at fault for the Russo-Canadian incident as Russia never violated any international agreement (even the Canadians haven't denied this).
As for Russo-US relations, I would say both sides are partially at fault, as both are reacting to each other. Now would be a good time for Canada to withdraw from NATO and NORAD while still maintaining friendly relations with the US. In fact, this would likely help issues between the US and Russia. With Canada out of NATO and NORAD, Russia would likely feel less threatened by the US and so bemore conciliatory in its response to US behaviour. And the US would likely feel less gung ho too.
As for Russo-US relations, I would say both sides are partially at fault, as both are reacting to each other. Now would be a good time for Canada to withdraw from NATO and NORAD while still maintaining friendly relations with the US. In fact, this would likely help issues between the US and Russia. With Canada out of NATO and NORAD, Russia would likely feel less threatened by the US and so bemore conciliatory in its response to US behaviour. And the US would likely feel less gung ho too.
Actually, EAO, I agree fully.
When you regain conciousness, I'll tell you why.
The Russian aircraft did not enter Canadian airspace.
NORAD, yet again, proved its worth warning Canada of the approach of Russiam military aircraft. Canada did the proper thing by intercepting said aircraft, thus expressing its sovereignty in the area, and the Russians turned back.. No big deal.
But then, why has Canada protested?????? They were in INTERNATIONAL airspace, all went as it should, there is no reason to turn up the temperature....it makes us look like idiots.
Did Canada 'protest'. As far as I understood the article, Canada merely relayed the story and then pointed out that this was why NORAD was necessary. When did it 'protest'. But then again, this is what makes it so suspicious. Why bring up a story that can only antagonize Russia and yet not make a protest? My suspicion here is that Canada knows that is would have no case if it ever did protest, so instead just releases it as a news story to get us talking and worried, so that it'll be easier for the governemnt later to maybe talk increased militarization.
It's a clever red-flag news event, dezigned so that the government can deny quite truthfully that it's made any accusations against the Russians, while still making Canadians edgy. Seems like its red-flag sotry might work yet.
The problem thugh, is that this can only sour Russo-Canadian relations, thus making future militarization on the part of Canada necessary, but a necessity imposed on us not by the Russian aircraft, but by a red-flag story that would put the Russians on edge as to our intentions in the north. Harper has done muchsaber rattling about the North in the last few years, and that can only alienate other nothern countries, including the US, Russia and others, to varying degrees.
Seems to me that Canada protests to much. Sort of reminds me of crying wolf all the time, after a while no one will pay any attention. Wait until something really happens. The Canadian Airforce acted as they should have and let the Russians know they were near a sovereign countries territory.
Like I said, when did Canada explicitly launch a protest. All it really did was release a news story and then point out this is why NORAD was so important and how they will defend our north blah blah blah. But it never stated explicitely that it is requesting that the Russians not do it again, or anything else of the wort. In fact, it appears the government wasn't even addressing the Russians at all in the article, but us. They're just red-flagging us for increased military spending, that's all.
Really, this should not have been a news story at all. The fact that it became one makes it suspicious in its own right. What was the intent of making this a news story?
At least the Libertarian Party is consistent in what they say. When they say spending cuts, they mean for everything, not just spending shifts from everything else to the military.
Where do you come up with it being anyone's fault, what exactly happened. Seems that you expect the Canadian goverment to report to you everytime the do a exercise. The intercept was a training mission, nothing more for both sides. The bomber was a bomber, not a spy plane. Was the bomber even armed, who knows, probably not with nukes, just in case something happened and it accidentally crashed.
But that's my question. What made this event newsworthy in the first place. The only newsworthy thing about it is that the Canadian government released it as a news story.
The government should never have released this as a news story in the first place. Except for the government's making it a news story, which thus does make it a news story since it raises suspicions of government intent in releasing it so, there is no story there. It was a routine operation on both sides. Yet the story tries to manipulate us into thinking there is a story besides government intention of course. And for this, the government is not onlyat fault, but raises suspicions of future intentions.
As somebody who works and has lived in the north in industry I have to speak my mind and raise the obvious to the "southerners".
Harper and Mckay are making up boogey men to enhance the fear and trauma of this so called "economic crisis" and are using that fear to get you to fund a sattelite and forward Arctic bases in the name of "soverneignty" and infrastucture.
Canada is part of "Space Command" and if we put a sattelite over the pole we can more easily stake our claim against this dug out of the closet Russia excuse and make big bucks on over the pole communications and financial transaction to do business with Russia and they have moolah to lend. They are after all just as much our neighbour as the US is and have technology of living and mining the far north we are still trying to catch up on.
We already bought and paid for the banking transaction network and internet under the guise of "Star Wars".
If you have any experience working or living in the Canadian north you know that bandwith is more valuable than beer or tobacco. You literally have to aim a sattelite up link across the horizon to get a signal to get "some" TV let alone internet bandwidth. If we are going to populate the north we have to have digital communication to do it.
BUT
This is the PERFECT example of how the govt has made up boogey man stories to get the taxpayer to pay for infrastructure (hint hint). Make up an "economic crisis" and toss in a boogeyman and you have the perfect excuse to slow down industry to get the labour to build infrastructure on the taxpayers dollar for the bigger more power industry that will rise after they buy back ownership from freaked out seniors who are cashing in pensions and paying the taxes owed on retirement income to fund the whole silly thing.
This is a pathetic attempt by Harper to trick and scare the savings but more so corporate shares and thus control out of the babyboomers as they retire in vast numbers.
There is no boogey man but the one they create in your mind.
Harper and Mckay are making up boogey men to enhance the fear and trauma of this so called "economic crisis" and are using that fear to get you to fund a sattelite and forward Arctic bases in the name of "soverneignty" and infrastucture.
Canada is part of "Space Command" and if we put a sattelite over the pole we can more easily stake our claim against this dug out of the closet Russia excuse and make big bucks on over the pole communications and financial transaction to do business with Russia and they have moolah to lend. They are after all just as much our neighbour as the US is and have technology of living and mining the far north we are still trying to catch up on.
We already bought and paid for the banking transaction network and internet under the guise of "Star Wars".
If you have any experience working or living in the Canadian north you know that bandwith is more valuable than beer or tobacco. You literally have to aim a sattelite up link across the horizon to get a signal to get "some" TV let alone internet bandwidth. If we are going to populate the north we have to have digital communication to do it.
BUT
This is the PERFECT example of how the govt has made up boogey man stories to get the taxpayer to pay for infrastructure (hint hint). Make up an "economic crisis" and toss in a boogeyman and you have the perfect excuse to slow down industry to get the labour to build infrastructure on the taxpayers dollar for the bigger more power industry that will rise after they buy back ownership from freaked out seniors who are cashing in pensions and paying the taxes owed on retirement income to fund the whole silly thing.
This is a pathetic attempt by Harper to trick and scare the savings but more so corporate shares and thus control out of the babyboomers as they retire in vast numbers.
There is no boogey man but the one they create in your mind.
I don't know if the details are right, but I do agree that the government has something in mind for us. It's quite clear that Russia has nothing to do with this; it's just being used as an excue.
Lets put it this way. This will go quietly down in history as the Gold Rush of 09 to those who pay attention and then played out as the Recession of 09 in govt and the bought media.
Are you then willing to take up military service? The Swiss have universal male military service, required. Not only that, Swiss men are required to keep a fully automatic assault rifle and hundreds of rounds of ammunition at home........(gasp), and to spend a significant amount of their time in training exercises.....and up until very recently, you had to qualify with your rifle before you were allowed to vote.
That is why women in Switzerland only got the vote in the 1970s.....because service to the nation was seen as a prerequisite to having a voice.....
Watch out what you wish for.....
It does work for the Swiss. The last time they fought was in the Napoleonic Wars, when Bonapart passed through on his way to Italy. That was 200 years ago......what other nation can say that? Especially one that has twice in the last 100 years been an island of peace in a sea of warring nations.....the Germans wanted to invade in WWII, but estimated it would cost them 800,000 casualties.....and dropped the idea.
No.
Russia is probing, as they did constantly in the Cold War, testing our readiness, waiting for an opportunity to challenge our sovereignty in the Artic.....which contains an estimated 25% of the world's oil reserves.
Which is Okay, let them probe, as long as they stay out of our airspace, and as long as we constantly remain alert, and don't over-react......and as long as we stay in NORAD so we have our big brother down south looking over our shoulder........
I think Perter Mackay should have kept shut up, it is not a big deal.
I also think the reason he spoke of it is to produce a reaction......a willingness of Canadians to militarize to some extent our north so as to maintain our sovereignty.
I say damn good idea, but just do it, don't bother playing public games of diplomatic chicken with the Russians.