Global Warming ‘Greatest Scam in History’

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Praxius

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Global warming is a different beast.

Indeed.. it was made up :p but anywho....

The mean in the 8 year trends of this graph is close to the long term trend at 0.19 degrees a decade. The standard deviation is almost as large, meaning that short term changes would need to be way out of the running trend to be outside the norm that is global warming.

Unfortunatly no.... if you go back several pages, you'll find graphs going back a couple of hundred years and we're right on schedule.... one second...


Ah there we go. Couldn't find it in previous pages, but this will do. As you can see, we're still a ways to go before we can cry like the Romans.

http://muller.lbl.gov/pages/IceAgeBook/Chapter 1 html old
^Source with logical explination of the older temps.
 

Tonington

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Tonington, "...short term changes would need to be way out of the running trend to be outside the norm that is global warming."

Do you mean that global warming is difficult to observe? That by the time it is observable it will be far advanced? That comparing historical weather and climate data is virtually a waste of time for our generation?

No, I'm saying any of those eight year trends would need to go up to 0.5 C or greater or down to-0.2 C or lower to be anything other than noise in the climate system.

It becomes more obvious when you increase the trend to 15 years.


The spatial and temporal aspects mean that as you increase trends to longer or even larger area, the data becomes more robust. It's the same thing if you have one day of extreme warming or cooling in Toronto. While most Canadians live there, that doesn't mean anything has changed in Canadian climate trends, only a new record for the pages.
 

Walter

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Top Ten Science Based Predictions that didn’t come true.

17 01 2008

There’s an article in the New York Times pushing a something called “the five stages of climate grief” done by a professor at the University of Montana. This got me to thinking about the regular disaster forecasting that we see published in the media about what will happen due to climate change.
We’ve seen this sort of angst broadcast before, and it occurred to me that through history, a lot of ”predictions of certainty” with roots in scientifically based forecasts have not come true. That being the case, here is the list I’ve compiled of famous quotes and consensus from “experts”.
Top Ten Science based predictions that didn’t come true:

10. “The earth’s crust does not move”- 19th through early 20th century accepted geological science. See Plate Tectonics
9. “The bomb will never go off. I speak as an expert in explosives.” — Admiral William Leahy, U.S. Atomic Bomb Project
8. “That virus is a pussycat.” — Dr. Peter Duesberg, molecular-biology professor at U.C. Berkeley, on HIV, 1988
7. “I think there is a world market for maybe five computers.” — Thomas Watson, chairman of IBM, 1943
6. “Radio has no future. Heavier-than-air flying machines are impossible. X-rays will prove to be a hoax.” — William Thomson, Lord Kelvin, British scientist, 1899.
5. “There is not the slightest indication that nuclear energy will ever be obtainable. It would mean that the atom would have to be shattered at will.” — Albert Einstein, 1932
4. “Space travel is bunk.” — Sir Harold Spencer Jones, Astronomer Royal of the UK, 1957 (two weeks later Sputnik orbited the Earth).
3. “If I had thought about it, I wouldn’t have done the experiment. The literature was full of examples that said you can’t do this.” — Spencer Silver on the work that led to the unique adhesives for 3-M “Post-It” Notepads.
2. “Stomach ulcers are caused by stress” — accepted medical diagnosis, until Dr. Marshall proved that H. pylori caused gastric inflammation by deliberately infecting himself with the bacterium.
1. “Telltale signs are everywhere —from the unexpected persistence and thickness of pack ice in the waters around Iceland to the southward migration of a warmth-loving creature like the armadillo from the Midwest. Since the 1940s the mean global temperature has dropped about 2.7° F.” — Climatologist George J. Kukla of Columbia University in Time Magazine’s June 24th, 1975 article Another Ice Age?
So the next time you hear about worldwide crop failure, rising sea levels, species extinction, or “climate grief” you might want to remember that just being an expert, or even having a consensus of experts, doesn’t necessarily mean that a claim is true.
 

darkbeaver

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Jan 26, 2006
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http://www.sott.net/articles/show/145399-Majesterium-and-the-Tipping-Point


Global warming is in fact one of the greatest covers for the "Greatest Scam in History"



Majesterium and the Tipping Point RH

Sott.net
Fri, 14 Dec 2007 11:17 EST
"Time passes, but they're always five to seven years from the bomb." -- Shlomo Brom, Israel's deputy national security adviser under former Prime Minister Ehud Barak


Angel by William Blake
As Israeli politicians continue to beat the war-drums over what they (now alone) claim to be an imminent threat from a nuclear-capable Iran, very similar hysterical rhetoric is being used in the attempt to convince us of a very different if equally catastrophic threat to life on earth - "climate change". The doomsayers tell us we have ten years, at most, to reverse the inevitable destruction or face the dire consequences of cities under water, earthquakes, tsunamis and the dreaded, if not racist, tropical diseases moving north. While researching this article I came across a blog that made a very salient point:
Quite apart from the science, one thing I find suspicious about climate catastrophism is how there's supposed to be this massive and terribly deleterious change ahead of us, and yet (by what strikes me as an amazing coincidence) we are always said to still be capable of stopping it but only -- and here the speaker invariably assumes the urgent air of an infomercial voice-over -- if we act right this very minute. This is strange, given that we're dealing with what (on the catastrophist account) seems to be a slippery-slope doomsday scenario that has been building up since the Industrial Revolution. Given the long time-frame and massive uncertainties involved, you'd think that predictions of the exact timing of the "point of no return" must involve a fairly significant margin of error. In light of that, it's odd that there doesn't seem to be even one climate-change affirmer out there who's saying "Rats! I hate to tell you this guys, but it's one or two (or ten or fifty) years too late and there's basically nothing we can do now." Perhaps adding: "So we might as well just go out in style -- let's everyone head out to the SUV dealership!" Or "Let's get 10,000 of our best friends together and jet over to Bali for a big wingding!"
On the other hand, there are thousands of them who seem to think we're just a few years away from this point of no return...
And that's it: We're always a few years away from the point of no return, whether it's Iran, climate, or some other "catastrophic" event we must act now before it is too late. What if Iran already has the bomb? What if we're already past the point of no return? What will you do, what will They do then?
Which brings me to this curious article:
One thing Microsoft founder Bill Gates can't be accused of is sloth. He was already programming at 14, founded Microsoft at age 20 while still a student at Harvard. By 1995 he had been listed by Forbes as the world's richest man from being the largest shareholder in Microsoft, a company which his relentless drive built into a de facto monopoly in software systems for personal computers.
In 2006 when most people in such a situation might think of retiring to a quiet Pacific island, Bill Gates decided to devote his energies to his Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, the world's largest 'transparent' private foundation as it says, with a whopping $34.6 billion endowment and a legal necessity to spend $1.5 billion a year on charitable projects around the world to maintain its tax free charitable status. A gift from friend and business associate, mega-investor Warren Buffett in 2006, of some $30 billion worth of shares in Buffet's Berkshire Hathaway put the Gates' foundation into the league where it spends almost the amount of the entire annual budget of the United Nations' World Health Organization.
So when Bill Gates decides through the Gates Foundation to invest some $30 million of their hard earned money in a project, it is worth looking at.
No project is more interesting at the moment than a curious project in one of the world's most remote spots, Svalbard. Bill Gates is investing millions in a seed bank on the Barents Sea near the Arctic Ocean, some 1,100 kilometers from the North Pole. Svalbard is a barren piece of rock claimed by Norway and ceded in 1925 by international treaty (see map).



http://http://www.sott.net/articles/show/145399-Majesterium-and-the-Tipping-Point

The article incorporates a lot of science and history in support of an inclusive explanation that properly considers many contributing factors none of which studied in isolation provide usable solutions. Essentially both sides in the debate in this thread are right and wrong at the same time. hahahahahahahaha:lol:
 

Walter

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Global warming protest frosted with snow


It snowed, but they still came. A heavy snowfall blanketed a global warming protest outside the State House in Annapolis this morning, but it did not dampen the shouts of about 400 activists who urged lawmakers to pass the nation's toughest greenhouse gas control law.
 

Tonington

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Ahhh. Invariably, the same old tired irrelevant points comes out with each change in seasons, although it's not in this snip job. Check out the graphs Walter on the top of this page and the last post of the last page. Weather is variable, very variable. I'll post the graphs here again in case you skipped over. Watch what happens as the time scales for trend get longer.







Don't listen to the fools that say, one cold week is proof that global warming is crap. Don't listen to the fools that say one week of warm temperatures is proof of accelerated warming.
 

jimshort19

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Well Walter, if the advent of snow on a winter's day doesn't prove that global warming is a political conspiracy to prevent us from using our new Cadillac SUVs, what is? Ice the tree-hugging losers!

You're getting so desperate I can hear you giggling.

According to Torrington, climate cannot be predicted by weather, not on a day and not in a lifetime. But you know dat. As the world's most annoying beaver says, hahahahaha!
 
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Tonington

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Not according to Tonington, according to multiple studies of climate and statistics. ;)
 

EagleSmack

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Russians Brace For The Big Chill
January 16, 2008 8:18 p.m. EST

Jupiter Kalambakal - AHN News Writer
Moscow, Russia (AHN) - Russians are bracing for temperatures of as low as minus 55 degrees Celsius (minus 67 degrees Fahrenheit) in Siberia as Russia's emergencies ministry warns on Wednesday of its impending dangers in the coming weeks.
Government agencies were placed on high alert, reports AFP. The ministry ordered local administration officials to prepare for the extreme chill expected to last until Jan. 21.
The ministry warned that the unusually cold weather could kill, cause frost-bite, conk heaters and cut electricity to homes, disrupt transport, increase the rate of car accidents and even destroy buildings across Siberia.
The freezing temperatures have already caused overloading of electricity grids and power interruptions in the regions of Irkutsk and Tomsk because of overused heaters in homes. Two people have already died and more than 30 others hospitalized with forst-bite in Irkutsk, reports AFP citing state media.
Bloomberg reports that worst hit will be the Siberian region of Evenkiya, while neighbor Georgia, whose climate is subtropical, already plunged to as low as minus 35 degrees Celsius. Lake Paliastomi in the western Georgia froze for the first time in 50 years, reports Rustavi-2 television.
Average temperatures in large Siberian cities in January usually range between minus 15 degrees Celsius and minus 39 degrees Celsius, according to data from weatherbase.com. Schools have been closed down in at least four regions because of the cold.


I am sorry I just need to see more graphs with squiggly lines.
 

Walter

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Ahhh. Invariably, the same old tired irrelevant points comes out with each change in seasons, although it's not in this snip job. Check out the graphs Walter on the top of this page and the last post of the last page. Weather is variable, very variable. I'll post the graphs here again in case you skipped over. Watch what happens as the time scales for trend get longer.
There are lies; then there are damned lies; then there are statistics.
 

Tonington

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There are lies; then there are damned lies; then there are statistics.

There are posts, cut and paste posts, and cheap posts.

What's your beef with statistics? Do you invest money, do you listen to financial advisers? Do you enjoy beer?

Seriously, you can't be so dense to be incapable of understanding why one week of weather in an area less than 0.1% of the planet means jack to a global climate.:-?
 

Tonington

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Well, sorry I don't meet your standards for levity.

I may have laughed the first couple times I heard somebody say that, because it can be accurate. Instead he just flippantly makes an off-cuff comment, yet again. Surprised he didn't cut and paste that from Twain. Weather is variable, ask him how often he trusts the weather forecast.

Can't blame him for trying to get my goat anyways. He can't keep up with this thoroughbred:p
 

Walter

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Stats not so hot after all

Taking the Earth's temperature is not an exact science -- results likely to vary

By LORRIE GOLDSTEIN
Since the debate over man-made global warming is "over" and a "consensus" has been achieved, how hot was last year anyway?
Here's what three of the world's leading agencies monitoring climate change say.
NASA's Goddard Institute for Space Studies, headed by James Hansen who is an advisor to Al Gore, says 2007 was the second warmest year on record.
Meanwhile, the U.S. National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration says it was the fifth warmest.
And Britain's Meteorological Office (the MET), which does its analysis in conjunction with the University of East Anglia, and which at the start of the year predicted 2007 would likely be the warmest on record, says it was the seventh warmest.
NASA says 2005 is the warmest year on record and 2007 tied for second with 1998.
The MET says 1998 is the warmest year on record and 2007, in terms of warming trends, isn't statistically different from any year going back to 2001.
In August, NASA grudgingly rejigged its ranking for the hottest years in the U.S. after Canadian blogger Steve McIntyre (www.climateaudit.org), pointed out a calculating error. That resulted in 1934 nudging out 1998 as the hottest year on record in the U.S., although NASA says the change is statistically insignificant.
What it all means is that taking the Earth's temperature is not an exact science. It's also a relatively new science, going back no more than 150 years on a 4.5 billion-year-old planet.
Best then to take each new prediction or claim that one year or another was the hottest, or hotter, or less hot, with a grain of salt.
As Hansen himself writes: "Ranking relative to other years is likely to vary among results of different groups that make global temperature analyses, because of differences in data sources, methods of combining data sets, and areas included in the averaging."
The MET notes where, how and when observations are made influence the data, as well as what instruments are used -- everything from satellites to ground stations --and how averages are calculated.
NASA, the NOAA and the MET agree the Earth has been steadily warming in recent decades, that the most recent decade contains the hottest years on record, that it is very likely man-made global warming is driving climate change and that the Earth is responding to these changes. But even here, a caution.
As NOAA spokesman Scott Smullen recently told the Washington Post: "Most of the observed increase in global average temperatures in the last 50 years is very likely due to increased human-induced greenhouse gas concentrations, but we cannot yet discern warming trends in the last 10 years with the same resolution."
Award-winning BBC science journalist David Whitehouse, a doctorate in astrophysics and author of The Sun: A Biography, goes further.
Writing in the New Statesman last month in an article entitled "Has Global Warming Stopped?" he asserts:
"The fact is that the global temperature of 2007 is statistically the same as 2006 as well as every year since 2001. Global warming has, temporarily or permanently, ceased. Temperatures across the world are not increasing as they should according to the fundamental theory behind global warming -- the greenhouse effect. Something else is happening and it is vital that we find out what or else we may spend hundreds of billions of pounds needlessly."
This is a minority view in the scientific community, which argues such phenomena as ocean and aerosol cooling explain recent minor temperature variations.
Even so, it's wise to heed Whitehouse's closing warning:
"I have heard it said, by scientists, journalists and politicians, that the time for argument is over and that further scientific debate only causes delay in action. But the wish to know exactly what is going on is independent of politics and scientists must never bend their desire for knowledge to any political cause, however noble. The science is fascinating, the ramifications profound, but we are fools if we think we have a sufficient understanding of ... the Earth's atmosphere's interaction with sunlight ... We know far less than many think we do or would like you to think we do."
 

jimshort19

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That's putting things straightly Walter. And NASA mothballed DSCOVER, perhaps the single most valuable asset in sorting this thing out. As long as politicians put the blinders on the scientists, we'll all be groping in the dark.
 

jimshort19

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Wikipedia, "...forecasts become less accurate as the difference in time between the present moment and the time for which the forecast is being made..."

Time? A two day forecast is a good bet, but a two week forecast is nothing to bet the farm on. Weather forecasting is utterly useless, as is weather data, for predicting climate change. When are we going to have something better? It is virtually unconscionable that anyone should propose that the Chinese and the Indians and the third world should join Canada in lip service to Kyoto when we refuse to do the science neccessary to determine our predicament, and have broken faith with our treaty partners. Who can worry about global warming when we refuse to make space based observations that would give is vastly superior data?

Why should I take personal action on global warming when it is clear that we have abrogated not just Kyoto but science itself as well? I'll take this thing seriously when the scientific effort is not sabotaged by government.

Right now, first things first, and the more immediate concern is what happened to the DSCVR satellite, that is, what has happened to the unwritten separation of science and state? Mind and state? Which is worse, censorship of naughty pictures and words, or censorship of science? Obstruction of scientific inquiry is a greater global threat than obstruction of justice. Somebody aught to be going to jail, if we have rights that Galileo did not have.
 

Tonington

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That article, wherever it came from, is unmitigated crap. If a journalist is going to write about science, they should at least have some idea of how it works...
 

jimshort19

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Goldstein, "But the wish to know exactly what is going on is independent of politics and scientists must never bend their desire for knowledge to any political cause, however noble."

Tonington, what kind of unmitigated crap is that? Notwithstanding that she may not be a climatologist, she's right on the money as far as I can see. But she fails to promote the science and she embarrasses a position that you have already rejected, that the weather we see predicts climate change, by dumping a pile of unmitigated crap which has been used already to support both 'sides' of the issue, weather data.
 

Tonington

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Tonington, what kind of unmitigated crap is that?

First off, the article starts with a red herring. The science is not settled, the political debate is not settled, therefore how can the notion of man-made global warming be settled. Maybe talking media heads say that, sensationalize things. Editorializing takes place in the mainstream media, not scientific journals.The scientists who work on this, from their different backgrounds and academic institutions all have different opinions, you can see that by reading any publication, and reading any of the refereed comments that go into the peer-review process.

That the three large bodies who make these calculations have different rankings for the years goes right back to those graphs I posted earlier. They each have different models with different assumptions, different methods of gathering empirical measurement, and thus they will have different results.

As the article is framed, the author guides readers that this is indicative of a failed notion of man-made climate change, which is laughable. Scientists don't discuss results without error bars, and these error bars come about because of those different assumptions and methodology that I mentioned earlier.

What all of these different bodies do agree on, is that carbon dioxide is a greenhouse gas, that aerosols are cooling gases, that less ice cover heats the ocean, that a heating ocean changes heat fluxes, and on and on. The fundamental physics are no different in any of these reports. What is different, is what I explained already, and that is precisely why the science is not settled, why they still produce studies delving deeper into the unknowns, such as cloud feedbacks. Or how they extend coverage over the polar regions.

So while individual rankings of years are different, when you look at their long term running trends, they all say the same thing, the trend is a warming trend.

The last fellow, says that because of the last seven years, global warming has stopped, or permanently ceased? That's ludicrous.

Sure, there are some nice platitudes in the article, but it is framed incorrectly, and gives a misleading view of what these things actually mean.
 

Walter

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First off, the article starts with a red herring. The science is not settled, the political debate is not settled, therefore how can the notion of man-made global warming be settled.
Then why does Skuzuki keep saying that the science is settled, as he did when interviewed on the John Oakley show on 640 AM radio in Toronto?
 
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