Mall roof collapse injures at least 4 in N. Ontario
- Thread starter gerryh
- Start date
How do you figure? You realize that you can't just barge in there, the escalator is near collapse and apparently that is where any survivors would be located near. Barging in there would only put the rescuers at risk and seal the fate of those trapped.
"The articulating arm has a 150-foot reach and will “be able to reach up and over the structure put itself down on the floor” near the escalator where rescue officials believe victims are located, said Bill Neadles, the Toronto police staff inspector who leads the Heavy Urban Search and Rescue team spearheading efforts.
The arm will be used to push the mall’s escalator backwards and away from the victims, he explained. Then engineers will assess the structure of the building. The rescue team intends to shear off the south east corner of the mall. Then they will “gingerly” cut through the building, Neadles said."
Canada News: Elliot Lake mall roof collapse: Crews work frantically to find people trapped beneath rubble - thestar.com
D, I agree that if the emergency crews deem the situation too risky for their attempt, then they should stop. But that doesn't mean the rescue effort stops. Failure of planA means going to planB, if that doesn't work, then plan C, then plan D....
But saying plan A didn't work and then giving up is ridiculous.
But saying plan A didn't work and then giving up is ridiculous.
Ooops- hit the green.
Could you expand upon there is always a way to mount a rescue safely- Clearly you know SFA about what dangers, problems, risks are involved to those trapped along with the rescue team- Spouting off is easy - But as was mentioned it makes the term Dork appropriate.
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Anyway this whole off/on rescue effort is all of a piece with living in the bush-out of sight is out of mind.
Actually it does mean that you stop. An incident commander would be remiss in his duties to put his resources in danger. The proper move is to pul back and manage the scene as best you can until qualified and properly equipped crews can be brought in.
Refer to rule #1.
That articulating arm should have been on it's way by Sunday morning at the absolute latest. I know it's easy to be an armchair quarterback, especially in hindsight, but when people are burried in rubble you don't go pull out your MS Project. Dig with your GD fingernails if you have to. If I had a loved one who was burried there I'd be livid right now.
You don't mount a rescue effort with emotions. That is how people get killed. The Incident Commander would be the local fire chief and while I don't know the makeup of their local fire department I am sure they are neither equipped or trained for a disaster of this magnitude.
That's been a problem all along. Missing was as high as 30 and as low as 2. Nerved-up people were calling in if they couldn't get a response and some people do go away without notice.
Rest in peace....
Which would mean that you agree with me. The rescue effort never stopped. If plan a is unsafe, the rescue effort continues by moving on to plan b
But that's not what happened. When plan a never worked, they rescue effort stopped. They didn't move on to plan b. They just gave up. The rescue effort started up again with a plan b but only after the application of extreme external pressure.
That's complete BS! I don't blame the rescue workers involved in plan a. I'm sure they did their best. But as soon as they gave up due to safety reasons, the bureaucrats should have had a plan b ready. Not only didn't they have a plan b ready, they hadn't even considered a plan b. That's the screw up that makes me angry.
Put it into context for you:
Canada News: Elliot Lake mall roof collapse: Two bodies recovered from debris - thestar.com
"He defended perceived delays in HUSAR’s work getting to the victims, who had been inside the rubble since the roof of the mall collapsed Saturday afternoon.
Rescue required new and heavier equipment to be brought in and a change of plans to circumvent the danger to crews at the core of the collapse, he said.
“When the final decision was made to leave the building, I didn’t have the equipment to continue,” a sombre Neadles told the auditorium packed with Elliot Lake residents."
Heavy rain and influx of water Sunday forced rescuers to cease crawling through unstable debris. 2am Monday, there were no more taps from within.
That is pretty simple, there were probably 9 people in the area who were waiting for an opportunity to disappear and when the opportunity presented itself they acted on it. :smile:
Let me put this into context for you.
The decision to bring in heavy equipment and continue the rescue effort happened about 12 hours after the initial effort was abandoned. During that 12 hour period, nothing happened. The rescue effort was called off and their were no plans to do anything else. Only after the local residents threatened to go in themselves and after the Premiere and Prime Minister weighed in, did the rescue effort resume. That 12 hour delay may have been a contributing factor to at least one of the deaths.
It was abandoned at that point as their safety is was risk.
You're a callous SOB.