Epic Anti-Global Warming Monologue
- Thread starter Locutus
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And without further legislation in place, the polluter passes that cost onto everyone else... :roll:
Well look at emissions for instance.
How do we get industry to actually lower emissions?
The CPC have pledged to meet targets by 2020 (which is fine), but how are they going to do it?
We should go back to the good ol' days of the 70's when CO2 wasn't an issue because industry and consumers were putting out CO (a non-GHG) with high sulfer content.
Whoa...deja vu.
Hmmmm, the 70's.... Say, wasn't that around the time that suzuki was braying away like a mule about the coming, humanity-induced ice-age
Great minds, eh?
Guys. What is industry going to do to lower their C02 emissions?
There is no doubting that we need to reduce emissions - we all know that.
It's just a matter of how we're going to enforce that.
There is no doubting that we need to reduce emissions - we all know that.
It's just a matter of how we're going to enforce that.
Enact new legislation that will protect the consumer from downloading, then enforce current pollution laws.
Pay sdome other company in some other country to go without?
I don't like yours or Mulcair ideas on the matter.
Yes. That's not a bad thing. Science is self-correcting.
Sure. But can you explain why charging a few cents for a bag will produce a greater behavioural change than say, a few cents on a litre of gas? I'll grant that at the moment there aren't many alternatives. But I've never been one who said the changes would be immediate. Energy use applies to everything, I think it will take some time. But I don't see any evidence that the response to a cost imposed on plastic bags is unique.
Of course, that's exactly how it should be passed on.
I never said it wouldn't be without hardship. But you're making a fine argument now for something like GST rebates.
Right...as of right now nobody, or very few, are paying for their pollution of a public good. The change has to be forced. All changes are forced by something...
Emissions credits aren't the same thing as a tax applied to goods. Emission credits were auctioned, and in some cases given away. That is essentially giving someone free money. Again, that's why there should be a debate about the solutions. It's easy to see that the European Credit trading scheme had overlooked somethings, so going forward that something others can draw upon in their own national/international considerations.
http://thegwpf.org/best-of-blogs/4867-germanys-top-environmentalist-turns-climate-sceptic.html
What does that have to do with Germany's actual performance? A sceptic? OK...
Well the first links were about a European wide scheme, and don't specifically say anything about how Germany fared, the last is about an IPCC skeptic...Germany over-performed, while countries like Ireland, Portgual, Spain, and Greece all gained emissions massively, as high as 27%. As a funny coincidence all four are now also facing considerable economic uncertainty, with likely bailouts coming from countries like Germany.
I would prefer a tax applied to all point source of emissions, as opposed to a credit trading scheme that can be gamed.
Do you have any suggestions then? Tax credits for innovative R&D? Or how about tax breaks based on emission reductions? Incentives versus disincentives? How about a mixture of both?
The public at large contributes vastly more CO2 than all industry combined.
Inconvenient reality for ya, eh?
A "did you know" for you. It was the oil industry that funded greens to lobby for the plastic bag.
So, yes, it's true that fees (like the bag fee in Toronto) can get people to actually change behaviour. So I don't want to hear people complaining about taxes being ineffective because you're wrong.
Now that we have that out of the way, what kind of new legislation (CDNBear) do you think would get industry to actually lower emissions?
Now that we have that out of the way, what kind of new legislation (CDNBear) do you think would get industry to actually lower emissions?
Where were you in the 80's when scrubbers were legislated onto every industry and automobile?
Because the are viable alternatives, readily and cheaply available to the end user of plastic bags. While the size of our country, and the necessity of travel for work or pleasure, makes conservation fuel far more difficult to endure.
And my bottom line goes down. Yes selfish I know. But I can't be the only one trying to eek a living and stay ahead of the economy.
Passing it onto the end user, while the profit margin of big business doesn't fluctuate, seems punitive to me.
Awesome, taxes credits. In the end, a wash.
Ya I like those ideas, but you already said I should be punitively taxed, for trying to survive.
Thanks by the way.
And for 20 odd years we thought we had it bad with the anti logging/anti fish farming crowd. Actually many are the same people they just found a bigger revenue stream.