A basic income for all

White_Unifier

Senate Member
Feb 21, 2017
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A guaranteed minimum income would have been much wiser than raising the minimum wage. I still have some reservations about it, but at least it doesn't risk legislating an unskilled worker out of work. My main concern would be how a person would spend that tax-payer-given income.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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The concept is credible enough.................the amount is what would be in doubt! Can anyone live on $10 a month? :) :)

A guaranteed minimum income would have been much wiser than raising the minimum wage. I still have some reservations about it, but at least it doesn't risk legislating an unskilled worker out of work. My main concern would be how a person would spend that tax-payer-given income.


Well anyone with a quarter of a brain knows raising the minimum wage has never worked, won't work now and never will work.
 

White_Unifier

Senate Member
Feb 21, 2017
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If we do introduce a guaranteed universal income, I'd introduce it as follows:

1. Give everyone a personal Government debit card.

2. Deposit money onto that debit card each week or whatever the interval is.

3. Block that card from being used in any business that sells any addictive product or service.

4. Program the account so that the card holder can program it so as to block his use of the card during specified times of the day or days of the week or year and to limit its use to a maximum daily limit should the cardholder feel a need to better control his spending.

Just some ideas on how to implement it.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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Sounds reasonable as long as it's not stigmatized, in other words it's not stamped on the individuals forehead.

Being poor is not the same as being a criminal.


No- but a lot of criminals end up being poor (or rich) ! :)
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
75,301
548
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Vernon, B.C.
If we do introduce a guaranteed universal income, I'd introduce it as follows:

1. Give everyone a personal Government debit card.

2. Deposit money onto that debit card each week or whatever the interval is.

3. Block that card from being used in any business that sells any addictive product or service.

4. Program the account so that the card holder can program it so as to block his use of the card during specified times of the day or days of the week or year and to limit its use to a maximum daily limit should the cardholder feel a need to better control his spending.

Just some ideas on how to implement it.


Good ideas W.U. but you'll never prevent the purchase of addictive substances unless you kill the vendors!
 

Danbones

Hall of Fame Member
Sep 23, 2015
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Good ideas W.U. but you'll never prevent the purchase of addictive substances unless you kill the vendors!

Ah...the CIA, Clinton, Bush, Obama, Cartel, Mafia, Hell's angel's IsU$ business model!
:)
 

White_Unifier

Senate Member
Feb 21, 2017
7,300
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Good ideas W.U. but you'll never prevent the purchase of addictive substances unless you kill the vendors!

I'm not thinking of hardcore addicts here. for them, far more drastic measures are needed, like locking them in a mental institution for at least a year to force the drug out of their system. I'm thinking more of milder addicts, but still hard enough that, while they may have some self-discipline remaining (unlike hardcore addicts), they still need some help, a crutch or training wheels if you will. Mild addicts might have trouble when suffering withdrawal; but when they've gotten their fix, then they might be thinking of how to make it more difficult for themselves next time around to give whatever self-discipline remains in them just that extra push.
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
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Good ideas W.U. but you'll never prevent the purchase of addictive substances unless you kill the vendors!

As a one time petty vender I can unreservedly advise you to not hold your breath. You vote for the vender supporters and supplyers and so do I DRUGS IS BIG BIG BUSSINESS. The real drug problem is made in a lab by criminals looking to sell synthetic sweet dreams for as much as those lizards can get. They shjt on medicinal herbs but try to synth them very closely, they are very poor forgers.

Mama nature rules in the medicinal world.
 

White_Unifier

Senate Member
Feb 21, 2017
7,300
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I guess Walmart is out since they sell TVs

Of course the government would have to define what qualifies as an addictive product or service. I would definitely include alcohol, nicotine (tobacco, chew, vape, etc.), gambling (lottery tickets, casinos), pornography, and maybe a few other products and services. I don't think I'd include TVs myself, but obviously the government would need to define this.

Where I live, such a card would be unusable even in most supermarkets since most around my area sell tobacco, alcohol, and lottery tickets.

Presumably though, just to get access to that money, some supermarkets would respond by no longer selling those products or, if they did, then separate into two separate businesses with these products sold under a different business interac account.

If the government did include TVs, I presume Walmart would just do the same thing: separate that part into a separate business interac account. Problem solved.
 

White_Unifier

Senate Member
Feb 21, 2017
7,300
2
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Sounds reasonable as long as it's not stigmatized, in other words it's not stamped on the individuals forehead.

Being poor is not the same as being a criminal.

True. I suppose one solution would be to give this card and payment to each Canadian regardless of wealth. That way everyone would be using the card and so that would remove any stigma I suppose.

As a one time petty vender I can unreservedly advise you to not hold your breath. You vote for the vender supporters and supplyers and so do I DRUGS IS BIG BIG BUSSINESS. The real drug problem is made in a lab by criminals looking to sell synthetic sweet dreams for as much as those lizards can get. They shjt on medicinal herbs but try to synth them very closely, they are very poor forgers.

Mama nature rules in the medicinal world.

If a person doesn't want to help himself, nothing will work. But, when an addict wants help, when he wants to get off of it, then sometimes just giving him the tools to make it harder for him to access it will be enough since he himself will be trying to muster whatever self-discipline remains in him to resist the temptation.
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
201
63
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A basic income is already in place it,s called poverty. Poverty cannot be exterminated. It,s a benchmark of functioning economies, you have to have a bottom of a society or you lose perspective. What could you threaten the median with if not poverty? These people will kill you before they allow you to eliminnate poverty. You are a brave man.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
75,301
548
113
Vernon, B.C.
A guaranteed minimum income would have been much wiser than raising the minimum wage. I still have some reservations about it, but at least it doesn't risk legislating an unskilled worker out of work. My main concern would be how a person would spend that tax-payer-given income.


I just get a little nervous about money being handed out where there is no work to show for it. If it's a pension that's a little different - work was done years earlier and there should be interest added!
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
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Conspiracy much?

Utopia much?
 

spilledthebeer

Executive Branch Member
Jan 26, 2017
9,296
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Utopia much?

And what is WRONG with a basic income? FIRST YOU HAVE TO FEED THE CIVIL SERVICE UNION HOGS! And there is not enough money in the entire world to satisfy their greed for gravy!


Here is an article illustrating LOW LIE-beral ethical standards and their LIMITED respect for our tax money. With some comments of my own in brackets):

Hydro customers zapped for partisan bill inserts: NDP

By Antonella Artuso. Published: December 13, 2017. Updated: December 13, 2017 10:51 AM EST

Filed Under: Toronto SUN/ News/ Ontario

TORONTO — The Ontario Liberals are making hydro customers pay for political advertising on their bills right up until the next election, NDP Leader Andrea Horwath charges.

As evidence, Horwath pointed to a legal order signed by Energy Minister Glenn Thibeault and Chair of Cabinet Deb Matthews that requires local distribution companies (LDCs) to include an insert with hydro bills that mentions Ontario’s Fair Hydro Plan.

“That means that partisan Liberal flyers are going to be mailed to homes across Ontario from now through to election day and beyond,” Horwath said in the Ontario legislature. “So, let’s agree to call these flyers what they are: Desperate Liberal campaign advertising.”

(So not only have LIE-berals lied to us about their fqir electricity price crap, now they will charge us for the privilege of reading about their very selfish version of the plan!)

If the Liberals want to run partisan advertising to boost their political fortunes, the party should pay for it, Horwath said.

Ontario NDP Leader Andrea Horwath speaks to media in Sudbury on December 5, 2017. John Lappa/Sudbury Star/Postmedia Network

Thibeault and Matthews signed an order in council on June 14 that spells out clearly what the bill inserts should say — “the word ‘Ontario’s Fair Hydro Plan’ and “Bringing electricity bills down’ must appear in a reasonably prominent location on the fact of the bill insert.”

(And of course the LIE-beral plan is NOT FAIR as many smaller Cdn businesses will not be sharing in the reduced rates! Businesses that want reduced rates had better be unionized and able to get out the membership to support LIE-berals in the next election! And the rates are not really down for home owners either as LIE-berals have borrowed massively to TEMPORARILY REDUCE rates- that are set to soar again once LIE-berals get safely past the June 2018 election! Rates will return to sky high values once LIE-berals are re-elected and we will have all that interest to pay as well so any savings LIE-berals offer us is a FAKE NEWS!!)

(That LIE-berals would continue to defend such disgraced and failed policies long after they have been fully exposed as failures merely emphasises just how bereft LIE-berals are of new ideas, sensible policy or anything resembling a long term goal- other than their well know goal of clinging to power for as long as possible at any price!)

Ontario Fair Hydro Plan is the name that the Kathleen Wynne government gave to its strategy for reducing hydro bills by an average of 25%.

An order in council is a legally binding order by the government that does not require a bill to be introduced, debated and passed through the legislature.

“The only group that benefits from mailing out these partisan flyers is the Liberal Party,” Horwath said. “Is the Liberal Party paying for these flyers or is it the people and businesses of Ontario?”

(Well, the civil service union Hogs that are key to LIE-beral election success will also benefit as LIE-berals continue their shameless conflict of interest - offering Hogs wonderful pay raises in exchange for votes!)

Minister of Energy and Sudbury MPP Glenn Thibeault arrives at court in Sudbury on September 19, 2017 for an Election Act bribery trial. John Lappa/Sudbury Star/Postmedia Network

The Niagara-on-the-Lake Hydro Board issued a statement last week accusing the Ontario government of politicizing electricity bills.

(Of course Hdyro bill are political! LIE-berals have sold off a portion of our hydro system to their FRIENDS and then slammed shut the govt books so we cannot see the DIRT! LIE-berals have turned electrical generation into a giant slush fund for their friends!)

Hydro customers need simpler bills, not ones that add to their confusion by including the “calculation of the ‘savings’ from the Fair Hydro Plan,” says a statement from the utility.

(Especially when that calculation is WRONG! LIE-berals are using accounting techniques that are NOT taught in any conventional school of business to achieve their desired numbers!)

Thibeault said information in customer bills has long been regulated.

Some of the regulated requirements, like the separate delivery charge, can be confusing, he said.

“It’s trying to make sure that people understand clearly what their bills are all about,” Thibeault said. “Sometimes we treat people like they’re energy experts rather than just trying to understand their bill.”

There’s a bill redesign committee and ongoing work with Hydro One to clarify what should be on the mailing, he said.

aartuso at postmedia

(In other words LIE-berals are distressed that we have seen through their electricity price fakery and are now looking at creating alternative forms of propaganda that we will not sneer at quite so loudly in future! And wouldn’t it be nice if their re-write of the bills INCLUDED a section to show how much we are actually paying for the LIE-beral Carbon crap and trade tax scam?)
 

spilledthebeer

Executive Branch Member
Jan 26, 2017
9,296
4
36
Conspiracy much?

LIE-berals are remarkable for their selective vision- they insist that we must NEVER believe what we see on news media- and then DEMAND that we accept their arguments and explanations and excuses for their MANY failed policies- based on highly subjective crap printed in LIE-beral friendly media! There IS a reason we call them LIE-berals! HAHAHAHAHAHA!