Christianity and Religion

gerryh

Time Out
Nov 21, 2004
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Sorry, I would have answered this sooner, but my fingers can't keep up. From the looks of it that might be a good thing. Thanks for reminding me Gerryh.

My perspective on born again. Well, my perspective is from what Jesus said in the NT.

John 3
Now there was a Pharisee, a man named Nicodemus who was a member of the Jewish ruling council. 2 He came to Jesus at night and said, “Rabbi, we know that you are a teacher who has come from God. For no one could perform the signs you are doing if God were not with him.”

3 Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again.”

4 “How can someone be born when they are old?” Nicodemus asked. “Surely they cannot enter a second time into their mother’s womb to be born!”

5 Jesus answered, “Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit. 6 Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit. 7 You should not be surprised at my saying, ‘You must be born again.’ 8 The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit.”

I believe to be born again is the working of the Holy Spirit. I think half the "battle" is for a person to know there is a Holy Spirit. To know they are being sought by The Holy Spirit.


Vague, try again.
 

Goober

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Jan 23, 2009
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Goober,
I do not think I can adequately answer your question because at this point you have liquified my brain. I know of only one Genesis. I am a Christian, so I believe the words of Jesus. I DO NOT JUDGE who is and who isn't going to be saved. I can only point to Jesus and what he said. Jesus said some would and some would not be saved.

Genesis 1 - The Beginning - In the beginning God - Bible Gateway

Genesis 2 - Thus the heavens and the earth were - Bible Gateway
 

cj44

Electoral Member
Sep 18, 2013
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I wonder when you quote the OT so often.
Which Genesis do you believe in?

Do you believe that someone who has no belief in God will be saved?
Goober,
I do not think I can adequately answer your question because at this point you have liquified my brain. I know of only one Genesis. I am a Christian, so I believe the words of Jesus. I DO NOT JUDGE who is and who isn't going to be saved. I can only point to Jesus and what he said. Jesus said some would and some would not be saved.

Vague, try again.
Ok.
But, I think Jesus was pretty clear.

I am just a sinning ham. Being that I am a ham, I have no knowledge of my falling short of God's will. God is a loving God and he wants us all to be loving to our neighbor. For some reason we are not capable of being nice. So, God sent Jesus as the atonement for our sins.

Romans 10:9
If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
 

Cliffy

Standing Member
Nov 19, 2008
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That is right. They were two different events. One: God created everything including the Earth. In Two, the Lord God created Eden and Man. God of Genesis 1 is not the same dude as the Lord God of Genesis 2. These were two different events conducted by two different beings.

No one is going to get whacked with a ham!
Damn! I could use a ham right about now. I would prefer it to be Kosher.
 

gerryh

Time Out
Nov 21, 2004
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Ok.
But, I think Jesus was pretty clear.

I am just a sinning ham. Being that I am a ham, I have no knowledge of my falling short of God's will. God is a loving God and he wants us all to be loving to our neighbor. For some reason we are not capable of being nice. So, God sent Jesus as the atonement for our sins.

Romans 10:9
If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.


IMO I think Christ was clear also. However, there are those that think that if you have not been baptized when you are an Adult and have declared publicly that you have accepted Christ as your saviour that you will NOT be saved and you WILL be going to hell. Catholics who have been baptized as a child will be going to hell. That would mean that I am going to hell, along with Cliffy and Sal, and Dexter. I don't believe that for a moment. What about you?
 

cj44

Electoral Member
Sep 18, 2013
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That is right. They were two different events. One: God created everything including the Earth. In Two, the Lord God created Eden and Man. God of Genesis 1 is not the same dude as the Lord God of Genesis 2. These were two different events conducted by two different beings.


Damn! I could use a ham right about now. I would prefer it to be Kosher.
Well, Cliffy. If a ham should strike you this evening I would take that as the Holy Spirit's calling card.
 

Cliffy

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Well, Cliffy. If a ham should strike you this evening I would take that as the Holy Spirit's calling card.
I and the holy spirit are one. I am no stranger to it. His calling card came to me 34 years ago in the form of a logging truck that broadsided my snow mobile at 95 km an hour. Talk about a wake up call! Actually, it put me into a coma but I eventually woke up and saw the light.
 

cj44

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Sep 18, 2013
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IMO I think Christ was clear also. However, there are those that think that if you have not been baptized when you are an Adult and have declared publicly that you have accepted Christ as your saviour that you will NOT be saved and you WILL be going to hell. Catholics who have been baptized as a child will be going to hell. That would mean that I am going to hell, along with Cliffy and Sal, and Dexter. I don't believe that for a moment. What about you?
First, I have no idea what IMO means.
I do not believe the items you listed save a person. (baptism as an adult or public declaration) Only by faith are we saved. I go back to the criminal on the cross passage. The one criminal did not have time to come off the cross and be baptized and he did not publicly declare he accepted Christ as his Savior. Those would be works. Jesus' response was "today you will be with me in paradise."

9 One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: “Aren’t you the Messiah? Save yourself and us!”

40 But the other criminal rebuked him. “Don’t you fear God,” he said, “since you are under the same sentence? 41 We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.”

42 Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom.”

43 Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”

I and the holy spirit are one. I am no stranger to it. His calling card came to me 34 years ago in the form of a logging truck that broadsided my snow mobile at 95 km an hour. Talk about a wake up call! Actually, it put me into a coma but I eventually woke up and saw the light.
Glad you are alive. Can't imagine living through that.

Too bad Amazon doesn't have its drone package flyers up and running. They promise 30 minute delivery from time of order. I would send a ham dropping drone to your house just to freak you out. :)
 

Cliffy

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Nov 19, 2008
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43 Jesus answered him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise.”
They were coming to BC? I could frap to that.

For all you doubters, you should have seen this place 2000 years ago.

Glad you are alive. Can't imagine living through that.

Too bad Amazon doesn't have its drone package flyers up and running. They promise 30 minute delivery from time of order. I would send a ham dropping drone to your house just to freak you out. :)
I would probably piss myself laughing.
 

gerryh

Time Out
Nov 21, 2004
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First, I have no idea what IMO means.

IMO...In My Opinion

I do not believe the items you listed save a person. (baptism as an adult or public declaration) Only by faith are we saved. I go back to the criminal on the cross passage. The one criminal did not have time to come off the cross and be baptized and he did not publicly declare he accepted Christ as his Savior. Those would be works. Jesus' response was "today you will be with me in paradise."


That's what she wanted to know, and also me.


but I do see a difference between you and I, I believe we will all be with Christ, no one will be turned away.

God, our Father, loves us ALL unconditionally. All will be forgiven, and all will be with our Father in heaven. Despite what the likes of MHZ and revelations says.
 

petros

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Nov 21, 2008
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IMO...In My Opinion




That's what she wanted to know, and also me.


but I do see a difference between you and I, I believe we will all be with Christ, no one will be turned away.

God, our Father, loves us ALL unconditionally. All will be forgiven, and all will be with our Father in heaven. Despite what the likes of MHZ and revelations says.
If only some could forgive themselves....
 

Dexter Sinister

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Oct 1, 2004
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You are unable to know the truth until you have been enlightened by the Holy Spirit.
I don't believe that. And I can assure you I am just as certain of what I believe to be true as you are, and I believe you are exactly as wrong as you believe I am.
Ask Him. At this moment God is seeking YOU out.
If he exists, which I don't believe, he knows where to find me if he wants to tell me something. I grew up in a Christian household, I spent a good part of my early life looking, and never found anything, and now I am apostate and prefer to stay that way.
 

JLM

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Nov 27, 2008
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I don't believe that. And I can assure you I am just as certain of what I believe to be true as you are, and I believe you are exactly as wrong as you believe I am. If he exists, which I don't believe, he knows where to find me if he wants to tell me something. I grew up in a Christian household, I spent a good part of my early life looking, and never found anything, and now I am apostate and prefer to stay that way.


I think you may be onto something, things are probably just the way folks think they are.
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
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I don't believe that. And I can assure you I am just as certain of what I believe to be true as you are, and I believe you are exactly as wrong as you believe I am. If he exists, which I don't believe, he knows where to find me if he wants to tell me something. I grew up in a Christian household, I spent a good part of my early life looking, and never found anything, and now I am apostate and prefer to stay that way.
You don't have to look.

If it does it happen, it will be when you least expect it and in a way you won't understand at first.
 

cj44

Electoral Member
Sep 18, 2013
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Might could wanna look at that. Consequences for failure are pretty severe, according to Matthew 25:46.
Matthew 25:46
44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’
45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’
46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.

T-Bones, I would be lying if I said I always treat my neighbor well.
"So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets." It is ever before me to feed the hungry or thirsty, give clothing to the needy, visit those in prison, and generally be kind to all. However, I in no way do all I should.

Romans 7:21
21 So I find this law at work: Although I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22 For in my inner being I delight in God’s law; 23 but I see another law at work in me, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within me. 24 What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body that is subject to death? 25 Thanks be to God, who delivers me through Jesus Christ our Lord!
 

Tecumsehsbones

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Matthew 25:46
44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’
45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’
46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.

T-Bones, I would be lying if I said I always treat my neighbor well.
"So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets." It is ever before me to feed the hungry or thirsty, give clothing to the needy, visit those in prison, and generally be kind to all. However, I in no way do all I should.

Romans 7:21
21 So I find this law at work: Although I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22 For in my inner being I delight in God’s law; 23 but I see another law at work in me, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within me. 24 What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body that is subject to death? 25 Thanks be to God, who delivers me through Jesus Christ our Lord!
Just sayin'. Best of my knowledge, Jesus never commanded nobody to argue minutiae of theology on the internet or elsewhere.
 

Cliffy

Standing Member
Nov 19, 2008
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The only sin is the sin of self hatred. Guilt is a form of self hatred. If you believe you are capable of sinning, the fault lies with the designer.