CFL light bulbs

[YukonJack]

They seem to be the current politically correct rage. Here are some aspects that may make them less appealing. What do you think?

• CFL manufacturers claim that a 13-watt CFL emits the same amount of light as a 60-watt incandescent, but it doesn't seem to work that way in the real world. I've been in CFL-lit hotel rooms where I need a flashlight to read my dog-eared copy of The Road to Serfdom.
• Warm-up time: it takes up to 5 minutes for a CFL to reach full strength, which may be related to the point above (why CFLs seem less bright). My friend has installed them in a hallway where illumination is needed only for the thirty seconds it takes to navigate the staircase. Not ideal when Grandma visits and can't see the skateboard on the stairs.
• Few CFLs last for their advertised lifetimes of five years or more. Many people report replacing them after one year, making those return on investment numbers a bit less rosy. Using them in ceiling fixtures, on dimmers or timers, and for less than fifteen minutes per use reduce their life.
• CFLs contain mercury and should be returned to a hazardous waste center for disposal. Studies assume a 25% recycling rate, with the rest going into landfills. (The Westinghouse website recommends recycling only when disposing of "a large quantity" of fluorescent tubes and doesn't mention how to dispose of their CFLs.) According to a 2008 Yale study, burning coal to supply electricity to incandescent bulbs emits more mercury per bulb than a CFL contains, but regions that rely on cleaner fuels like natural gas experience greater mercury contamination with the introduction of CFLs. Why would environmentalists advocate to bring a toxic product into every home?
• Cleaning up a broken CFL doesn't require a haz-mat team, but you have to take significant precautions to avoid mercury contamination of living areas.
• Manufacturing CFLs is labor-intensive. No CFLs are made with expensive U.S. labor; most are made in China, where hundreds of factory workers in CFL plants have been hospitalized for mercury poisoning. The last major light bulb factory in the U.S., a GE plant in Winchester, VA, closed earlier this month.
• CFLs require six times as much energy to manufacture as incandescent bulbs, not to mention -- if you're concerned about such things -- the carbon footprint of shipping them from China.
• CFLs appear to cause migraines and epileptic seizures in a small number of people. Other health risks are being studied.
• CFLs work poorly in cold temperatures -- as a wintertime front porch light, for example. In cold climates, the heat of incandescent bulbs is a useful -- if inefficient -- byproduct.
• CFLs degrade the quality of the electric current (so-called "dirty electricity" with uneven sine waves) on a circuit into which they are plugged, causing problems for other electronic devices and possible health hazards to humans.

 

[gingersnap]

I went out last weekend looking for one of those GS filters that they talked about towards the end of the video and had no luck. I tried Rona, Home Depot and one of the larger lighting stores. Does anyone know where I can purchase one in the Greater Vancouver area or online? I can control what's in my home but unfortunately my boss has already switched the majority of the lighting where I work over to CFL bulbs and does not believe any of the studies that warn of health consequences.

 

[Nuggler]

:banghead:Tried them. Nope!!!!:banghead:

One was dimming, etc., went to change it and dang near burned me hand off. the base was so hot I couldn't hold it.

These were the ones CSA approved. Supposedly not the ones from China which were giving problems a couple of years ago.

So, just for the halibut, I changed another. Likewise EXTREMELY HOT:angryfire:

Just for the record, one CAN change an incandescent bulb by grabbing it down low on the stem. Not these babies!!!

Took'em all out and junked 'em!. Back to the old style regular light bulbs.

Now our buddy, Dalton McGuinty, says that in a few years, we ain't gonna be able to buy incandescent bulbs. PROGRESS, ME LAD!!!! :study: 21st century, and all..........eh.:help:

 

[Bar Sinister]

Every light in my house is a CFL light including cold weather versions I have in the garage. They work just fine even at -30. The first year I changed over I cut my electrical bill in half. They are rated at a five year lifespan, but I have a couple that have lasted for ten years now. No one in my family suffers any ill effects from the light so far as I know.

This might all be a moot point as the LED lights become more common. I have an LED flashlight that throws out quite a bit of light using AA batteries.

 

[Nuggler]

Every light in my house is a CFL light including cold weather versions I have in the garage. They work just fine even at -30. The first year I changed over I cut my electrical bill in half. They are rated at a five year lifespan, but I have a couple that have lasted for ten years now. No one in my family suffers any ill effects from the light so far as I know.

This might all be a moot point as the LED lights become more common. I have an LED flashlight that throws out quite a bit of light using AA batteries.

Your LIGHTBULBS are responsible for cutting your total hydro bill in half??8O

Ok, suppose it could happen, but seems a tad incredulous. Or I do. Or something.

 

[lone wolf]

Your LIGHTBULBS are responsible for cutting your total hydro bill in half??8O

Ok, suppose it could happen, but seems a tad incredulous. Or I do. Or something.

Maybe - if the heat, stove, water heater and dryer are all gas....

 

[Dexter Sinister]

Some of the claims in the OP are nonsense, some I don't know about. It seems plausible to me that CFLs take more energy to manufacture than incandescent bulbs, for instance, but six times seems a bit high. Nor does it surprise me that sloppy health and safety standards in China would lead to workers with mercury poisoning, that's entirely too likely. I was able to find a credible reference claiming that there's about 700 times as much mercury in a serving of canned tuna as there is in a CFL, 48 micrograms versus .07 micrograms, so I doubt contamination of living areas from a broken CFL is an issue. You'd have to break thousands of them. And I can't really tell what that guy in the video is measuring, and with what. One of his instruments looks like an old fashioned voltmeter, which wouldn't measure what he claims, the other's just a little white box with a single digital readout on it, no clue what the units are or what's being measured. He really needs an oscilloscope to measure what he's claiming. I'm pretty sure that "dirty electricity" claim is BS though. Any electrical load will introduce some noise in the input signal, and it comes from the electrical utility with noise in it, I can see it in the software that monitors the power conditioner my computer's plugged into. The incoming sine wave looks like it has tiny little hairs on it. It's very low amplitude non-ionizing radiation anyway, which has no known health effects despite years of attempts to demonstrate the contrary. In the absence of better information, I'm inclined to dismiss that video as just another poorly done media science report, with a bit of the old scare tactics thrown in to get your attention.

 

[Tonington]

In the absence of better information, I'm inclined to dismiss that video as just another poorly done media science report, with a bit of the old scare tactics thrown in to get your attention.

I agree with your analysis Dex. It's pseudoscience with scare tactics. One, not I, might also add that it's all the politically correct rage to do so...

 

[Goober]

I agree with your analysis Dex. It's pseudoscience with scare tactics. One, not I, might also add that it's all the politically correct rage to do so...

As I mentioned on another thread regarding this topic - Those with Lupus should NOT, NOT have these in their house or workplace - They cause flareups and yes it is documented. I do not know how it affects or not other auto immune diseases.

So I turfed em - went with halogen for now and still use the old style bulbs. Which go off the market in a year or so at the most from what i recall.

 

[Dexter Sinister]

As I mentioned on another thread regarding this topic - Those with Lupus should NOT, NOT have these in their house or workplace.

That's interesting, and somewhat to my surprise after a little work with Google, appears to be true. CFL's produce enough UV to be bad for people with light-sensitive conditions like Lupus. If I hadn't seen that claim first from a known crackpot I'd probably have investigated it at the time instead of dismissing it as more "crying wolf." I guess even the crackpots are right some of the time.

 

[Tonington]

That seems perfectly sensible Goob. If there is a documented case, then it's foolish to proceed as if such an effect wasn't validated.

But much of this OP stuff is nonsense. The CF lightbulbs I own have moved through three apartments in 4 years, without needing replacement. They are brighter than a 60 watt incandescent (900 lumens for my 13 W CF, 520 lumens for standard 60 W incandescent.) There's more mercury in my cupboard then all of my CF lightbulbs combined.

Sure the warm up can be longer, so don't leave a skateboard on the stairs. Don't be a douche. I mean there is something to be said for common sense. Use the bulb that works best on your cold porch...google isn't advanced technology for the everyday computer user...

 

[Goober]

That seems perfectly sensible Goob. If there is a documented case, then it's foolish to proceed as if such an effect wasn't validated.

But much of this OP stuff is nonsense. The CF lightbulbs I own have moved through three apartments in 4 years, without needing replacement. They are brighter than a 60 watt incandescent (900 lumens for my 13 W CF, 520 lumens for standard 60 W incandescent.) There's more mercury in my cupboard then all of my CF lightbulbs combined.

Sure the warm up can be longer, so don't leave a skateboard on the stairs. Don't be a douche. I mean there is something to be said for common sense. Use the bulb that works best on your cold porch...google isn't advanced technology for the everyday computer user...

I agree - and if they drop on the floor - careful attention to cleanup - Lots of pseudo science and same with so called fact on the net. Nutbars are everywhere since the Net came along.

 

[Avro]

Who needs CFL's anyways?

 

[Bar Sinister]

Your LIGHTBULBS are responsible for cutting your total hydro bill in half??8O

Ok, suppose it could happen, but seems a tad incredulous. Or I do. Or something.

I have a modern house. When I bought it all of the lighting was incandescent including a number of halogens, some of which cost more than $20 each to replace. In spite of my nagging and my practice of running around turning off lights in the wake of my family memebers I could not get them to conscientiously turn off lights they were not using. At times there were up to 30 lights on in the house at once. The once thing I could do was reduce the electricity used by all of these lights by about 80% by switching to CFLs. It knocked my electricity bill down from about $400 a month to about $200.

 

[Dexter Sinister]

That's my experience too, though the amounts of money are a little different, my power bill's gone from around $180 to $110 a month with CFL bulbs in all the bedrooms, the kitchen, and the bathrooms. Nobody turns off anything in my house but me, it seems. I walk into a room, all the lights are on, the tv is on, and there's nobody there. There are only two people living in my house now, including me, there are three tv sets, three bedrooms, my office, my wife's office, a family room that doesn't get used since the children moved out, a kitchen, a dining room, two bathrooms, and living room. I'm retired, I've been alone in the house after my wife's gone to work (she's a bit younger than I am) and found every tv set and every light in the house on. Makes me crazy.

 

[Nuggler]

:lol: Well, there ya go!!

I have only one lightbulb (incandescent), which I carry around with me from room to room. Must be the reason for the low hydro bill.

No one but me finds the CFL light bulbs get dangerously hot??

Maybe I got a bad batch.

There are only two people in our house also, and I'm the one who leaves the lights on.

It does tend to make my dear wife crazy. It's not that I do it on purpose.:male:

:study:

 

[relic]

We switched and then switched back to incandescent in the bathroom,that's where the most bulbs were,four above the mirror,and the cfls were making m'lady sick.It seemed to be the concentration,the single bulbs in other locations,like by her knitting chair ,didn't seem to have any ill effect.
As to the heat,most cfls run cooler,but some made in China run dangerously hot,there have,in the past been warnings about certain batches actually starting fires.

 

[Bcool]

That's my experience too, though the amounts of money are a little different, my power bill's gone from around $180 to $110 a month with CFL bulbs in all the bedrooms, the kitchen, and the bathrooms. Nobody turns off anything in my house but me, it seems. I walk into a room, all the lights are on, the tv is on, and there's nobody there. There are only two people living in my house now, including me, there are three tv sets, three bedrooms, my office, my wife's office, a family room that doesn't get used since the children moved out, a kitchen, a dining room, two bathrooms, and living room. I'm retired, I've been alone in the house after my wife's gone to work (she's a bit younger than I am) and found every tv set and every light in the house on. Makes me crazy.

LOL It's the reverse at our place. I've watched my husband turn on every light in the LR (CFL bulbs), amble off through the small breakfast room switching on the overhead fan and all the lights as he ambles through, then he's off in the kitchen where I know I will later find every light switched on and probably the cold water running still - he likes to run it while getting ice in his glass but seems to have a problem remembering to turn the water off, then with iced water & whatever snack (the fridge doors close automatically thank goodness, unfortunately drawers, cupboard & pantry doors do not!) he'll detour through the dining room turning on the chandelier in there 'cos he likes the way it looks or something, ambles back to the living room to eat snack & click his way through the tv channels while turning on his laptop, nothing to watch apparently so he then ambles off to the 'toy room' where he turns on all the lights and switches on the desktop computer, while that's booting up a visit to the bathroom of course leaving all lights and fans going full blast and on his way to the bedroom to change clothes switching on ceiling fan and all lights, ambles back to the toy room and before he sits down at the computer he switches on the deck lights so he can watch the bats and night birds hunt the moths the lights attract between doing stuff on the computer.... Once I know he's settled for a while I start doing my amble through switching stuff off, thankful that he rarely uses the bigger bathroom as its a longer walk and involves going through the second bedroom - both of which have fans and tons of lights! He was commenting on how much our hydro bill seemed to be lately - I kind of got the giggles. :sign7::sign7::sign7::sign7::sign7::sign7: :glasses2:

 

[Ron in Regina]

4-5yrs back, I switched almost all the bulbs in my home from the older style
Incandescent bulbs to the CFL's. Having my power bills on equalized
payments, & with annual increases in utility costs....if I've seen any
monetary savings due to the switch, then they've been lost in the
shuffle.

I have some track lighting in my kitchen, and a light bar in my bathroom, and
a security motion flood light outdoors that I couldn't switch over, but every
other Incandescent bulb was replaced at that time.

What I can say though is that I haven't had to change a CFL bulb out since
I started using them. Not a single one. That alone is pretty cool in itself.

 

[bill barilko]

I switched over then when I couldn't stand the weak awful light they give out switched back to old style.

In an apartment there's no costs saving I could determine.