Death knell for AGW

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
113,278
12,786
113
Low Earth Orbit
Well if this was just a discussion on the earth's natural cycles and how the climate has changed over the course of billions of years slowly and at times rapidly I could see your point.
If China burns enough coal we may be able to stop the end of the interglacial period right at it's peak. That would be sweet.

When theses puppies end it's pretty much instant in earth's timescale.

It's -35C with -48C windchills here right now. I hope my mailman makes it here alive.
 

EagleSmack

Hall of Fame Member
Feb 16, 2005
44,168
96
48
USA
It's -35C with -48C windchills here right now. I hope my mailman makes it here alive.

Dude... it's winter and now we're on the "that's weather, not climate" cycle.

When summer comes and it is hot feel free to use the hot weather as evidence to global warming.
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
113,278
12,786
113
Low Earth Orbit
Dude... it's winter and now we're on the "that's weather, not climate" cycle.

When summer comes and it is hot feel free to use the hot weather as evidence to global warming.
If the next couple solar cycles are duds like this last one, it could get quite chilly with no angry sun. The climate mystics were banking on this last/present one to be a doozie so they could fan the fires of doom.

As for the science of AGW, I'm still waiting for the flying car and jet pack that science promised me in 1972.
 

Tonington

Hall of Fame Member
Oct 27, 2006
15,441
150
63
Amazing in this day... you know with our planet having a fever and all.

Not really amazing, but why should someone who is too lazy to even investigate the amount of snow Flagstaff Arizona receives be diligent enough to learn about radiative physics? Lesson for the day, seasonal changes are larger in magnitude than the climate change signal produced by the enhanced greenhouse effect. Though you may be interested to know that the global warming signal produces larger anomalies in winter than it does in summer.

You may also be pleased to know that these facts are in no way associated with the speaking fees arranged for by Suzuki or Gore! :lol:
 

L Gilbert

Winterized
Nov 30, 2006
23,738
107
63
70
50 acres in Kootenays BC
the-brights.net
Well if this was just a discussion on the earth's natural cycles and how the climate has changed over the course of billions of years slowly and at times rapidly I could see your point.
Like I said before, I don't really care that people make money from whatever the planet does. People will make money from whatever they can think of that makes them money. It's irrelevant to what the planet does.
And as far as AGW goes, sure the planet has its cycles of cooling and warming, but it sure looks like something has interrupted the usual cycle and extended the warming part of it this time. Too many coincidences for my tastes. And it isn't as if any other stuff we've managed to do to the planet (like pollution water and land, the ozone layer, etc. hasn't had an effect).

Dude... it's winter and now we're on the "that's weather, not climate" cycle.

When summer comes and it is hot feel free to use the hot weather as evidence to global warming.
Still don't seem to grasp the difference between weather and climate, huh? Simply put, weather is what happens from day to day, season to season. Climate is the overall pattern of weather in a longer period of time.

Here ya go:

What is the Difference Between Weather and Climate?

Difference between Weather and Climate

NASA - What's the Difference Between Weather and Climate?

Weather and Climate Basics
 

Locutus

Adorable Deplorable
Jun 18, 2007
32,230
46
48
66
Tree Ring Studies Confirm Global Cooling



The prestigious Nature Journal recently publisheda major climate change study named Orbital Forcing Of Tree-Ring Data that proves through analysis of over 2000 years of tree ring evidence that current climate models substantially underestimated ancient Northern Europe temperatures levels during the Roman and Medieval Periods. The fact that temperatures have trended down for the last two centuries debunks theories that anthropogenic (man-made) global-warming is caused by a rising CO2 gas levels associated with industrial burning of “fossil fuels.”


Researchers from Germany, Finland, Scotland, and Switzerland examined tree-ring density profiles in trees from Finnish Lapland. In this extremely cold environment, trees often collapse into one of the numerous lakes, where they remain well preserved for thousands of years. The international team was able to conduct high reliability calculations of tree ring density from the cold water preserved Scandinavian pine trees, which correlate very closely with annual summer temperature patterns.




The United Nations’ endorsed Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) won the 2007 Nobel Peace Prize with Al Gore for interpreting studies of ice cores and ocean sediments to “conclude” that Europe was about to suffer catastrophic anthropogenic (man-made) global warming. But new Tree Ring Data allows precise measurements of annual climate variability. The results reveal there has been a cooling trend of -0.3°C (0.54°F) per millennia (1000 year periods) “due to gradual changes to the position of the sun and an increase in the distance between the Earth and the sun.” The high-resolution graph shown above demonstrates that temperatures ancient periods were much warmer than predicted by IPCC. The study also documents the extreme temperature phases that occurred during Europe’s “Little Ice Age” that resulted in a general cooling trend between the 1150 and 1460 AD and extremely cold climate between 1560 and 1850 AD. According to lead researcher Jan Esper:
“We found that previous estimates of historical temperatures during the Roman era and the Middle Ages were too low” … “Such findings are also significant with regard to climate policy, as they will influence the way today’s climate changes are seen in context of historical warm periods.”
The results are a huge embarrassment to IPCC, which has acknowledged it did not carry out its own original research to monitor climate and related phenomena. But their extrapolated conclusions regarding a recent warming trend served as justification for the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC) to demand Western industrialized nations implement the Kyoto Protocol treaty to achieve “stabilization of greenhouse gas concentrations in the atmosphere at a level that would prevent dangerous anthropogenic interference with the climate system.”


more


Testosterone Pit - Home - Tree Ring Studies Confirm Global*Cooling
 

EagleSmack

Hall of Fame Member
Feb 16, 2005
44,168
96
48
USA
Still don't seem to grasp the difference between weather and climate, huh? Simply put, weather is what happens from day to day, season to season. Climate is the overall pattern of weather in a longer period of time.

Sure I do. Absolutely. However your team seems to flip out during a heat wave and proclaims it as proof of global warming. A hurricane is formed... global warming!

However during the winter and in the midst of a cold snap... oh well that is just weather.

In other words I was mocking the hypocrisy that the GWers are quite comfortable with.
 

Nuggler

kind and gentle
Feb 27, 2006
11,596
141
63
Backwater, Ontario.
If China burns enough coal we may be able to stop the end of the interglacial period right at it's peak. That would be sweet.

When theses puppies end it's pretty much instant in earth's timescale.

It's -35C with -48C windchills here right now. I hope my mailman makes it here alive.


Piece o' cake. Did'r lotsa times. Cold as a witches boob, but doable with proper clothing and attitude. A huge beard, untrimmed from Sept to end of March helped a lot.
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
113,278
12,786
113
Low Earth Orbit





You should have quoted some of this Wally.


Scientists say that if natural factors were still governing the climate, the Northern Hemisphere would probably be destined to freeze over again in several thousand years. “We were on this downward slope, presumably going back toward
another ice age,” Dr. Marcott said.

Instead, scientists believe the enormous increase in greenhouse gases caused by industrialization will almost certainly prevent that.

Clutching the straws ....
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
113,278
12,786
113
Low Earth Orbit
What this means is we HAVE TO BURN fossil fuel to maintain the CO2 for warmth or starve by the Billions.

Hooray for China!
 
Last edited:

L Gilbert

Winterized
Nov 30, 2006
23,738
107
63
70
50 acres in Kootenays BC
the-brights.net
Sure I do. Absolutely. However your team seems to flip out during a heat wave and proclaims it as proof of global warming. A hurricane is formed... global warming!

However during the winter and in the midst of a cold snap... oh well that is just weather.

In other words I was mocking the hypocrisy that the GWers are quite comfortable with.
My team? The sensible ones on "my team" don't consider hurricanes to be anything but weather patterns. Same for cold snaps and heat waves. But it goes both ways. You have people like Wally posting about cold snaps in some area while ignoring a heat wave on another area then apparently expecting people to accept that as proof the planet is cooling.
Changing climate causes changing weather, unusual cold snaps and unusual heat waves are resulting weather occurrences of planetary warming. If everything was just cold there wouldn't be much weather. Add heat and the conflict causes precipitation, wind, etc. The reverse is true as well, add cold to something hot and you have an increase in weather occurrences. And the increases are not limited to quantity but also to severity.
I'd imagine that when the planet was very young, any life on it would have had to have been extremely durable. It happens like that in extreme conditions.

Anyway, I don't mind you mocking hypocrisy but as I said, there is hypocrisy on both "teams".