HANDGUNS!!!!.......YIKES!!!!....in canada

[Unforgiven]

Gun people like to yell violation of their so-called right to bear arms, which is an american oddity not Canadian. What possible good is a handgun other than personal entertainment. It is useless as as a hunting weapon at a range greater than about ten feet. If you want a weapon for defence, a 12 GA shotgun is superior to any handgun and they are not disallowed under any law.

Nothing like a large calibre handgun to make your tiny wince balls puff up as though they were burly manly balls. Sure a shotgun might do that if you can cock it like Sarah Connor, but if your just some skinny punk with a self esteem problem and a fetish for utility belts, you aren't going to be driving a slug into the chamber in anything but the whimpiest looking method taught at junior miss scatter gun class. :lol:

And as all gun nuts know, fumbling a loaded gun, dropping it and taking down the neighbors puppy makes for shrinky pecker syndrom. Right Colpy?

 

[Zzarchov]

1.) unforgiven, your being stupid or your exagerating.

If you find someone with a handgun they are already under arrest for concealed weapon.

If they pull the weapon out likewise they are under arrest.

Using a handgun or carrying it on you (especially with Ammunition) is already more than illegal enough.


You obviously don't know the rules for guns as is.


Your theory that you can somehow force the USA not to produce guns on the grounds that if people smuggle them into the US they are responsible for the deaths is laughable.


IF things work out best case scenario, then the companies would pay out a laughable amount of money to the very tiny amount of people that actually die from unlawful handgun use in Canada.

More likely they ignore you.

And even if they do pay, they keep making guns and Automanufacture shuts down as people start suing them for every auto related death.

And lets not get into knife manufacturers (a much lower profit margin).


Your plans all revolve around the idea that you can make people stop doing things by passing laws.

IF that was the case, why not just make people stop murdering each other? thats also against the law.

Why if the focus on guns and not on murder? You'd rather spend a billion dollars trying to get rid of a gun, then a tenth of that to reduce the number of murders by a vastly greater number.


What do you think that people who die from other causes should be spat upon? Why aren't their easible preventable deaths important? Why is it more important to save a handful of gun death victims than a legion of people who died from other easible preventable causes.

 

[Avro]

As far as I know, no gun has ever broken into someones house and killed someone all by itself.

They banned guns in England you know. I was there in July and everyday in the paper they would talk about the number of people getting stabbed.

Do they now ban knives?

Or.....

Here's some logic, address the problem of why people kill and address the laws that continually let these goons and thugs back on the street.

 

[Colpy]

Oh bleat bleat bleat, ya friggin sheep. According to stats, your the type of person most likely to rape a woman and molest children. What's that tell ya white boy?

Here's a fact, every person killed with a handgun, would otherwise be a live today.

Here are some numbers to explan to us Colpy.

In 1992, handguns were used in the murders of 33 people in Britain, 36 in Sweden, 97 in Switzerland, 128 in Canada, 13 in Australia, 60 in Japan and 13,220 in the United States.

What's up with that?

Well, I'll ignore your first couple of lines, as them are simply ignorant and insulting.....to say nothing of completely stupid.

In 1992, handguns were NOT banned in Britain, when they were, gun murders went UP.
Sweden is one of the countries in the world with the highest rates of firearms ownership.
In Canada, less than 3% of the guns used in murder are registered.
Japan has no legal handguns, it is an island, how did 60 people die there?

And Switzerland! I love it! The Swiss have the highest rate of firearms in the home in the world. Every males between 18 and 45 years old is required to keep an automatic rifle (that's a machine gun!) in their home with 30 round magazines and 200 rounds of ammunition. Handgun ownership is ENCOURAGED! Every little town has a shooting range. Not that long ago, Swiss citizens were required to demonstrate their proficientcy with their weapons before they were allowed to VOTE, as keeping arms and being capable with them for the common defense was considered the primary responsibility of citizenship.

Yep, we could learn a lot from the Swiss.

Thanks, BTW, for once again demonstrating two things:
1. Culture, NOT the presense of inanimate objects, is the major cause of murder.
2. You don't have a clue what you are talking about.

 

[Colpy]

Gun people like to yell violation of their so-called right to bear arms, which is an american oddity not Canadian. What possible good is a handgun other than personal entertainment. It is useless as as a hunting weapon at a range greater than about ten feet. If you want a weapon for defence, a 12 GA shotgun is superior to any handgun and they are not disallowed under any law.

The right to keep and bear arms was not born in the US Bill of Rights.....far from it. It can be traced to Canute, an 11 th Century king of England, it is recognized both in the Magna Carta of 1215, and the English Bill of Rights of 1689. It is listed among the few major rights of the individual by William Blackstone, the man that defined much of English Common Law, as such it is part and parcel of the Canadian constitution as well.....it is an ancient and honourable tradition, standing beside the right to habeus corpus, jury trial, freedom of speech, freedom of religion, right to be free of unreasonable search, and the right to remain silent as one of the cornerstones of individual liberty.

Yes, a 12 ga is a much superior defensive weapon. Unfortunately, they will be next on the list. Just ask Unforgiven.

 

[lone wolf]

Guitar strings make effective garotte.... Should we watch everyone who needs a high E?

 

[#juan]

Quoting Colpy
And Switzerland! I love it! The Swiss have the highest rate of firearms in the home in the world. Every males between 18 and 45 years old is required to keep an automatic rifle (that's a machine gun!) in their home with 30 round magazines and 200 rounds of ammunition. Handgun ownership is ENCOURAGED! Every little town has a shooting range. Not that long ago, Swiss citizens were required to demonstrate their proficientcy with their weapons before they were allowed to VOTE, as keeping arms and being capable with them for the common defense was considered the primary responsibility of citizenship.

Now that I like. The militia idea would make sure everyone was at least competent. Home invasions would sure as hell be a thing of the past.

 

[Avro]

1. Culture, NOT the presense of inanimate objects, is the major cause of murder.

It's okay Colpy, you can be less vague, I've got your back on this one.;-)

It's the one thing everybody is afraid to talk about for fear of getting the racist label.

I couldn't give a crap, not talking solves nothing.

WHY DO BLACKS KILL EACH OTHER?

 

[Unforgiven]

1.) unforgiven, your being stupid or your exagerating.

I do admit I feel that I have to dumb things down significantly for a few of you. I thought you would be grateful.

If you find someone with a handgun they are already under arrest for concealed weapon.

If they pull the weapon out likewise they are under arrest.

Using a handgun or carrying it on you (especially with Ammunition) is already more than illegal enough.

No I disagree that it is. I think it should be far more serious a crime than it is now. Handguns and their owners a a blight on society.

You obviously don't know the rules for guns as is.

Sure I do. Inadequate and far too many holes left for the unscrupulous gun nut to victimize the nation. I want to see a stop put to that.

Your theory that you can somehow force the USA not to produce guns on the grounds that if people smuggle them into the US they are responsible for the deaths is laughable.

They can produce all the guns they want, but they must take responsibility for what they produce. I don't think that is an outrageous suggestion and you seem to think it is.
Hell a good portion of the public in the US want to see hand guns along with a number of other weapons made unavailable to the public. So it's only a matter of gathering critical mass and pushing it through Congress.

IF things work out best case scenario, then the companies would pay out a laughable amount of money to the very tiny amount of people that actually die from unlawful handgun use in Canada.

Clearly you don't know American law. Punitive is relative.

More likely they ignore you.

Yeah that is usually the case right up until they find the short a curlies are in your fist and then they are all ears and ready to get behind the mule.

And even if they do pay, they keep making guns and Automanufacture shuts down as people start suing them for every auto related death.

They just make cars safer and safer all the time. Guns are as deadly as ever. Some even more so. This is one of the reasons to bring the problem back home to their doorstep and force things. You can change or we can change you.

And lets not get into knife manufacturers (a much lower profit margin).

I'm pretty sure we all know that the people who need a gun, need one because they can't use a knife, their fists or their mind to sort out even a small problem. Knife manufacturers and car makers have little to worry about on that score.

Your plans all revolve around the idea that you can make people stop doing things by passing laws.

While it's effectiveness is often questioned, there is no confusion that creating a law that allows you to arrest and imprison those who don't agree with you. And while the right wing neocon has don't this for some time now, it's due for a turn around and we can get rid of the scumbags who don't mind at all the victimization of the population with the result of thousands upon thousands of deaths each year for the sake of a hobby.

IF that was the case, why not just make people stop murdering each other? thats also against the law.

For the most part that's exactly what happens. They are either in prison for life or killed outright. It's the people that are coaxed into murder by the ease of killing someone with a handgun. Remove the tools and you remove the ability for them to harm others. You know, just like Iraq.

Why if the focus on guns and not on murder? You'd rather spend a billion dollars trying to get rid of a gun, then a tenth of that to reduce the number of murders by a vastly greater number.

Let's not be trying to confuse the others here. Murder isn't a problem in comparison to other countries when you take guns out of the picture. Every country has a murder rate. It's when you take guns, make them small and deadly then dump them onto the market in the million and make sure that they are very very easy for anyone to get that there becomes a major problem.

What do you think that people who die from other causes should be spat upon? Why aren't their easible preventable deaths important? Why is it more important to save a handful of gun death victims than a legion of people who died from other easible preventable causes.

Heh heh, not I think that people who die due to nothing more than the fears and other hobbies of a small minority of Americans should be dealt with. Regardless of how much money is pumped into political campaigns by the Gun Lobby. Around 30,000 a year die in the US alone. While you may feel that this is but a handful of people, it's ten times the number of people that died on 9/11/01. And look how many deaths that response has caused that are considered collateral damage by Bushco. So tell me, of the two of us, who is spitting on dead people?

You haven't got a leg to stand on with this issue. The only reason handguns are around is due to a small but vocal minority of dangerous people. I feel it's time to take the whole of North America away from these pukes and allow for the peaceful freedom loving people who are in the majority to live here free from the carnage wrought by the gun nuts in North America.

First Canada and then North America!

 

[Colpy]

Ah, Unforgiven.....none of the above is even worthy of a reply, just unthinking BS.

I do notice you failed to address my post that addressed your list of nations with low handgun murders......in particular two claims:

You claim to be able to eliminate handgun murders; but the Japanese have no legal handguns, live on islands with easily controled borders, yet had 60 handgun murders.......

The Swiss are the most heavily armed society on earth.....yet you list them among those with low rates of handgun murder.......

Go for it! I'm sure I'll be amused.

 

[Zzarchov]

It's okay Colpy, you can be less vague, I've got your back on this one.;-)

It's the one thing everybody is afraid to talk about for fear of getting the racist label.

I couldn't give a crap, not talking solves nothing.

WHY DO BLACKS KILL EACH OTHER?

Well I'll erode the racist label then,

Its not blacks who are killing each other. Its mostly Jamaicans, most (but not all) of whom happen to be black. And its tied to disputes raging from the war zone that is Jamaica (between rival gang warlords)

But its not black people, as black people from other regions don't have that likelihood, and white people from Jamaica also seem to be above average in their crime rate.


@Juan:

I'm all for requiring people get licenses to carry various classes of guns, showing they are competent to use them. Much like a drivers licence. That is not the same as banning them.

 

[Unforgiven]

Well, I'll ignore your first couple of lines, as them are simply ignorant and insulting.....to say nothing of completely stupid.

Poor puss puss. You can dish it out but you can't take it eh? Typical of your sickly kind.
Facts are facts deal with it.

In 1992, handguns were NOT banned in Britain, when they were, gun murders went UP.

There are a lot of law abiding gun owners who will do their very best to try and force failure upon a set of laws that curtails their favorite hobby. So it's not surprising that the gun nuts would want to flood a country with access to guns once that country has restricted them. I guess this is what you mean by making criminals out of law abiding gun owners.

Sweden is one of the countries in the world with the highest rates of firearms ownership.

This sure isn't Sweden. And fifty years of Socialist government has made the Swedish people pretty damn responsible. Not at all like Americans or Canadians to a lesser extent.
As well in Sweden, as you've failed to mention here, they have some pretty strict gun control laws. I'm sure you would even bristle to be subject to them. You don't really see the God Bless Sweden and Guns Guts and Glory bumper stickers on the backs of the Saab zipping round the country side do you?

In Canada, less than 3% of the guns used in murder are registered.

Yeah the fall right out of the sky. Or they come from many of the unscrupulous gun shops in the US run by those ever loving law abiding gun owners who will sell Ossama bin Laden all the guns he wants if the cash is there and to hell with the paper work. That can be fixed up later should someone come snooping around. One of the many reasons why you people have to go.

Japan has no legal handguns, it is an island, how did 60 people die there?

Some gun enthusiasts up and shared their favorite hobby with 60 people. We have a problem with that here too.

And Switzerland! I love it! The Swiss have the highest rate of firearms in the home in the world. Every males between 18 and 45 years old is required to keep an automatic rifle (that's a machine gun!) in their home with 30 round magazines and 200 rounds of ammunition. Handgun ownership is ENCOURAGED! Every little town has a shooting range. Not that long ago, Swiss citizens were required to demonstrate their proficientcy with their weapons before they were allowed to VOTE, as keeping arms and being capable with them for the common defense was considered the primary responsibility of citizenship.

Uh yes the Swiss. Aren't they a lovely group. Rosie cheeked maidens carrying buckets of milk to make into some fine milk chocolate. Alpine fields and textbook telemark landings on the sun drenched slopes of the Alps. And let's not forget those wonderful Saint Bernards, cask of life saving run tucked under their photoshopped chops hunting for stranded hikers who have lost their way. Oh yeah, and profiteers of the Nazi war crimes and the one who started it all when it comes to hiding money from foreign governments.

One thing I will say for the Swiss is that they don't give up their guns easily. Unlike Americans and Canadians to some extent, you actually have to pry the gun out of their cold dead hands instead of simply breaking into their car or breaking a window and reaching in to the improperly stored pile-O- guns and picking out a nice one.

Yes it's truly a dream nation the Swiss.
Yep, we could learn a lot from the Swiss.

Feel free and go with my blessing!
http://www.swiss.com/web/EN/Pages/index.aspx?Country=CA

Thanks, BTW, for once again demonstrating two things:
1. Culture, NOT the presense of inanimate objects, is the major cause of murder.
2. You don't have a clue what you are talking about.

Yeah the gun culture is the problem. That what I want to see gone.
Actually I think you don't have a clue. When it comes to anything, you seem most likely to quickly take evasive action, jam that lumpy noggin of yours straight into the sand and start shooting blanks in hopes that you will drown out reason before it pushes out that little bit of information you keep in your head.

But also I would like to thank you for demonstrating the need for choosing up a side and getting down to business. The sooner you and your gun nut friends are gone, the better for the rest of us.

 

[Unforgiven]

Ah, Unforgiven.....none of the above is even worthy of a reply, just unthinking BS.

I do notice you failed to address my post that addressed your list of nations with low handgun murders......in particular two claims:

You claim to be able to eliminate handgun murders; but the Japanese have no legal handguns, live on islands with easily controled borders, yet had 60 handgun murders.......

The Swiss are the most heavily armed society on earth.....yet you list them among those with low rates of handgun murder.......

Go for it! I'm sure I'll be amused.

Yet here you are running your mouth. Heh heh

As usual you, shoot your load a little too early. Yes I am sorry that it's problematic for you to consider that your crusty arse isn't the only one posting in this thread. So as it is, squeeze yer pecker and wait yer turn.

But since you're here and bent over like this, please explain why it is that, much like the US, sometimes people just go nuts with their guns and start killing multiple victims in shooting sprees? Not to mention that it's not impossible for people with a violent history, numerous feloney convictions and like many American gun owners, simply ****ing bonkers to go and buy alsorts of guns?

And the thing about the Swiss I noticed is that while they just love to shoot their guns, they aren't too keen on shooting at something that shoots back. I guess that explains the whole neurtal position during any conflict eh? Typical chicken **** gun owners.

 

[Unforgiven]

Well I'll erode the racist label then,

Its not blacks who are killing each other. Its mostly Jamaicans, most (but not all) of whom happen to be black. And its tied to disputes raging from the war zone that is Jamaica (between rival gang warlords)

But its not black people, as black people from other regions don't have that likelihood, and white people from Jamaica also seem to be above average in their crime rate.


@Juan:

I'm all for requiring people get licenses to carry various classes of guns, showing they are competent to use them. Much like a drivers licence. That is not the same as banning them.

Yeah like school shootings. Them are jus coloureds passing as whitey. :roll:

 

[Zzarchov]

Unforgiven, are you being a troll?

You think all the guns in Britain came from legal owners, who voluntarily just gave away their guns?

Wrong. They were made in Britain in secret mob factories. They raided one not too long ago.

No different than how pot gets to Island nations where its illegal, grow ops. Organized crime isn't going to give up guns because they can't buy them legally (they didn't before anyways).

They just make them. Guns aren't that hard to make, I can make one in your average garage machine shop.

In much of the developing world assault rifles are made in tents with basic hand tools.


Add to that in Canada, you don't need "gun nuts" switching guns around. You need someone putting a few in the back of a car and driving across the border.


Tell you what, tell me how you plan to use the law to keep other dangerous banned susbtances out of Canada, like Cocaine and Heroin, and then we'll just use that method once its been shown you can keep those from being available on every street corner.


fyi: Sweden does have alot of gun ownership, and a very large problem with Neo-Nazi's. 50 years of socialism doesn't mean the people are hippies, nor that socialists don't like guns.

I am by and large a pragmatic socialist (with a strong libertarian streak), and I would not support any politician calling for a ban on guns. Thats a rural vs urban issue and rural people tend to be socialists if left to their own devices (thats where the ndp started, rural canada)

 

[Zzarchov]

Are you serious unforgiven? You must be trolling.

Racist remarks, frothing baseless diatribe, media talking points with no basis in reality?

You know in Japan they have gun rampages, and more importantly (where psychos are successfully kept from going on rampages, kudos in that cases) they just use poison gas instead.

Yep, much better to have someone unleash poison gas into a subway that fire two bullets before getting tackled.

Guns do not encourage murder. Murderous people cause murder.

The swiss have shown that owning guns does not make you violent. The Japanese have shown to not owning guns does not make you less violent.

Guns are an inanimate object.


What you really need to do is understand that other people are not genetically inferior to you.

Just as you aren't going to go nuts and kill everyone because someone shows you a gun, also means that no one else is going to go nuts and kill everyone because you show them a gun.

Some people are nuts, and giving them a gun would be stupid. It would also be stupid to give them a car, knife, household cleaners to make poison gas , or common gardening supplies to make bombs.

The issue is the crazy people and how to deal with them, not making them use one method of mass murder instead of another.

School bombings are Subway Poison Gas attacks are not better than shootings. The problem is the attack, not the method.

 

[anonymus]

My Daddy told me once, when I commented on the cheap lock he was putting on our cabin;locks are to keep honest people honest, no lock here will keep a crook out but that cheap lock is so it can be easily broken by someone needing shelter, such a person will not steal anything. Cary that way of thinking to guns and you will soon realize that no matter what ban you put on anything, man's ingenuity will find a way around it, even kids. What needs to be done, just comes down to raising your kids with proper social values. See: I didn't say; "Guns don't kill people, people do"

 

[Colpy]

As I mentioned, open season. Handgun owners are supposed to be registered right now along with the weapons they have so taking those away shouldn't be too difficult, one way or the other. Then, simply seeing the gun is justification to blow their heads clean off.

Now here's a guy that believes in rule of law! (sarcasm alert)

You'd be happier in Stalinist Russia.

Here people are not allowed to be judge jury and executioner.

 

[Colpy]

Yeah like school shootings. Them are jus coloureds passing as whitey. :roll:

That idiot at Dawson College fired 72 rounds out of Berretta......a small, short-barreled, semi-auto carbine that fires the 9mm round, and is classified in Canada to be a handgun: a restricted weapon.

The person he killed was shot 10 times.

He also had a 12 ga. shotgun. Had he not had access to the sexy Beretta, he would have used the tool every Canadian duck hunter has in his closet...........

According to the FBI reports, approx. 90% of shotgun wounds are fatal. Good o. Take the pop-guns away, let'em use real weapons.

As for no guns stopping school killings, a guy in Ireland way back went into a school with a home-made flame-thrower. He burned to death 16 kids.

A guy in Africa got pissed at his school.....he barred the exits, threw around gasoline and a match, and killed 56.

And a number of school shootings in the USA have been stopped by armed citizens......

 

[Colpy]

Yet here you are running your mouth. Heh heh

As usual you, shoot your load a little too early. Yes I am sorry that it's problematic for you to consider that your crusty arse isn't the only one posting in this thread. So as it is, squeeze yer pecker and wait yer turn.

But since you're here and bent over like this, please explain why it is that, much like the US, sometimes people just go nuts with their guns and start killing multiple victims in shooting sprees? Not to mention that it's not impossible for people with a violent history, numerous feloney convictions and like many American gun owners, simply ****ing bonkers to go and buy alsorts of guns?

And the thing about the Swiss I noticed is that while they just love to shoot their guns, they aren't too keen on shooting at something that shoots back. I guess that explains the whole neurtal position during any conflict eh? Typical chicken **** gun owners.

Anyone can get guns. Look at Japan, as you so nicely pointed out....and Jamaica.......and Russia. Both the last two have very strict gun control......and some of the highest murder rates on earth......with guns.

Murder is a cultural phenomenon.

And the Swiss? The other benefit of being a heavily armed society is that no one DARES invade......Twice in the last 100 years the Swiss have been an island of peace in an ocean of war. The last time anyone dared cross the border of Switzerland with a military force was 200 years ago........when Napolean Bonaparte passed through on his way to Italy.

Name me another nation with 200 years of peace.......

BTW....you should really learn something before you spout off.....for hundreds of years the most valued soldiers in Europe were Swiss mercenaries..........the last vestiges of that tradition of exported Swiss militarism is the Swiss Guard at the Vatican.

It is everybody else that doesn't dare take on the Swiss!

BTW, I was amused. Pretty pathetic response...let me tell ya. You aren't even a good troll.

Keep it up, I love shining rays of enlightenment through the fog of your ignorance.......