Was WWII about what we were told it was about?

Spade

Ace Poster
Nov 18, 2008
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True, but there are certain facts.
British slave trade
Caste system in Britain
Slavery in Canada
American slavery and segregation
Women as non-persons in Canada
American wars with first nations
The Shoah
Japanese internment
Etc.

My reply to DB
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
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RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
There is only one mass genocide, of many, wherein proper objective investigation is more often than not met with religious indignation. Indeed the Bengal (four million starved by Churchill) Genocide gets no public relations at all and is not marketed whatever and has not made a fraction of the profit that the Holocaust has even though the victims were most horribly starved to death en masse and it occurred in WW2. It does not get one headline per decade but it cost humanity two thirds of the reported final count of European Jews.
Who are the most worthy humans on earth? Why do so many suffer and so few receive help.
 

Corduroy

Senate Member
Feb 9, 2011
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I realized that you were trying to start a debate. That is why I deflected to a fictitious movie. I see no point in debating opinions.

Yes we have some idea about some things that happened in the past but most of what has come down is tainted by bias. We know the Mohawk and Algonquin lived in the past because they still live in the present as do the Brits and French. None of us, however, has a clear picture or understanding of what really happened back then because none of us was there to witness it. As has been pointed out many times, if there are 10 people who witness an event, not one story told by those 10 people will agree as to the details relating to their memory of what happened. Memory is selective. So we may have a crude idea of some of the events and people involved in historical events but we do not have a clear idea of any of the details.

Uh-huh so history isn't all BS now. Make up your mind Cliffy.

And we know the Mohawk and Algonquin lived in the past because they still live in the present... as do the Brits and French? Are you seriously so daft as to believe that's an intelligent argument?

Well, let's look at the French, shall we? The French exist in Canada now so they must have in past, like in the year 500. We know the French were here in the year 500 because they're here now.

Makes sense right?

Do you know how you really know when the French came to Canada? History. That **** was written down and compiled and the stories were past on. History isn't so much laden with bias as it is skewed by perspective. Historians take these accounts, evaluate their sources and try to recreate those events. We don't know for sure what happened, but that's not because we weren't there. It's because the story is incomplete. In fact, often times we know a hell of a lot more about what happened then the people who were there.

Your example of ten people telling a different story of the same event illustrates precisely the use of history. Who knows more about the event? One person who was telling his story or someone not there hearing all ten stories? The more perspectives you get, the better your understanding. You would get more information from the multiple stories, corroborating and synthesizing the stories and evaluating the accuracy of a source.

Do you know all the details of the decisions that led up to the Iraq War? Well some of you pretend you do, but in reality most of us, even though we were around for the event, probably know less about it then future generations will. We know more about the Second World War now than most people knew at the time it was being fought.

That's how we figure things out. That's how most people gain knowledge in their day to day life. What you have done is decided that since this method cannot be 100% accurate and can be subjected to manipulation, the whole concept should be thrown out. But there are things that can be known this way. Intelligent people can see through the bias and evaluate the evidence. We couldn't even be having this discussion about history if we didn't have a historical base to work from. How do we even know the Second World War occurred?
 
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Cliffy

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Nov 19, 2008
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Uh-huh so history isn't all BS now. Make up your mind Cliffy.

And we know the Mohawk and Algonquin lived in the past because they still live in the present... as do the Brits and French? Are you seriously so daft as to believe that's an intelligent argument?
.................

That's how we figure things out. That's how most people gain knowledge in their day to day life. What you have done is decided that since this method cannot be 100% accurate and can be subjected to manipulation, the whole concept should be thrown out. But there are things that can be known this way. Intelligent people can see through the bias and evaluate the evidence. We couldn't even be having this discussion about history if we didn't have a historical base to work from. How do we even know the Second World War occurred?
Well, perhaps you think you know something from history. I admire that. I know something too... that it really has little relevance to me in my personal life but some things are useful to bring up when discussing things with others who believe in such things. And yes, I am daft. After all, I believe the reality that most of us live in is a program, a computer (the mind) generated holographic image that has little to nothing to do with the reality of who and what we are, that is based on a colossal lie of biblical proportions. It is really difficult for me to have a discussion with someone who thinks the Matrix is real.
 

Goober

Hall of Fame Member
Jan 23, 2009
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Well, perhaps you think you know something from history. I admire that. I know something too... that it really has little relevance to me in my personal life but some things are useful to bring up when discussing things with others who believe in such things. And yes, I am daft. After all, I believe the reality that most of us live in is a program, a computer (the mind) generated holographic image that has little to nothing to do with the reality of who and what we are, that is based on a colossal lie of biblical proportions. It is really difficult for me to have a discussion with someone who thinks the Matrix is real.

Cliffy - You brought the Bible into your philosophy.
 

CDNBear

Custom Troll
Sep 24, 2006
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Well, perhaps you think you know something from history. I admire that. I know something too... that it really has little relevance to me in my personal life but some things are useful to bring up when discussing things with others who believe in such things. And yes, I am daft. After all, I believe the reality that most of us live in is a program, a computer (the mind) generated holographic image that has little to nothing to do with the reality of who and what we are, that is based on a colossal lie of biblical proportions. It is really difficult for me to have a discussion with someone who thinks the Matrix is real.
Ummm,
 

SLM

The Velvet Hammer
Mar 5, 2011
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London, Ontario
Well, perhaps you think you know something from history. I admire that. I know something too... that it really has little relevance to me in my personal life but some things are useful to bring up when discussing things with others who believe in such things. And yes, I am daft. After all, I believe the reality that most of us live in is a program, a computer (the mind) generated holographic image that has little to nothing to do with the reality of who and what we are, that is based on a colossal lie of biblical proportions. It is really difficult for me to have a discussion with someone who thinks the Matrix is real.

Reality? Meh, doesn't matter, I'm going for the steak dinner.
 

Corduroy

Senate Member
Feb 9, 2011
6,670
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Well, perhaps you think you know something from history. I admire that. I know something too... that it really has little relevance to me in my personal life but some things are useful to bring up when discussing things with others who believe in such things. And yes, I am daft. After all, I believe the reality that most of us live in is a program, a computer (the mind) generated holographic image that has little to nothing to do with the reality of who and what we are, that is based on a colossal lie of biblical proportions. It is really difficult for me to have a discussion with someone who thinks the Matrix is real.

Adjective

daft (comparative dafter, superlative daftest)

  1. insane, mad
  2. silly
  3. stupid
daft - Wiktionary
 

Cliffy

Standing Member
Nov 19, 2008
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The Matrix was a movie.It's fiction. Neo's real name is Keanu Reeves. He's been in several other movies since the Matrix trilogy. He didn't take the red pill. He is an actor. It's like pretending.

Keanu Reeves - IMDb
I'm crazy, not stupid. I took the red pill (metaphorically speaking) two decades before the script for that movie was written. I wrote a novel about it before the movie came out because people find it easier to digest if it looks like fiction. It isn't. The Matrix is a fiction like the bible is. It is truth couched in fable, metaphor and allegory.
 

Cliffy

Standing Member
Nov 19, 2008
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They haven't come yet and I have been out here for close to 5 decades, teasing and harassing them all this time.

Actually, an old indian medicine man taught me a long time ago how to become invisible. I have just successfully avoided capture. The only way they will ever find me is when my rotting corpse is too ripe to ignore.


a half hour later

Hey! Where did everybody go? Come back and fight like dogs.
Oh Crap! I really did become invisible.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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Hey! Where did everybody go? Come back and fight like dogs.
Oh Crap! I really did become invisible.

I won't abandon you, Cliff, but I think with your recent natterings everyone fled before the boys with the butterfly nets arrived! :lol: