Which means the majority of Palestinians are party to their crimes, their policy of genocide, their refusal to recognize Israel, their attacks.
So maybe you guys should stop whining about civilian deaths in Gaza, huh?
British MP banned from entering Canada
- Thread starter earth_as_one
- Start date
Which means the majority of Palestinians are party to their crimes, their policy of genocide, their refusal to recognize Israel, their attacks.
So maybe you guys should stop whining about civilian deaths in Gaza, huh?
Pretty well ALL M.P.s would be banned from entering other countries, if it weren't for the fact they are M.P.s- ordinary citizens who act like M.P.s would never get a passport.
Galloway has been criticizing neo-conservative foreign policy for years. If that was a crime, he'd have been blocked from entering Canada a long time ago. What's changed is that Galloway is also guilty of delivering food, medicine and toys to Gaza, just like Oxfam, the Red Cross and Santa Claus.
The Harper conservatives have given Golloway a soapbox.
The Harper conservatives have given Golloway a soapbox.
According to the Jewish Defense League, they are looking at anyone or any organization related to Galloway's planned trip to Canada.
Here is an little of what's in store:
YouTube - Canada ban: Galloway faces his accusers a Jewish Defence League (JDL) "Terrorist"
Here is an little of what's in store:
YouTube - Canada ban: Galloway faces his accusers a Jewish Defence League (JDL) "Terrorist"
Ok all you Israeli loving individuals...
I just reviewed this list. Canada's terrorist entity list...
I have read and concur with the descriptions of activities. Applied to each organization. Those I did not know, I googled and read more about, then the Gov't listed.
What I want to know is, should Canada allow representatives of these groups ie, financial backers, fundraisers or advocates of these groups to enter Canada?
I'm not talking about someone that speaks on their behalf. Not anyone or any entity that would rail for their right to exist or petition the Gov't to have them removed from the this list.
I'm talking about, openly financing, supporting the criminal acts of, or otherwise perpetuating violence created by these groups.
Now before the half wits start throwing out "Shrub" or any other US or Canadian politician. Try and be rational if you can.
In Galloway's case, he didn't just express his support for Hamas. Beyond offering financial aid to them. He has actually expressed appreciation for the violence they have caused. In calling act of murder in the act of 'suicide bombings' by Hamas "Military Heroism".
I hate to break the news to all you left wing-nuts. That's supporting and perpetuating violence.
Under the free speech laws of most democratic Nations, that is a violation of law. And rightly so.
If you wish to stand on your soap box, and call Israel a puddle of mud people, not worthy of our spittle. And demand the UN to take action, or demand that our respective nations deam them a terrorist nation. By all means.
But when you breach that boundary between critical disent and support acts of violence. You cease to be simply exercising your right to free speech, and are now acting as an agent of crimial activities.
No amount of your simple minded accusations of "Jackbooted Neo Con" and irrationalities about stifling free speech, will change the simple fact. That under a democracy, words can be used to mold and change things in a very positive and enlightened way. In fact, I believe as do many others of my ilk. That free speech is the corner stone to democracy and without it, you have nothing. For nothing and no one is accountable, if there is no voice among the people to show discord among the masses. With this belief, I must swallow the right of groups like NAMBLA and people who call my brothers in arms "Baby killers". To speak and promote their phylosophy. And I would defend that right on to my death. But I will not and can not support those that would use the gift of free speech to promote hatred and violence.
To congradualate, perpetuate, promote or condone violence of the most cowardly kind. Is not free speech. It is hatred.
If an Israeli were to stand up and call to all of Israel to rise up and drive the Arabs into the ocean and hold fast until the bubble stopped rising. That would be hate speech. It's a call to mass mureder. And you wouldn't stand for it either, period.
But if one of your darlings condones, champions, perpetuates and/or applaudes suicide bombings, he's exercising his right to free speech? BS...
If you do, you are not only the real "Jackbooted thugs" here, but the very same type of people that promoted and afforded the rise of people like Adolf Hitler. By being blind to rational and critical thought and taking leave of your senses to allow a party line mentality to do your thinking for you. Pathetic.
Just pathetic.
I just reviewed this list. Canada's terrorist entity list...
Link
I have read and concur with the descriptions of activities. Applied to each organization. Those I did not know, I googled and read more about, then the Gov't listed.
What I want to know is, should Canada allow representatives of these groups ie, financial backers, fundraisers or advocates of these groups to enter Canada?
I'm not talking about someone that speaks on their behalf. Not anyone or any entity that would rail for their right to exist or petition the Gov't to have them removed from the this list.
I'm talking about, openly financing, supporting the criminal acts of, or otherwise perpetuating violence created by these groups.
Now before the half wits start throwing out "Shrub" or any other US or Canadian politician. Try and be rational if you can.
In Galloway's case, he didn't just express his support for Hamas. Beyond offering financial aid to them. He has actually expressed appreciation for the violence they have caused. In calling act of murder in the act of 'suicide bombings' by Hamas "Military Heroism".
I hate to break the news to all you left wing-nuts. That's supporting and perpetuating violence.
Under the free speech laws of most democratic Nations, that is a violation of law. And rightly so.
If you wish to stand on your soap box, and call Israel a puddle of mud people, not worthy of our spittle. And demand the UN to take action, or demand that our respective nations deam them a terrorist nation. By all means.
But when you breach that boundary between critical disent and support acts of violence. You cease to be simply exercising your right to free speech, and are now acting as an agent of crimial activities.
No amount of your simple minded accusations of "Jackbooted Neo Con" and irrationalities about stifling free speech, will change the simple fact. That under a democracy, words can be used to mold and change things in a very positive and enlightened way. In fact, I believe as do many others of my ilk. That free speech is the corner stone to democracy and without it, you have nothing. For nothing and no one is accountable, if there is no voice among the people to show discord among the masses. With this belief, I must swallow the right of groups like NAMBLA and people who call my brothers in arms "Baby killers". To speak and promote their phylosophy. And I would defend that right on to my death. But I will not and can not support those that would use the gift of free speech to promote hatred and violence.
To congradualate, perpetuate, promote or condone violence of the most cowardly kind. Is not free speech. It is hatred.
If an Israeli were to stand up and call to all of Israel to rise up and drive the Arabs into the ocean and hold fast until the bubble stopped rising. That would be hate speech. It's a call to mass mureder. And you wouldn't stand for it either, period.
But if one of your darlings condones, champions, perpetuates and/or applaudes suicide bombings, he's exercising his right to free speech? BS...
If you do, you are not only the real "Jackbooted thugs" here, but the very same type of people that promoted and afforded the rise of people like Adolf Hitler. By being blind to rational and critical thought and taking leave of your senses to allow a party line mentality to do your thinking for you. Pathetic.
Just pathetic.
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Look....this is really quite simple. A law to keep "terrorist enablers" out of the country has been used (abused in my opinion) to keep Galloway out. It seems like the Likudniks and the neocons are only too ready to use (abuse) any law on the books to prevent people they disagree with from speaking to Canadians about Israeli abuses. Come and take my property and settle your family on my land and I will react, probably violently. Am I a "terrorist"? Or am I simply fighting back using any and all methods that I can?
It's ironic that the "right" so often accuses the "left" of wanting to control free speech when they want to criticize Islam but are the first to try to stifle any criticism of Israel, even to the point of abusing the intent of a law. Of course this goes hand in hand with them playing the much overused "anti Semite" card to try and stifle criticism of Israeli policy. Of course there are anti Semites but the continual "crying wolf" has blurred the line between the real "Jew haters" and those that simply want justice in the Middle East to the detriment of the effectiveness of the term.
I will bet that no court in the land would uphold this ban (assuming that Galloway follows through with his threat to appeal to the courts).
It's ironic that the "right" so often accuses the "left" of wanting to control free speech when they want to criticize Islam but are the first to try to stifle any criticism of Israel, even to the point of abusing the intent of a law. Of course this goes hand in hand with them playing the much overused "anti Semite" card to try and stifle criticism of Israeli policy. Of course there are anti Semites but the continual "crying wolf" has blurred the line between the real "Jew haters" and those that simply want justice in the Middle East to the detriment of the effectiveness of the term.
I will bet that no court in the land would uphold this ban (assuming that Galloway follows through with his threat to appeal to the courts).
No court will overturn the ban, simply because we are under NO obligation to let ANY non-citizen enter the country.......full stop. Which has been the essence of my argument from the first.
Personally, I don't much care if he gets in........but he won't....unless the gov't changes their mind, or unless the next bureaucrat he tries to get by has a more liberal outlook.
Were I the official......I wouldn't have stopped him.
Neither would I overturn the decision ofb the person that did stop him.
And I love this! "Come and take my property and settle your family on my land and I will react, probably violently. Am I a "terrorist"? Or am I simply fighting back using any and all methods that I can?"
You don't even realize, like most people, that 800,000 Jews were evicted from Arab countries after 1948, that their property was usually seized, that they were forced to flee.........that, in reality, what has happened with refugees in the ME in the last 60 years has been simply an exchange of population.
EXCEPT
Israel aided and absorbed Jewish refugees.
The Arabs abandoned Islamic refugees.
Guess what? The ARABS are the ones most responsible for the "refugee problem".
"You don't even realize, like most people, that 800,000 Jews were evicted from Arab countries after 1948, that their property was usually seized, that they were forced to flee.........that, in reality, what has happened with refugees in the ME in the last 60 years has been simply an exchange of population."
I am fully aware of the unjust eviction of thousands of Jews from Arab countries! Was it just? Would they have been justified in guerilla warefare to resist? You have just made my case. To coin a phrase....two wrongs do not make a right.
"Guess what? The ARABS are the ones most responsible for the "refugee problem"."
Now that has to qualify as the silliest statement here and is really trolling. Furthermore it's not even worthy of a response:angry3:
I am fully aware of the unjust eviction of thousands of Jews from Arab countries! Was it just? Would they have been justified in guerilla warefare to resist? You have just made my case. To coin a phrase....two wrongs do not make a right.
"Guess what? The ARABS are the ones most responsible for the "refugee problem"."
Now that has to qualify as the silliest statement here and is really trolling. Furthermore it's not even worthy of a response:angry3:
No the eviction of Jews was not just. Yes they would have been justified in fighting.
No the eviction of Palestinians was not just. Yes, they would have been justified, in many cases in fighting.......but are second and third generations justified?????
Who are NOT justified are the Arab nations that abandoned them, that have prefered to send them guns and missiles and explosive belts and Jew-hating educational materials amd who speak of their "great struggle" and martyrdom.......instead of offering them food, medicine, succor.........brotherhood, and citizenship. It is SO much more convenient to exploit them as a club with which to beat Israel.
It is not trolling at all: the West Bank is Jordanian territory. The Gaza Strip is Egyptian territory, the Israelis would be THRILLED to return either one.
But the Jordanians are well aware of the.......tendencies of Palestinian refugees. King Hussein threw out the PLO in the early 70s, and he did so violently and effectively, as they were a threat to his kingdom.......off they went to the then-idyllic country of Lebanon.
We all know how THAT turned out.
As for Gaza......guess who seals the borders? To their OWN territory? Egypt, in concert with Israel. Why? Because they, like the Jordanians, have no use for the PLO, Hamas, Islamic Jihad, or any of the rest of the homicidal loonies that ran rampant through the PA.
As for Israel.......they have tried to hand over territory to the Palestinians. They unilaterally abandoned Gaza, forcibly taking their settlers with them, and making it clear that if that action was a success......the same would follow in The West Bank. But the Palestinians once again snatched defeat from the jaws of victory......and turned Gaza into an assembly point for attacks into Israel, allowing it to be taken over by Hamas......who want every Jew in Israel dead.
Colpy, you don't believe the unpopular Egyptian dictator's actions are influenced at all by the $2B US in economic and military aid it gets each year from the US on condition that Egypt collaborate with Israel? Without that aid, the dictator would likely loose his grip on power. BTW, Mubaraks' chief rival is the popular Muslim Brotherhood, which is closely associated with Hamas. If Egypt ever held free and fair elections, Egyptians would likely elect a pro-Hamas anit-Israel government.
What a tangled web the US and Israel have created... In order for the Zionist state of Israel to survive, millions of Arabs and Muslims have to suffer indefinite oppression and injustice. Sounds pretty unstable over the longterm to me.
Also you never got back to me regarding my comment regarding this post you made:
Quoting Colpy
The rockets never stopped. If you are shooting at me, I am not going to feed you.
Which I responded with this:
What a tangled web the US and Israel have created... In order for the Zionist state of Israel to survive, millions of Arabs and Muslims have to suffer indefinite oppression and injustice. Sounds pretty unstable over the longterm to me.
Also you never got back to me regarding my comment regarding this post you made:
Quoting Colpy
The rockets never stopped. If you are shooting at me, I am not going to feed you.
Which I responded with this:
That's a clear statement in favor of Israel's collective punishment of 1.5 million men, women and children.
In October 2008, only one rocket was fired at Israel from Gaza. As per my previous post Hamas was trying to prevent the rocket attacks and was 99% successful. Yet Israel blocked most international food and medical aid from reaching 1.5 million Gazans.
Blocking humanitarian food and medical aid isn't just a ceasefire violation, its also a crime against humanity.
YouTube - Gaza's children suffering from malnutrition- 8 June 08
BTW, that was June 8, 2008. Things have gotten considerably worse since then. Most likely the child in the above video has since died.
As I posted previously, Israel not only starves children, but also burns them alive with chemical weapons:
YouTube - Cairo hospitals treat Gaza's war-scarred children -25 Jan 09
Colpy, do you also support burning children alive with chemical weapons as well as starving them?
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No the eviction of Palestinians was not just. Yes, they would have been justified, in many cases in fighting.......but are second and third generations justified?????
Of course. Not only do they still hold my father's property, they do everything in their power to make life as miserable as possible for me and my family.
Who are NOT justified are the Arab nations that abandoned them, that have prefered to send them guns and missiles and explosive belts and Jew-hating educational materials amd who speak of their "great struggle" and martyrdom.......instead of offering them food, medicine, succor.........brotherhood, and citizenship. It is SO much more convenient to exploit them as a club with which to beat Israel.
Perhaps they would rather support them in regaining what is rightfully theirs rather than enable the occupier. Sounds noble to me. Food, medicine....don't make me laugh...Israel's blockade....remember. Besides, attempting to show that the Arab nations are more evil than Israel is a feeble rationalization. I hold Israel to a greater standard than most of the middle east countries. Are they not worthy of that?
It is not trolling at all: the West Bank is Jordanian territory. The Gaza Strip is Egyptian territory, the Israelis would be THRILLED to return either one.
Quite frankly, this is non of Israel's business. The fact is that it is NOT Israeli territory and they continue to operate as though it is. I don't see either Egypt or Jordan making claims. Therefore it is up the the Palestinians to formulate their country.
They unilaterally abandoned Gaza, forcibly taking their settlers with them, and making it clear that if that action was a success......the same would follow in The West Bank
Bull****...They abandoned Gaza because they were rapidly losing control of events and didn't want to bear the cost of meeting the Geneva Convention requirements regarding responsibility for care of the residents. There were too few settlers to make it worthwhile. (Most of) he West Bank on the other hand, was always seen as manageable. There was never a plan to follow the pattern with (most of) the West Bank.
who want every Jew in Israel dead.
More bull****. This line has been overused to try to justify Israeli brutality. The fact is, other than some of the most racist criminal elements, neither Hamas, nor Iran, nor Syria, nor Hizbollah want the "Jews dead". What they want (unrealistic in my opinion) is a secular state (not called Israel) where Jews and Palestinians can all live together in peace (after returning individually owned Palestinian property to their rightful owners of course). The reality is also that most of these groups have indicated in various ways that they would settle for a 1967 Israel minus Jerusalem and a financial settlement to those Palestinians denied return. They won't settle for less but will no doubt cede (1967) Israel as a bargaining point.
I also apologize for calling you a troll. I do want to keep this discussion (somewhat) civilized.
Of course. Not only do they still hold my father's property, they do everything in their power to make life as miserable as possible for me and my family.
Who are NOT justified are the Arab nations that abandoned them, that have prefered to send them guns and missiles and explosive belts and Jew-hating educational materials amd who speak of their "great struggle" and martyrdom.......instead of offering them food, medicine, succor.........brotherhood, and citizenship. It is SO much more convenient to exploit them as a club with which to beat Israel.
Perhaps they would rather support them in regaining what is rightfully theirs rather than enable the occupier. Sounds noble to me. Food, medicine....don't make me laugh...Israel's blockade....remember. Besides, attempting to show that the Arab nations are more evil than Israel is a feeble rationalization. I hold Israel to a greater standard than most of the middle east countries. Are they not worthy of that?
It is not trolling at all: the West Bank is Jordanian territory. The Gaza Strip is Egyptian territory, the Israelis would be THRILLED to return either one.
Quite frankly, this is non of Israel's business. The fact is that it is NOT Israeli territory and they continue to operate as though it is. I don't see either Egypt or Jordan making claims. Therefore it is up the the Palestinians to formulate their country.
They unilaterally abandoned Gaza, forcibly taking their settlers with them, and making it clear that if that action was a success......the same would follow in The West Bank
Bull****...They abandoned Gaza because they were rapidly losing control of events and didn't want to bear the cost of meeting the Geneva Convention requirements regarding responsibility for care of the residents. There were too few settlers to make it worthwhile. (Most of) he West Bank on the other hand, was always seen as manageable. There was never a plan to follow the pattern with (most of) the West Bank.
who want every Jew in Israel dead.
More bull****. This line has been overused to try to justify Israeli brutality. The fact is, other than some of the most racist criminal elements, neither Hamas, nor Iran, nor Syria, nor Hizbollah want the "Jews dead". What they want (unrealistic in my opinion) is a secular state (not called Israel) where Jews and Palestinians can all live together in peace (after returning individually owned Palestinian property to their rightful owners of course). The reality is also that most of these groups have indicated in various ways that they would settle for a 1967 Israel minus Jerusalem and a financial settlement to those Palestinians denied return. They won't settle for less but will no doubt cede (1967) Israel as a bargaining point.
I also apologize for calling you a troll. I do want to keep this discussion (somewhat) civilized.
earth_as_one
Thanks for showing decisively just how twisted the "rocket" claims were. It shows clearly just who did not hold up their end of the ceasefire.
Thanks for showing decisively just how twisted the "rocket" claims were. It shows clearly just who did not hold up their end of the ceasefire.
Canada's travel ban against George Galloway has been picked up by the anti-Globalization people:
That's just foolish naive bravado. You know what happens when soldiers come to your house and tell you have 15 minutes to pack what you can carry and leave? You pack what you can carry and leave. This is what happened to my family. Oddly, my family doesn't live in a "refugee camp" on the border, they don't demand the right of return, they didn't dedicate my childhood to teaching me to hate, and I have no desire to blow up schoolbuses. Weird, eh?
Is this what you mean by "stifling criticism of Israel"?
YouTube - Anti-Israel rally - Toronto - 2009-01-10
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What a load of horse shyte...
No one and I mean no one, is trying to silence this asshat. He's free to speak ad nauseum wherever he so chooses. So long as it isn't in Canada. His speeches, his videos and yes, even his website, are still very much available in Canada.
This is simple, and I mean real simple. My 13 year old son got this one, the first time we discussed it, this morning as we ice fished.
The man is not ineligible to enter Canada because of his opinion. He is unable to enter Canada because he has financial ties to Hamas. A known terrorist group. He has condoned and supported acts of violence against Israel civilians.
This is not about his anti-war stance.
The leftoid fringe asshats need to get a grip on reality.
And OfM. The last time I checked. The Human Rights Tribunals, are run by fringe mentality left wingers. Doing everything in their power as quasi legal bodies to stifle all sorts of free speech. Some acts bordering on unethical, if not criminal. But that doesn't stop them from creating issues for them to challenge.
Show me another Federal Gov't institution, besides the CBC, with such broad and sweeping powers. Wheelded against media, citizens and industry alike.
Abuse of power...hmmmpf...that would the electricity used by some to post here.
eao, could you please show me how Canadians can no longer here this mans words?
I can still access his site, I can still view his youtube video's and I can still get transcripts of his speeches.
I fail to see how he has been silenced here...in fact, he's become even louder. Until this incident, I never heard of him.
You know what they say about bad press...;-)