'Royal' returns for Canada's armed forces

[DaSleeper]

Nope, I just expanded on your statement and gave examples of how your narrow minded and bigoted opinion was wrong. The dance was to give you a chance to see the error of your ways. Obviously you are incapable of doing that.

Oh yes, and by the way "one" can not "die sometimes in war".

That was a definite goal post move....
And I was wrong.....It's not a dance ......more like merry go round..

I'll give you the last word...I'm hitting the sack in five.

 

[talloola]

So it symbolizes Canada. When someone says "people died for the flag" they really mean people died for Canada, don't they? It's hardly an argument in support of the old flag over the new flag then. The symbol is arbitrary. What those people died for is unaffected by the change in flag. Both flags represent Canada.

Except when you consider the reasons for the First World War. That war was a war between empires. The Canadians who fought and died in that war fought for imperialism - specifically British imperialism. Though the symbols remain arbitrary, the old flag is probably more representative of British imperialism than the new one - incorporating the arbitrary symbol of Britain into it and resembling of British military flags.

The new flag represents everything the old one did, they are one in the same, I lived under the old one,
then came the new one, a different picture does not change anything, just gave us a bit of individualism
as far as flags went, history is history, a different flag doesn't change that, the new flag brought all
of the past with it.
Britian will always be a great part of our beginning, the reason we have our own country, a strong and
important part of our past, and that will live in our flag forever, whether it is old or new.

 

[#juan]

I assume you are kidding....

But I like the Red Ensign.....a hell of a lot better than a dead maple leaf.

oh well.

Colpy tell us which military and which flags you fought under.

 

[wulfie68]

So it symbolizes Canada. When someone says "people died for the flag" they really mean people died for Canada, don't they? It's hardly an argument in support of the old flag over the new flag then. The symbol is arbitrary. What those people died for is unaffected by the change in flag. Both flags represent Canada.

Except when you consider the reasons for the First World War. That war was a war between empires. The Canadians who fought and died in that war fought for imperialism - specifically British imperialism. Though the symbols remain arbitrary, the old flag is probably more representative of British imperialism than the new one - incorporating the arbitrary symbol of Britain into it and resembling of British military flags.

Sorta but not quite. The old empires had a large influence on how the sides lined up but the first World War was more about the alliances and obligations to respond than anything else. There were some imperialistic side effects (such as the way western allies partitioned parts of the old Ottoman Empire after the war) but the conflict was more a result of countries being bound by treaties than an attempt by any one power to annex more territory.

As for the Red Ensign vs the Maple Leaf, the British Empire was greatly influential in Canada's history; denying that is like denying the sun rises in the east. Canada is a child of the Empire, as is the US, and more than of any other influence. The symbols we choose are rather arbitrary but that cuts both ways. The maple leaf as a symbol isn't something native to all parts of the country, whereas the traditions (and especially laws) of the British Empire are something more universal, even in Quebec despite their French origins.

 

[Machjo]

After 43 years, the Canadian Forces are regaining their "royal" moniker. Canada's navy and air force are to be restored to their pre-1968 titles of Royal Canadian Navy and Royal Canadian Air Force.

Full article

To make for a cost-effective transition, you might want to recognize both the old and new names as official for the year so as to allow the US to use up the letterhead they currently have. No need to rush.

That said, I do agree in principle not for any "traditional" reason but merely because it more accurately describes the truth.

Colpy tell us which military and which flags you fought under.

Change change change change change. Too much change. all those liberals have ruined our country. I say we go back to the Union Jack, scrap O Canada and just sing the Royal Anthem. anything less is just flimsy liberalism and revisionism

To make for a cost-effective transition, you might want to recognize both the old and new names as official for the year so as to allow the US to use up the letterhead they currently have. No need to rush.

That said, I do agree in principle not for any "traditional" reason but merely because it more accurately describes the truth.



Change change change change change. Too much change. all those liberals have ruined our country. I say we go back to the Union Jack, scrap O Canada and just sing the Royal Anthem. anything less is just flimsy liberalism and revisionism

In fact, we should scrap Ottawa and take London UK as teh new Canadian capital. Rename Ontario to Upper Canada and Quebec to Lower Canada or maybe even New france and give it back to france once it goes back to a Monarchy?

Just look at how liberals have ruined our Britannia.

 

[Nuggler]

Far more important than securing funds for health care, education, and all them dull things.

It must have cost a fortune when Helleyer decided to dress all the cannon fodder in green, and drop the Royal.

Wonder how much it's gonna cost to reverse the process.

Maybe if we reduce the CPP or OAS or have a no holds barred private insurance, co-payment based health care system we can just about make it.

Canadians have to be the dumbest, apathetic ****ers imaginable.

 

[Corduroy]

Sorta but not quite. The old empires had a large influence on how the sides lined up but the first World War was more about the alliances and obligations to respond than anything else. There were some imperialistic side effects (such as the way western allies partitioned parts of the old Ottoman Empire after the war) but the conflict was more a result of countries being bound by treaties than an attempt by any one power to annex more territory.

That's the cartoon explanation for the causes of the first world war. Despite what your 10th grade history textbook said, it was hardly a result of an unfortunate cascade of treaty activations appearing suddenly in 1914. It was the result of decades of mounting imperialist and nationalist rivalries, competition for colonies and access to resources and markets. The central powers were trying to push their way into the empire business and were repeatedly losing out. Their attempted ascendancy stoked enthusiasm for a war to solve this rivalry (the war to end all wars) for decades.

Quite the opposite of what you said, it was the coincidence of the alliances which chose the sides, not "the old empires". Every major power in the war was a rival to every other major power in terms of empire. If "the old empires" effected the sides, Britain would have probably been against France and Russia, and Austria against Germany.

As for the Red Ensign vs the Maple Leaf, the British Empire was greatly influential in Canada's history; denying that is like denying the sun rises in the east. Canada is a child of the Empire, as is the US, and more than of any other influence. The symbols we choose are rather arbitrary but that cuts both ways. The maple leaf as a symbol isn't something native to all parts of the country, whereas the traditions (and especially laws) of the British Empire are something more universal, even in Quebec despite their French origins.

I'm pretty sure I'm not denying that the British empire was influential in Canadian history when I point out that the old flag is a symbol of British imperialism. At the very least, I am in fact indirectly acknowledging out that influence.

 

[petros]

I have a lot of respect for this flag.


Nazi Germany
Soviet Union
Underground Poland
Communist Poland
Czechoslovakia
Romania

They fought all of the these guys and would be called terrorists by today's standards.

 

[JLM]

After 43 years, the Canadian Forces are regaining their "royal" moniker. Canada's navy and air force are to be restored to their pre-1968 titles of Royal Canadian Navy and Royal Canadian Air Force.

Full article

I don't get too rambunctious about what they want to call it, I'm more interested in what they do, having them is the important issue. :smile:

 

[Corduroy]

I have a lot of respect for this flag.


Nazi Germany
Soviet Union
Underground Poland
Communist Poland
Czechoslovakia
Romania

They fought all of the these guys and would be called terrorists by today's standards.

That was random.

 

[Nuggler]

I assume you are kidding....

But I like the Red Ensign.....a hell of a lot better than a dead maple leaf.

oh well.

Colpy for Prime Minister: He'll completely **** the country up, but at least we'll have concealed carry.;-)

Pardon the ignorant - but what does this change really mean for us?

the govt. gets to spend more money....................cure the deficit.

I spent five years in the RCAF. The RCAF had a proud history and a tradition of excellence that seemed to be lost when Hellyer
put all the services in those crappy bus driver's uniforms. I am glad to see this move to separate the three big services. A move that will
bring back the old espirit de corp that we once had. This is a good idea.

Juan, you sound like an old reservist I used to know who waxed eloquent in the Legion about Canada's glorious military past..........rose to the rank of Captain...........in the reserves............never saw a day of war, but shed them tears for the "good ol days" .

I used to work with the guy, and he literally couldn't decide which shoelace to tie first. And..........he would have been IN COMMAND of troops if push came to shove. Imagine having a stupid twat like that sending the fodder over the top.

You will dig into your pocket and come up with a few mill for this move, no?? Nah, perish the thought. The great unwashed will foot this one too. Our credit's good.

No personal disrespect meant, Juan. Air force is a great outfit, as are all the rest of the services. But sometimes the stupidity, disregard for human life, to say nothing of the money involved, does tend to make one sick.