Israel...

Canaduh

Derailing Threads
Mar 7, 2008
304
2
18
Southwest WA
Excuse me!!!???

We needed a permit to leave the reserves for quite sometime. We were not permitted on public transit, we were not permitted to get loans, have bank accounts, get jobs, we were not permitted to get an education (Unless of course it was by the residential school standard) and so on!!!

I was talking from a Israeli stand point, as I indicated in my last post I have nothing but respect for Native Americans, they have not blown up innocent school buses. The rape and plunder of Native American culture and lifestyle was totally unjustifiable, there is no comparison between that and Israel/ palestine.

Hear, hear!!!

The support the Six Nations has thrown behind the Palestinians is misguided and just plain wrong. We should be siding with Israel, period.

Now your talking:p
 

lone wolf

Grossly Underrated
Nov 25, 2006
32,493
210
63
In the bush near Sudbury
I think you will find Israel was always ours, and the arabs where just keeping it warm.
1) Do the Indian kids blow your kids up?.
2) We didn't wipe out the palestinians, we took back what was ours.

There is no comparison between Aative Americans and palestinians what so ever. Native Americans are a proud race that have worked that land for thousands of years. Even before the united nations gave back what was ours, there was 50,000+ jews in Israel.

If your talking about the west bank and gaza strip... tell the egyptians, syrians, iraqis, iranians, libyans and jordanians when they send an army 9 times the size and with the element of surprise against us, to win. Tanks where 101km from Cairo with the entire egyptian and syrian army circled when the US forced Israel to cease fire.

I don't think I will ever find Israel was yours. You left. You abandoned it. You gave up all rights to it. The homeland belonged to they who stayed behind. You just imposed yourselves on the poor cousins when the world "sinned" and said NO.

There will always be animosity between people of different cultures. Too bad Israel couldn't practice as she preaches and turn the other cheek. I understand why they who have been beaten down so many times can reach that desperate point where they want to take out as many as you as possible on their own ways out. Too bad you didn't. Perhaps you might rectify the problem - the leadership and the attitudes.

You didn't take back what was yours. You stole what was theirs. What came in the thousand years before that doesn't matter. What happened in yours and your father's generation does for that is the mess you dump on your own children.
 
Last edited:

CDNBear

Custom Troll
Sep 24, 2006
43,839
207
63
Ontario
I was talking from a Israeli stand point, as I indicated in my last post I have nothing but respect for Native Americans, they have not blown up innocent school buses. The rape and plunder of Native American culture and lifestyle was totally unjustifiable, there is no comparison between that and Israel/ palestine.
That was directed at the misconceptions foisted by Wolf, not you sensfan. I got the jist of your post. I'ld also die for Israel and I'm not Jewish. I just believe in the democracy in the middle of that great big bull****.
Now your talking:p
Other then you, no ones listening my friend.

The IDF and Israeli policy may have it's monumental flaws, but they are not without some justification.
 

Canaduh

Derailing Threads
Mar 7, 2008
304
2
18
Southwest WA
You contradict yourself on numerous occasions, I suggest you sit back and read your post.

This was and always will be Jewish holy land, I would rather die fighting than give 1 foot to the arabs.

Shalom.
 

Canaduh

Derailing Threads
Mar 7, 2008
304
2
18
Southwest WA
I am sorry, I thought that was aimed at me, it makes much more sense now. I understand where your coming from, but without being Jewish and living here you just don't understand. FYI we didn't leave, check up on your history I think you will find Jews aren't the most accepted people's.
 

Canaduh

Derailing Threads
Mar 7, 2008
304
2
18
Southwest WA
First off ... we DO have the groundwork for the same situation. We just went about it in a different way.
Letting them open casino's as compensation, nice ground work.
We may have wronged them in our own illusions of superiority, but we grew wise.
By the sounds of it your still very high on your pedal stool.
We didn't taunt them with our heritage - the National Grudge.
Go too school and read a history book, I think you will find otherwise.
We may have set aside land reserved for them - but we didn't go stealing that land (and their homes) all in the name of more settlement.
Ask the cattle ranchers whose land they illegally use and cross. Thats just one example.
We welcome their kids to ride our busses and to go to the same schools as our kids.
They may be officially accepted on the school bus, just how high are the juve, drug and drop out rates for young six nations people.
WE APOLOGIZED.
Apology makes everything alright?, what world are you living in.
Israel just wants it all at any cost.
Its worth it.
United Nations gave Isreal to you. What a mistake that was!

Shalom yourself....

The UN didnt give us anything Israel was always ours.
 

lone wolf

Grossly Underrated
Nov 25, 2006
32,493
210
63
In the bush near Sudbury
That was directed at the misconceptions foisted by Wolf, not you sensfan.

Which misconception?

This one: We may have wronged them in our own illusions of superiority, but we grew wise.

I got the jist of your post. I'ld also die for Israel and I'm not Jewish. I just believe in the democracy in the middle of that great big bull****.

Die for Israel? No way! I'd rather know what I died for.

Other then you, no ones listening my friend.

Oh ... I'm listening. I've been hearing the same "poor me" crap for 50 years. Israel just does not want to get along as an equal with other children. Israel is a narcissist.

The IDF and Israeli policy may have it's monumental flaws, but they are not without some justification.

And Israeli sabre-rattling isn't justification for Arab world distrust? It takes two to tango.

Woof!
 

Canaduh

Derailing Threads
Mar 7, 2008
304
2
18
Southwest WA
Name one time or even 1 single link where theres undeniable proof Israel cried poor me.
The American tax payer sees Israel as a sponge..
- Who rescued the hostages in Colombia a week ago (Israeli operatives where supposedly supervising, id bet they carried it out.)
- Who helped America in Iraq with interrogations
- You can bet 90% of the info Mossad gets goes to the NSA.

When you can name one time Israel has ever cried for help, I will stop posting in this thread.
 

lone wolf

Grossly Underrated
Nov 25, 2006
32,493
210
63
In the bush near Sudbury
Name one time or even 1 single link where theres undeniable proof Israel cried poor me.
The American tax payer sees Israel as a sponge..
- Who rescued the hostages in Colombia a week ago (Israeli operatives where supposedly supervising, id bet they carried it out.)
- Who helped America in Iraq with interrogations
- You can bet 90% of the info Mossad gets goes to the NSA.

When you can name one time Israel has ever cried for help, I will stop posting in this thread.

Have you ever heard of a little thing called the HOLOCAUST?

Woof!
 

Canaduh

Derailing Threads
Mar 7, 2008
304
2
18
Southwest WA
If Israel has always existed because Jews lived in the Mideast then it's the same thing. You can't just go changing the RoE to keep the ball in your court.

Yet again, where did I say Jews have always lived in the Middle East. Israel has always existed because it was given to us by God. I think your getting a little confused, take some more time before responding ok?.

לכל אחד שיכול לקרוא זה. נא לומר משהו הטמבלים האלה נוהגים לי מטורפים.
 

CDNBear

Custom Troll
Sep 24, 2006
43,839
207
63
Ontario
Which misconception?
No, these...
First off ... we DO have the groundwork for the same situation. We just went about it in a different way.
Really? Bio warfare, mass murder, genocide, kidnapping...really?
We may have wronged them in our own illusions of superiority, but we grew wise.
Really? Caledonia? Oka? Ignored land claims?
We didn't taunt them with our heritage - the National Grudge.
Huh?
We may have set aside land reserved for them - but we didn't go stealing that land (and their homes) all in the name of more settlement.
Caledonia, a golf course in Oka, Kid Creek mine, the list is actually so long I think Andem would ban me for drawing to much bandwidth for posting it.
We welcome their kids to ride our busses and to go to the same schools as our kids.
Really? We were thrown off the bus to school and our band was forced to supply our own. All because the white kids out numbered us and caused fights constantly. To top that off, the wife of the local QPP detachments Concessionaire, spray painted racial slurs on our bus right in front of the school.
WE APOLOGIZED.
It was empty, years to late and meaningless with the resolution to the outstanding issues.

Die for Israel? No way! I'd rather know what I died for.
That's easy with Israel, the right to exist.

Oh ... I'm listening. I've been hearing the same "poor me" crap for 50 years. Israel just does not want to get along as an equal with other children. Israel is a narcissist.
I would agree about the pity part, but they do deserve to live there.
And Israeli sabre-rattling isn't justification for Arab world distrust? It takes two to tango.
Agreed.
 

Canaduh

Derailing Threads
Mar 7, 2008
304
2
18
Southwest WA
I honestly feel sorry for the palestinian kids, the difference is when she vandalized the bus did you blow up the school or shoot her, no?. One of the main teachings of Judaism is that everyone is born with free will, we choose what we do.
 

CDNBear

Custom Troll
Sep 24, 2006
43,839
207
63
Ontario
I honestly feel sorry for the palestinian kids, the difference is when she vandalized the bus did you blow up the school or shoot her, no?.
Of course. Same as when someone creates something derogatory about Christians, ie: cartoons. No one dies, no one riots, no one throws a massive hissy fit threatening a Nation. Sonething fanatical about some Arabs and their faith being bastardized by some.
The main teaching of Judaism is that everyone is born with free will, we choose what we do.
No offence, but the IDF could be a little more discriminating when it retaliates against rocket attacks.
 

lone wolf

Grossly Underrated
Nov 25, 2006
32,493
210
63
In the bush near Sudbury
No, these...Really? Bio warfare, mass murder, genocide, kidnapping...really?
Do you suppose it will take Israel 200 years to wise up too?
Really? Caledonia? Oka? Ignored land claims?
Overlapping land claims too? You forgot Ipperwash and Dudley George. C'mon, you're preaching to the choir here.
Huh?
They were picked on in Europe so all who disagree pay.
Caledonia, a golf course in Oka, Kid Creek mine, the list is actually so long I think Andem would ban me for drawing to much bandwidth for posting it.
Which side of the line did you stand on at Oka - soldier or native? I was questioned about weapons. What did they ask you?
Really? We were thrown off the bus to school and our band was forced to supply our own. All because the white kids out numbered us and caused fights constantly. To top that off, the wife of the local QPP detachments Concessionaire, spray painted racial slurs on our bus right in front of the school.
Quebec.... Need I say more?
It was empty, years to late and meaningless with the resolution to the outstanding issues.
But, all the same, it's an admission which is more than Israel will ever do.

That's easy with Israel, the right to exist.
With skin tones that might pass for Arab and no Star of David? You'd be shot as a spy.

I would agree about the pity part, but they do deserve to live there.
Agreed.

Never claimed they didn't deserve to live there. My claim is they moved in and took over like nobody else had rights. Just in case you hadn't noticed - that starts bad feelings.
 
Last edited:

CDNBear

Custom Troll
Sep 24, 2006
43,839
207
63
Ontario
Never claimed they didn't deserve to live there. My claim is they moved in and took over like nobody else had rights. Just in case you hadn't noticed - that starts bad feelings.
Yet oddly enough, the Arabs that didn't buy all the hype, when Israel came to be and stayed. Are better off then the Palestinians...odd that is.
 

earth_as_one

Time Out
Jan 5, 2006
7,933
53
48
Canadians commenting on something that they have no idea about, and they say Canada isn't America. Tell me what you would do if Palestinian terrorist bombers have free access to your children's school bus, play area or just in fact any part of the country. When you have JUST 1 of the 4000+ katyusha/qasam rockets fired during the 2006 conflict hit your house, then you will know.

The security wall was supposedly a bad idea even some Israelis called it unjust, it dramatically reduced the amount of suicide bombers crossing through the west bank. Years on no one talks about it, the current circumstances will be the same.

God gave Israel to us, shalom.

I can reach out and contact people on both sides of this conflict. Thanks to the internet the world is a small place. Yes most Canadians know little about the true nature of this conflict, but that's changing.

I have a problem with this statement:

"God gave Israel to us"

That may be your belief, but other people have their beliefs. Why do your beliefs give you the right to cleanse Palestine of Palestinians? Did God also give you permission to ethnically cleanse the Palestine of non-Jews? Was all the killing and murder that led to Israel's creation part of God's plan? Where is that written?

Also why do religious texts have more authority than international laws and treaties which prohibit ethnic cleansing, seizing property by force and preventing the original inhabitants from returning to their homes?

Do you believe God intended you to build Jewish only colonies over former non-Jewish villages and cemetaries?

I have a problem with religious beliefs when they are used to justify the unjustifiable.

Israel's war with the former residents and their descendants is far from over and a wall isn't going to stop it. More likely Israel's adversaries have figured out that RPG's and ManPortable Air Defense systems are more effective than suicide bombers and that isolated attacks aren't effective as a full scale assault which is coming as surely as seasons change. This war isn't over, its about to enter a new phase.

Canada, like Israel also has a history of ethnic cleansing and colonialism. Most of our crimes ended more than a century ago. Back then our behavior then was similar to Israel's current behavior. For example:

...In 1497, John Cabot arrived to explore the coast of Newfoundland and Labrador. That was the start of the European invasion. Adventurers came from Britain, France, Spain and Portugal to catch the bounty of fish offered by the Grand Banks.

As well as the fish, they also captured many Beothuk and took them back to Europe as slaves. When the French established settlements along the coast, the Beothuk retaliated by stealing from them. Another Native tribe, the Micmac, became allies of the French. Because of the harassment from the Beothuk, the French hired the Micmac for protection. Rumors say that the French paid a bounty to the Micmac for Beothuk scalps, but there is no proof of this.

However, because of the infiltration of the Europeans, the Beothuk were forced to move inland, away from their usual food supply. The British also settled along the coast, and began warring over the land that, in truth, belonged to the Beothuk.

Because of the hardships they endured trying to live away from their natural habitation, and because the Europeans murdered them on sight, the Beothuk numbers gradually decreased. Of the original 5000 and probably more living in Newfoundland when the Vikings arrived, only an estimated 2000 remained in the 16th century. By the early 19th century, no Beothuks remained. Some may have fled to the north to live with the Inuit. Others may have joined with the Abernaki and Montagnais to the south. But many more died of starvation or were murdered...

http://canadianhistory.suite101.com/article.cfm/the_brothuk

If our adversaries had access to the same weapons as Israel's adversaries, I have no doubt they would have used them. But the world was a bigger place then and these people were isolated. So they were exterminated. I doubt Israel will succeed cleansing Palestine of Palestinians. I also doubt any God would want people to suffer as Palestinians do.

We are still trying to come to terms with the damage we did to the people living here before Europeans showed up.

Text of Prime Minister Stephen Harper's residential schools apology Wednesday:

Mr. Speaker, I stand before you today to offer an apology to former students of Indian residential schools.


The treatment of children in Indian residential schools is a sad chapter in our history.

In the 1870s, the federal government, partly in order to meet its obligation to educate aboriginal children, began to play a role in the development and administration of these schools.


Two primary objectives of the residential schools system were to remove and isolate children from the influence of their homes, families, traditions and cultures, and to assimilate them into the dominant culture.


These objectives were based on the assumption aboriginal cultures and spiritual beliefs were inferior and unequal. Indeed, some sought, as it was infamously said, `to kill the Indian in the child.' Today, we recognize that this policy of assimilation was wrong, has caused great harm, and has no place in our country.


Most schools were operated as `joint ventures' with Anglican, Catholic, Presbyterian or United churches.


The Government of Canada built an educational system in which very young children were often forcibly removed from their homes, often taken far from their communities...

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20080611/harper_text_080611/20080611/

Israel hasn't progressed to the point of reconciliation with the victims of their colonization. In fact Israel continues to expand at the expense of the people who have the wrong religion. Tell me is this how God planned to give Israel to you?
Video on House Demolitions

During the last four years, Israel has demolished homes in the Occupied Territories on an unprecedented scale:

House demolition for alleged "military need," demolition of houses built without permits, and the demolition of houses as punishment.

They all have one result - tens of thousands of people, most of them children, made homeless

http://www.btselem.org/English/Video/200412_House_Demolitions.asp

How nice. You make hundreds of thousands of people homeless and then complain when they fight back. What did you expect these people to do?

I have little sympathy for people whose beliefs allow them to justify theft and murder.