Several dead, many wounded in bus attack in Israel

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
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Quote:
Dear Mrs. Rayyan,

We are writing to inform you that we intend to drop a 1 ton bomb on your apartment building today. We request that you evacuate the area with your children. Please don't tell your husband.

yours truly,

The IDF



That's hillarious!
 

mentalfloss

Prickly Curmudgeon Smiter
Jun 28, 2010
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Looking at that demolished building - nay, subdivision - this is partly why I think the injury exposure and military prowess of both parties is important in trying to come up with some objective assessment of the situation.

I understand that provocation is bad and the Hamas charter is evil (yes, it is evil), but when you lose a few people in a bus, it shouldn't justify killing many more and destroying buildings.

I.M.H.O.
 

earth_as_one

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Jan 5, 2006
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bumped up a reply to Colpy
>

Actually both sides have their fair share of religious zealots and war criminals.

Fox and other cable news sources would have no problems finding selective truths to demonize Israelis the same way they use selective truths to demonize Palestinians specifically and Muslims generally:
Embracing secular culture can be risky in Israel / Jewish zealots' `modesty patrols' employ beatings and vandalism 10/05/2008 | Archives | Chron.com - Houston Chronicle


Those of you who can't tell $hit from Shinola could be easily manipulated in either direction. 60 years ago the moronic manipulated masses hated Jews. Now they hate Muslims.



Funny you should mention human shields. The IDF has repeatedly abducted Palestinians and forced them at gunpoint to search for explosives and block bullets. I've posted many references to this, but you've never seemed to be able to absorb this fact. I can reference many Israeli sources supporting this:

B'tselem
20 July 2006: Israeli Soldiers use civilians as Human Shields in Beit Hanun | B'Tselem

The "neighbor procedure" is a common way IDF soldiers will abduct and use Palestinians as human shields:

Breaking the Silence
Breaking the Silence › Video Testimony - A procedure with many names

Haaretz:
'IDF troops used 11-year-old boy as human shield in Gaza' - Haaretz Daily Newspaper | Israel News

Here's a video of the "neighbor procedure" in action:
IDF using Palestinians as Human Shields - YouTube

I've posted this information before and yet you still believe the IDF doesn't use civilians as human shields. I'm pretty sure that even if the IDF came to your house, told you you won a free vacation to Gaza and made you march in front of their guns to block bombs and bullets, you still wouldn't figure it out.

Leaders on both sides are committed to the destruction of the other. Read the Likud Platform's position regarding "The Palestinians".
Likud - Platform

The main difference between Israelis and Palestinians has to do with military might. Israel has one of the world's most powerful military machines and is backed by a military super power while Palestinians are relatively defenseless. I'm sure both sides would cleanse the holy lands of the "others" if they could. Over the last 60 years, hundreds of thousands of Palestinians have become homeless, nationless refugees. They have been removed by force from their homes and had their property stolen by the state of Israel. Israel's ongoing ethnic cleansing never stopped since its creation and continues to be the root cause of conflict and primary obstacle to peace.

Even Israeli historians agree that "ethnic cleansing" is the correct term to describe the process of "redeeming the holy lands":
Ilan Pappe, Israel The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine by Ilan Pappé book review by Mostafa Omar

Contemporary Israeli historians like Pappe and others have examined the evidence and they all conclude the "official version" of events in this region as commonly believed by the manipulated masses is a load of BS. They just say it in a nicer way.

#1 The official version said that Britain tried to prevent the establishment of a Jewish state; the New Historians claimed that it tried to prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state

#2 The official version said that the Palestinians fled their homes of their own free will; the New Historians said that the refugees were chased out or expelled‎

#3 The official version said that the balance of power was in favour of the Arabs; the New Historians said that Israel had the advantage both in manpower and in arms

#4 The official version said that the Arabs had a coordinated plan to destroy Israel; the New Historians said that the Arabs were divided

#5 The official version said that Arab intransigence prevented peace; the New Historians said that Israel is primarily to blame for the dead end.

New Historians - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

BTW Colpy, please let me know when someone finally finds Iraq's WMD stockpiles and links to al Qaeda which were used to justify starting a war which has killed hundreds of thousands of people and made millions others homeless refugees.



C'mon Colpy. Try kicking the ball again. Lucy might have lied in the past, but she isn't lying this time.
 

Goober

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Jan 23, 2009
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Point - So logic led you to the belief that Colpy and others, I imagine I am included and dearly hope so are apologists – That my friend is a misnomer – Note the use of the term apologist. Demonstrates clear bias – and an insult.

“I'm not sure you can libel an alias of someone. This should be a forum for debate. Few people will continue reading a string if its just a flame war. IMO, the person resorting to name calling in a debate is a looser. They can't win the debate by logic so they drag themselves and everyone else with them into the mud, I don't see the point in this. Its juvenile.”

Point - I refer again to the term Apologist – An insult is an insult, is it not. Logically it would not matter if you use a polite or an impolite term. So another one out the window.

“Colpy and other Israeli apologists won't admit that IDF soldiers are using human shields when they abduct civilians to block bullets and search for bombs. Clearly it is, but they ignore them, since Israel can do no wrong. “

Point – Show objective proof – That will stand up in a court.

“I've adopted a more neutral way to view attacks which helps filter out the BS propaganda.”

More neutral is again incorrect – did you move from a 100 % believer in Hamas / Hezbollah to 99 % - That is more neutral is it not?


Now to get down and dirty – Colpy, Bear, others and myself have kicked your ass and logic so many times that when you sit and take a crap, you do not have to wipe. That divide is now the Great Divide – Out it goes without touching your sidewalls. So that would make you, due to the actions of the aforementioned posters above help save old growth forests. I think Green Peace should at the least give us an honorable mention.
 

earth_as_one

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"apologist" : a person who makes a defense in speech or writing of a belief, idea, etc.

A complaint from you regarding the word apologist as an insult is pretty funny Goober.
 

Goober

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"apologist" : a person who makes a defense in speech or writing of a belief, idea, etc.

A complaint from you regarding the word apologist as an insult is pretty funny Goober.

You were using logic, polite discussion slamming those that insult from time to time. I figured it was time for your nap

PS - It was not a complaint - It was tearing you logic train apart, piece by piece - Now using logic you should have been able to follow that - I made it easy, clear and to the point so you would not encounter any difficulties. Clearly I was mistaken.
 

earth_as_one

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What really exposes the weakness of a person's logic is when the debater resorts to inventing $hit about their opponent. Jimmy Carter never once made a statement in support of Palestinian war crimes or ever made an anti-Semitic remark. Yet that is the implication of the above drawing. The reference to "Give peace a chance" is an attempt to discredit people who base their opinion of this conflict on their abhorrence of violence and war as being sympathetic to Palestinian war crimes and anti-Semitic. The implied correct perception of this conflict is one that views all Palestinian as terrorists and deserving of Israeli violence. The messages in the drawing aren't that subtle, but they still have an effect on the simple minded.

Goober's implication that I side with Hamas and Hezbollah is yet another example. I'm not sure if that's deliberate or yet another example of Goober's inability to think critically.

Let me try to explain my position in a way Goober and others incapable of critical thought might understand.

Most Israeli apologists are stuck in the "pick a side" mentality. If you are against Israeli war crimes and crimes against humanity, then they conclude you must support war crimes committed against Israelis, like its a sporting event and you are rooting for one team or the other. Clearly I don't support Israeli war criminals. Therefore people stuck in their "pick a side" mentality conclude I must support Palestinian war criminals. Let me be clear. I don't support Israeli or Palestinian war criminals. I don't support either team. If this conflict was a sporting event than I would be against both teams killing spectators and innocent bystanders. I'd rather the two teams focused their efforts against the other team.

Unlike Israeli or Palestinian apologists, I condemn both sides war crimes. Since our news and leaders have sided with the Israeli team, I post on the internet information with the intention of causing people to see through the BS propaganda and think critically about this conflict.

Goober:
The only people who believe that
Colpy, Bear and yourself have kicked my ass with logic are Colpy, Bear and yourself. CB's posts consist almost exclusively of insults, taunts and delusions of grandeur. I don't even read CB's posts anymore. I noticed you seem only capably of attacking the messenger, rather than the message. You last two posts are good examples. You arguments don't attempt to discredit my ideas, but to discredit me. Colpy on the other hand has taught me a thing or two about class and restraint. I may disagree with Colpy, but he has never lost my respect.... I recommend that everyone try to learn from Colpy. He has much to teach everyone, including myself regarding proper debating behavior. He always debates the message, rather than the messenger. Occasionally he has let a few things slip, (just like me) but he immediately apologizes and tries to correct the mistake. In this regard, I've tried to emulate Colpy.

BTW, Thank you Colpy..
 
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Goober

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Really - read your posts - Read up on how many times people ask a clear and concise questions - and you do the duck trick - Flock off. I also cannot stand racists, lairs and Bull****ters.
You make a post about logic and not to use insults as they are losers –Then you proceed to not follow your own advice
Also – Question – Does Hamas want peace with Israel
 

DaSleeper

Trolling Hypocrites
May 27, 2007
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Really - read your posts - Read up on how many times people ask a clear and concise questions - and you do the duck trick - Flock off. I also cannot stand racists, lairs and Bull****ters.
You make a post about logic and not to use insults as they are losers –Then you proceed to not follow your own advice
Also – Question – Does Hamas want peace with Israel


Glory be to bull****, that from which blossoms grow, that to which all food returns. I sing the hymn of universal Bull****.

1% of a seed is the flower, 99% is manure. 1% of a flower is the seed, 99% is manure. And so it goes, all the way up to the galaxies, the green pastures of heaven. I only know this: there's a pretty big Bull up there.

Why are you always right and I'm always wrong? Why am I always right and you're always wrong? Both of us wallow in bull****.

The orchids and poppies of religious dogma spring from enormous steaming piles of bull****. The political ideology of the Right is bull****. The political ideology of the Left is bull****. The melodrama of the PHD is sparkling bull****. The latest scientific theory is the flowering of bull****. The neuro-meta-bio-physics of the most recent article I have read: pure bull****.

No one has ever seen a theory. Yet we each cling to the theory that appeals most to our insatiable appetite for the self-deluding fragrance of bull****.

No one has ever seen a quark or an eleven-dimensional 'string.' Quantum physics is a charmed lily growing in bull****.

No one knows what distant stars and galaxies are, or if they even exist, because all we ever see is a smudge of light millions of years in the past. Who knows but that the stars are not dancing archers, scorpions, rams and bulls, each constellation dumping its luminous offal onto the earth?

Astronomy is bull****. Astrology is bull****. The night sky is deep bull****. Rejoice. Wallow.

Bull**** works half the time. Ayur Veda, Acupuncture, Chiropractic, Aromatherapy and Crystal Healing: all based solidly on bull****. The pharmaceutical industry thrives on the healing power of bull****. When I listen to TV ads for prescription drugs, I can't tell whether they're trying to cure me or kill me.

And don't forget Yoga, O blessed numberless schools of bull****! 'Hot' bull****, 'constant flow' bull****, 'integral' bull****, 'kundalini' bull****: all sleek artfully tanned tank-topped bodies covered with the healing balm of bull****!

The thousand-petalled lotus in the brain grows in a skull full of bull****. Matter is bull****, Spirit the odor of bull****.

Rejoice when you finally comprehend that there is nothing to seek because Truth is bull****. Bull**** shall set you free.

What if Creationists sat down in a pile of bull**** with Evolutionary Biologists? The Creationists might declare, 'Our attempt to understand the laws of science through the first chapter of Genesis is total bull****.' The Biologists might then confess, 'The Big Bang, Thermodynamics, Darwin's theory, it's all bull****: we really have no idea where the universe came from.' Wouldn't we all be more awake?

What if Israelis sat down in a pile of bull**** with Palestinians? The Israelis might admit, 'Those old stories about burning bushes, parting seas, the promised land: they're wonderful stories if you're a Jew, but they're all bull**** if you're a Canaanite.' Then the Palestinians could fess up, 'Those theories about Jews running America and Zionist plots to take over the world: they sound fine if you're a Palestinian, but they're all bull****.' Wouldn't we all breathe easier?

And what about those piles of corporate excrement on Wall Street? The only thing that trickles down from the rich to the poor is bull****.

There are two kinds of people: the enlightened and the ignorant. The ignorant think there is a precious jewel buried in the bull****. The enlightened are free because they know it's all bull****.

Non-dualism, fundamentalism, catholicism, protestantism, atheism, buddhism, darwinism and spelling self with a capital 'S': all bull****!

Imitating your Indian guru by nodding your head from side to side: Bull****!

Taking Jesus to be your imaginary friend, taking Krishna to be your imaginary friend, or imagining that you have no imaginary friend: Shut up! It's bull****! Just do what you love!

Join a mega-church led by a bishop in diamond rings who drives a Cadillac and preaches damnation to gay people while seducing teen age boys, or live without any spiritual community at all: either way, it's bull****. Just do what you love!

Accepting that the mind is full of bull**** is the deepest meditation. Only then can you laugh, flush, and be empty. Just do what you love. That is the only truth, and even That is bull****.

Relax. Wallow. There's a pretty big Bull up there.



Sorry I didn't quote the source....Abfootinmouth would say it's a hate site:lol:
 

Colpy

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I'm accurate . JihadWatch is a hate-site. Jihad Watch - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


.

What, Jihadwatch is a hate site because CAIR says so???

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA....that is just TOO funny!

CAIR:

In 2007 the organization was named by U.S. Federal prosecutors, along with 245 others, as an unindicted co-conspirator in a Hamas funding case involving the Holy Land Foundation,http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Council_on_American-Islamic_Relations#cite_note-1

"Critics of CAIR, including six members of the U.S. House of Representatives and Senate,[59][86][87] have alleged ties between the CAIR founders and Hamas. The founders, Omar Ahmad and Nihad Awad, had earlier been officers of the Islamic Association of Palestine (IAP), described by a former FBI analyst and US Treasury Department intelligence official as "intimately tied to the most senior Hamas leadership."[88] Both Ahmad and Awad participated in a meeting held in Philadelphia on October 3, 1993, that involved senior leaders of Hamas, the Holy Land Foundation (which was designated in 1995 by Executive Order, and later convicted in court, as an organization that had raised millions of dollars for Hamas) , and the IAP.[89][90][91] Based on electronic surveillance of the meeting, the FBI reported that "the participants went to great length and spent much effort hiding their association with the Islamic Resistance Movement [Hamas]."[92] Participants at the meeting discussed forming a "political organization and public relations" body, "whose Islamic hue is not very conspicuous."[93]"

Council on American-Islamic Relations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Read the article for both sides, but AbtFet is basically saying that Jihad watch is a hatesite because CAIr.....a supporter of genocidal Hamas....says they are a hate site.... :)

Uh-huh....in other words, they are a hate site because AbtFet disagrees with them.

BTW, this all begs the question: When did I ever quote Jihadwatch in the first place????????????

Talk about setting up straw men......the act of the desperate.....
 

gerryh

Time Out
Nov 21, 2004
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eao, you ARE a Hamas apologist. You blame Israel for 99% of the problems and only throw in the other 1% so that you can TRY to claim that you are objective. It has been obvious for a very long time that you are NOT objective at all when it comes to the ME.
 

AbtFet

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Jul 23, 2011
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What, Jihadwatch is a hate site because CAIR says so???

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA....that is just TOO funny!

CAIR:



"Critics of CAIR, including six members of the U.S. House of Representatives and Senate,[59][86][87] have alleged ties between the CAIR founders and Hamas. The founders, Omar Ahmad and Nihad Awad, had earlier been officers of the Islamic Association of Palestine (IAP), described by a former FBI analyst and US Treasury Department intelligence official as "intimately tied to the most senior Hamas leadership."[88] Both Ahmad and Awad participated in a meeting held in Philadelphia on October 3, 1993, that involved senior leaders of Hamas, the Holy Land Foundation (which was designated in 1995 by Executive Order, and later convicted in court, as an organization that had raised millions of dollars for Hamas) , and the IAP.[89][90][91] Based on electronic surveillance of the meeting, the FBI reported that "the participants went to great length and spent much effort hiding their association with the Islamic Resistance Movement [Hamas]."[92] Participants at the meeting discussed forming a "political organization and public relations" body, "whose Islamic hue is not very conspicuous."[93]"

Council on American-Islamic Relations - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Read the article for both sides, but AbtFet is basically saying that Jihad watch is a hatesite because CAIr.....a supporter of genocidal Hamas....says they are a hate site.... :)

Uh-huh....in other words, they are a hate site because AbtFet disagrees with them.

BTW, this all begs the question: When did I ever quote Jihadwatch in the first place????????????

Talk about setting up straw men......the act of the desperate.....


Who knows if it was you specifically that quoted JihadWatch but I know many bigots on here like to post videos of JihadWAtch and pretend it's a legitimate site when it's nothing more than a hate site.
Even if you haven't, it's not like you would have any problem using it as a source, you don't even think it's a hate site. :lol:

Israeli apologists on here like to pretend Israeli war crimes don't even exist. 8O
 

gerryh

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Who knows if it was you specifically that quoted JihadWatch but I know many bigots on here like to post videos of JihadWAtch and pretend it's a legitimate site when it's nothing more than a hate site.
Even if you haven't, it's not like you would have any problem using it as a source, you don't even think it's a hate site. :lol:

Israeli apologists on here like to pretend Israeli war crimes don't even exist. 8O


Another example of abtfet back tracking from unsubstantiated statements he has made.
 

AbtFet

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Jul 23, 2011
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I'm not backtracking anything, the same thing goes for MEMRI.TV which Colpy has sourced.
 

Goober

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Who knows if it was you specifically that quoted JihadWatch but I know many bigots on here like to post videos of JihadWAtch and pretend it's a legitimate site when it's nothing more than a hate site.
Even if you haven't, it's not like you would have any problem using it as a source, you don't even think it's a hate site. :lol:

Israeli apologists on here like to pretend Israeli war crimes don't even exist. 8O

Bigots - What would you call a person that is in favor of wiping Isreal of the map - Perhaps you can help an old fellow out on that one.
 

gerryh

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Nov 21, 2004
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I'm not backtracking anything, the same thing goes for MEMRI.TV which Colpy has sourced.


You specifically accused Colpy of using jihadiwatch, and now that you can't back up that accusation, you are backtracking. I gather you have a problem admitting when you're wrong.
 

AbtFet

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You specifically accused Colpy of using jihadiwatch, and now that you can't back up that accusation, you are backtracking. I gather you have a problem admitting when you're wrong.

I was referring to anyone who used JihadWatch as a source.
The point obviously still stands, it's futile what you're arguing.

Bigots - What would you call a person that is in favor of wiping Isreal of the map - Perhaps you can help an old fellow out on that one.

I'm not in favour of wiping Israel off the map, it's probably a nice country. The extremist right-wing government is another story.