Obama urges future Palestinian state be based on '67 borders
- Thread starter Machjo
- Start date
Why isn't the whole issue just referred to the UN Court that was supposed to rule on these very matters? The conflict was first started by Britain when she promised two different groups the very same piece of land. That was sure to create conflict and what is going on today is tied to events that far back. Any deal made by/through the US will be as binding as any Indian Treaty ever made, all words that have no meaning for the US but totally binding on the Indians. Having Israel 'draw up the conditions' would be doing the same thing. Having a decision from a recognized court (grain of salt here) might be a way to have both parties respect a decision that should be impartial if the big 5 can be kept from influencing things behind the scene.
Palestinians have nothing to lose by trying to go that far back, they need some expert help in the courts and I doubt they get many Lawyers graduating yearly that are well versed in 'treaty-speak'.
Palestinians have nothing to lose by trying to go that far back, they need some expert help in the courts and I doubt they get many Lawyers graduating yearly that are well versed in 'treaty-speak'.
Britain already had control of the land, that was the West's foothold, the creation of Israel may have been the method to create unending conflict in the area. Conflict creates money. If the original intent was a safe place for the Jews it has turned out to be anything but, at 100 years (from when Britain first made the deal with the locals that they would gain independence if they helped Britain win WW1) and the conflict still going on just as strong the 'what went wrong' angle might have to be scrapped for the one that tracks down why things have not been able to be resolved and why permanent turmoil is the desired goal. Taking the land without fair compensation is one thorn, having vast swaths of property bought up under false identities is a very good sign of criminal activities. If that was the base for today's Israel then the whole deal has to be scrapped. (tainted money can never be used to start a law abiding business)
For once we agree, remove all possibilities of their ever being a Palestinian state and make them citizens of Israel.
Wish all you want, Israel will never go back to the 1967 borders let alone the 1947 ones. Guarantee them the Golan Heights and Jerusalem, then you may possibly be able to negotiate for the rest. Jerusalem and the Golan is Israel's. Have to be realistic, there never was a Palestinian nation, only small family groups, and the only reason modern day Israel was established there was that no one expected them to survive, let alone make the ground productive and get as far as they have. President Obama has assured himself a one term presidency.
It's a dog and pony show to make it appear to be 'a struggle'. Unless Obama is planning to live there he should zip his lips, that's not likely to happen either. They were palying opposites in Libya in the very beginning, a month later it's quite clear NATO is there to bomb everybody.
Palestine has to go back far enough that the 'right to return' resolution remains an issue, today that would be more than 5M new Israeli citizens, many of whom are of voting age. If the UIS is pushing the 1967 borders then they are no friends to Palestine, no matter what the headlines scream.
Isreal must NEVER go back to the 1967 border if we don't want the Middle East to blow up (and even then, there's a good possibility it will anyway). From the terrorists themselves, listen to what they have to say....even if Isreal did go back to the pre-1967 border it would still not be enough - they want to "kill/murder" ALL Jews and destoy Isreal. How can any sane person state that peace will evolve from this? Isreal has already given up land and for what? It blows my mind that there are those out there who simply cannot see what is really happening. Caliphate anyone?
JMO
JMO
I'm glad that the U.S. finally took a stance that the rest of the world has supported for over 50 years now. Took them long enough.
This will lend a lot of credence to going back to the 1967 border and both parties will need to adhere.
Expect to hear a lot more on this issue from the west end, now that they've outlined a specific goal.
It's already catching on...
Polish, French ministers speak in support of Obama's plan for the Palestinians
This will lend a lot of credence to going back to the 1967 border and both parties will need to adhere.
Expect to hear a lot more on this issue from the west end, now that they've outlined a specific goal.
It's already catching on...
Polish, French ministers speak in support of Obama's plan for the Palestinians
Sovreign State of Palestine?
Oh do tell us the Presidents, Prime Ministers, or Rulers of Palestine.
This should be fun.
The US protects it's supply line of oil through the lands of Israel?
Now you are just being silly.
Actually.....
In 1947 they considered themselves southern Syrians, and were all in an uproar about the UN plans because "how dare the UN separate us from our Native Syria!".
So they keep being told. I imagine they will continue being told that, down to the last hectare.
lol King of Jordan may not like that idea too much.
Because there never was a sovereign state of Palestine. Ever.
You are absolutely right. I hate to be a downer but I'm afraid this is all a bunch of chitter chatter, the invasion of Israel will happen before any negotiations for peace begin. With the fall of Egypt, war is in the air. When the dust settles, there will either be an invigorated Israel, who will probably be smart enough not to give back the Sinai this time, lol, or a massacre of Jews.
Either way is bad news for the Arabs of Palestine.
The problem is that the U.S. did not take that stance, just President Obama trying to undermine the Israeli/United States connection.
I suspect the news will be equally bad for Israel - not to mention ten times (or much more) the cost
Why do you not understand that Israel has given land back to the Palestinians in the past only to have to retake it because the Palestinians just won't stop trying to eliminate Israel from the face of the earth. There were reasons the other Arab countries refused to give Palestinians refuge. By the awy, it was Great Briton who pushed for a State of Israel, they just wanted to get out of the no win conflict they were having with the Jewish people.
It is idiotic.
To expect Israel to surrender land in favour of peace, when it renders serious problems with Israel's defense is nonsense.
Especially when Israel has tried it over and over, to no avail.
To gain peace with Hezbollah, Israel left Lebanon, and allowed the UN to draw the border, as Hezbollah claimed Israeli withdrawal was its only demand. You will notice Hezbollah is still around.
To gain peace with Egypt, Israel withdrew from the Sinai Peninsula. Now 54% of Egyptians in the new "Arab Spring" want the peace treaty thrown out. Pew poll of Egypt: 54% want to end treaty with Israel, 79% view U.S. unfavorably Hot Air
War with Egypt has become practically inevitable, without the Sinai buffer zone which was the ONLY thing that saved Israel in 1973. (oh, I mean along with the Golan Heights, the buffer zone against the Syrians)
To gain peace with the "occupied territories" Israel unilaterally abandoned Gaza, forcibly taking settlers with her..........as a test case, with plans to do the same in the West Bank. Guess what? Gaza instantly became a launch pad for attacks on Israel, and an even greater propaganda asset for anti-Israel idiots than it was when it was occupied!!!!!
There was a reason the 1967 war was a pre-emptive strike.....Israel is so tiny it can be over run in no time........Israel can not mobolize and stay that way, as her entire working population has to report for military duty.....
Return to the 1967 borders? Not bloody likely. Obama and the world can wish the moon was made of cheese, but that does not make it so.
First let me admit my mistake, there wasn't a Palestinian state before Israel it was a region covering parts of Syria and Trans-Jordon. But there wasn't and Israeli state either at that time. It matters not much exactly who were the biggest supporters of the creation of Israel what matters is that it was and is part of the western agenda to exert influence and control in the region. Israel was formed and founded against the wishes of Syria and Jordan and against the will of the occupants of the land. How anyone can believe this was fair or was going to be peaceful I don't know. Just think of how you would feel and react if someone who got consent from a guy across town started building all over your property, telling you they now owned it, and locked you in your house. It is pretty simple. The land was stolen. Israel is an illegal state. And everything should be set back to before it was formed and a complete do-over started from negotiations.
Much much worse, yes. Being massacred is generally considered undesirable.
Except the analogy fails. 1948 was a shift in sovereignty, not ownership. Note the Arabs who stayed. Hardly locked in their houses. Hardly built all over by people from across town.
In that case... perhaps we should start at home. Give Canada back to the First Nation and we should give back the US to the Native Americans. Then lets negotiate.
What do you say? Ready to move back to Europe?
If not... you're being even more of a hypocrite.
That isn't exactly the way history went down, the Balfour Declaration was a reply to Lord Rothschild enlisting Britain's help in creating a Jewish homeland in Palestine. How odd that that very land was Britain's just a year or so later, not so odd when you consider a WW only made the bankers richer as well as acheiving the other goal. You will notice that no letter is coming back saying the welfare of the local Arabs was a concern of the Rothschild Plan, there was no Gaza and no West Bank in their original proposal. That only means the same offer was made to the Ottoman Empire and they turned it down, WWI was the Rothschild solution for that hurdle.
If UN 181 has conditions that said everything had to be purchased then who was supposed to come up with the money? The Rothschild esaily have enough money but they are also the cheapest people on the planet. More than 1/2 of the 33 Nations that voted yes are classified a 3rd world so they can't pay. If no offers were extended then the land was stolen by force, the ones whom it was stolen from do not have to accept that, that should always be able to be challenged in the UN court system, it the outcome would be in Palestine's favor then any/all methods of stopping that court action would have to be taken. So far that is the route, eliminate Gaza and the West Bank.
With cruise missiles and directed bombs having the high ground isn't as important as it used to be so the Golan Heights are no longer 'vital'. Should the right to return be implemented then about 5M new Israel citizens would be wandering around in public, that would prevent any random bombs going off.
America is broke, the aid to Israel is going to dry up anyway so Israel of today is going to have to find other revenue, letting the Arabs return (and even form a majority) would mean 'donations' from the Nations that voted 'No' would most likely resume as the money would be used to benefit Arabs in the region, it would be a lot more than Israel currently receives and none of it would have to be in weapons.
The revolts going on actually make Israel safer as the vast majority of the ones involved are looking to better their own lives at home rather than looking for new lands to conquer. Take away the corruption (that includes World Banks and International Corporations and the people have enough to live on where border conflicts would be a waste of time and resources. No use sending all the school bullies to detention is the worst of the bunch is left alone.
A smoke house on every block???, nobody would have to move but a lot of rent would be due making them the richest people in the land.
AIPAC will get to hear Obama's pledge of allegiance to Israel during the speech this weekend. The 'conflict' is for American consumption, the illusion that they can and do stand up to Israel. What was the last deal he had for them, halt settlement building for 90 days and we'll give you 20 F-35's. The deal was withdrawn but they still wanted the planes. That is how independent he is from Israel.