Liberal phobia and the cause….

[JLM]

Gun control is by no means idiotic, JLM. There is strict gun control in all the developed countries except USA (and Switzerland). Some of them have stricter gun control than Canada (e.g. Great Britain or Australia).

Ready availability of guns is an Americanism, a hold over from the Wild West, shoot from the hip mentality.

USA is virtually alone among developed countries in having no gun control, in many places, it is easier to buy a gun that to buy a loaf of bread. USA also has one of the highest crime rates in the developed world. I think the two are connected.

Even in Canada, I think gun ownership is much higher in the West, and crime is also much higher in the West, compared to Ontario and Quebec. Coquitlam is the murder capital of Canada (or at least it used to be, I don't know which is the murder capital now, but you may be sure it is in the west).

I for one am glad that Liberals gave us gun control. I am totally opposed to the conservative shoot from the hip, shoot first, ask questions later mentality.

The way you talk just shows how little you know about guns, you've been watching too much T.V. I grew up in an era and area where guns were as common place as hammers, saws, shovels and rakes. To a lot of men it was one of their top possessions rating up there with their wife and their truck. Guns are only dangerous in the hands of criminals and those who are ignorant of their use and how to handle them.

 

[lone wolf]

The way you talk just shows how little you know about guns, you've been watching too much T.V. I grew up in an era and area where guns were as common place as hammers, saws, shovels and rakes. To a lot of men it was one of their top possessions rating up there with their wife and their truck. Guns are only dangerous in the hands of criminals and those who are ignorant of their use and how to handle them.

Ask mister Statistics how many crimes are committed with guns ... and how many of those guns are long rifles - the target of Gun Control Law persecution.

 

[JLM]

I'd sure like to see statistics proving crime is higher in the west (say west of Thunder Bay) - I very much doubt there is much difference. What percentage of crime involves guns? 2%, 3% at the most 5%.? Your imagining things are so doesn't MAKE them so, S.J. When I said "statistics" I meant reliable "statistics" not "statistics" that are "conveniently" found to support the premise. LOL

 

[Ron in Regina]

Liberal phobia and the cause….

Oh Man...now I've been baited into a sidetrack too. :-(

This Thread is about: Liberal phobia and the cause….

 

[L Gilbert]

Yeah, wikipedia, I trust them. You know that Maurice Strong wants control of Wikipedia don't you? Google him, he's a scary guy, former president of Power Corp, the guy who helped Paul Martin buy CSL, the king maker of Canadian politics and now in the UN. The left loves to confuse us for their own gain. Don't be fooled.

I don't give a crap who controls what, facts are facts.
Show us some links that prove Wiki wrong then.

According to Princeton University left-wing means "those who support varying degrees of social or political or economic change designed to promote the public welfare "
and right-wing means " those who support political or social or economic conservatism; those who believe that things are better left unchanged ".

Random House Dictionary says left-wing is,
"1.members of a liberal or radical political party, or those favoring extensive political reform.

2.such a party or a group of such parties.

3.the part of a political or social organization advocating a liberal or radical position."


and right-wing is
"1.members of a conservative or reactionary political party, or those opposing extensive political reform.

2.such a political party or a group of such parties.

3.that part of a political or social organization advocating a conservative or reactionary position: The union's right wing favored a moderate course of action."

Left-wing, leftist: A Glossary of Political Economy Terms - Dr. Paul M. Johnson
Right-wing, rightist: A Glossary of Political Economy Terms - Dr. Paul M. Johnson

Left-wing and right-wing ideologies are independent of libertarian/authoritarian ideologies.

 

[countryboy]

By your definition, bob (and may be an academic definition given in some book). But that is not how left and right is characterized these days.

Indeed, religious left is totally different from religious right. The favorite issues of religious right are abortion, homosexuality, contraception, Creationism, pornography, death penalty, privatized medicine etc.

The favorite issues of religious left (and there is a religious left, just that it doesn’t make as much a nuisance of itself as religious right does) are poverty, social justice, minority rights, environmentalism, global warming etc.

The term religious left has a totally different meaning from religious right.

Well, Bob, now you've been told the truth! Please consider yourself both enlightened and corrected.

But, now I'm confused...you were laying out some very good thoughts and facts in previous posts and there I was, being lured into your web of information that has now been proven - beyond any shadow of a doubt - to be false, inaccurate, and just plain wrong.

Damn...I was hoping you were right because it really did sound good to me. Ah well, 'twas not to be, I guess. :lol:

Edit: You have to understand that I suffer from Liberal phobia and there is no way that I would dare to think negative thoughts coming from one of the best!

 

[lone wolf]

Oh Man...now I've been baited into a sidetrack too. :-(

This Thread is about: Liberal phobia and the cause….

Gun control is a Liberal Government money-grab....


BTW, did anyone else get the pamphlet about Pension Reform? Three changes are mentioned but only one is described. Response goes to sender - Ujjal Dosanjh of Liberal Caucus Services.

Bill C-428 anyone?

 

[JLM]

Oh Man...now I've been baited into a sidetrack too. :-(

This Thread is about: Liberal phobia and the cause….

WE are still on track Ron, as long as there is a Liberal on here who has a phobia about guns..........................:lol::lol::lol: But rest assured my comments on guns on this thread are done.

 

[L Gilbert]

Because the charts are shyte, they over complicate things. It is far too simple, but people are paid huge amounts of money to obfuscate the truth. Get with it, we are consantantly being lied to. No wonder we are in the state we are in, no one can see the truth.

rofl Make up your mind, it is complicated or far too simple.

What happened? You did the quiz and discovered you're right beside Ghandi on the chart?

 

[countryboy]

The way you talk just shows how little you know about guns, you've been watching too much T.V. I grew up in an era and area where guns were as common place as hammers, saws, shovels and rakes. To a lot of men it was one of their top possessions rating up there with their wife and their truck. Guns are only dangerous in the hands of criminals and those who are ignorant of their use and how to handle them.

You forgot to mention extremist Liberals. (I have a phobia)

 

[L Gilbert]

Libertarianism means minimal government intervention.

Right.

As to Switzerland, I think what they have more resembles direct democracy, rather than a Libertarian government. If fact, their recent referendum, where they banned the use of minarets on mosques, positively smacks of authoritarianism, rather than Libertarianism. A Libertarian government would not care whether Muslims used minarets in their mosques or not.

One example? That defines everything Swiss? rofl

The Swiss model | Samizdata.net

Costa Ricxa is another fairly libertarian country.

No, I can’t accept that Switzerland is a Libertarian government. It is more direct democracy.

And you cannot conceive that democracy can be libertarian? That figures.

 

[L Gilbert]

Anyway, I am Liberalphobic, not liberalphobic. So far, the Liberal Party is just as foul as the Conservative Party, IMO, and in general I will take liberalism over conservativism (except fiscally) mostly because times change, demographics change, and a lot of other stuff changes so I think society (gov't) should change as well..

 

[bobnoorduyn]

By your definition, bob (and may be an academic definition given in some book). But that is not how left and right is characterized these days.

Indeed, religious left is totally different from religious right. The favorite issues of religious right are abortion, homosexuality, contraception, Creationism, pornography, death penalty, privatized medicine etc.

The favorite issues of religious left (and there is a religious left, just that it doesn’t make as much a nuisance of itself as religious right does) are poverty, social justice, minority rights, environmentalism, global warming etc.

The term religious left has a totally different meaning from religious right.

You are getting into sub groups now. but politically, your religious right is still on the left of the spectrum. The over complication of these aspects are what confuse people into voting certain ways, and they invariably drift to the left. Liberals, or progressives, or the left leaning, whatever you want to call yourself or them, love complex systems to come up with labels, when the whole thing isn't that complicated. It is a game to get folks to vote a certain way, all factions are guilty of it, recognition of the system is key to prevention of falling victim to it, and everyone here, (save for a few) are doing just that.

 

[bobnoorduyn]

Libertarianism means minimal government intervention. Libertarians don’t mind some intervention, such as defense, justice system, monetary system etc. (as opposed to Propertarians, who are opposed to all government intervention).

As to Switzerland, I think what they have more resembles direct democracy, rather than a Libertarian government. If fact, their recent referendum, where they banned the use of minarets on mosques, positively smacks of authoritarianism, rather than Libertarianism. A Libertarian government would not care whether Muslims used minarets in their mosques or not.

No, I can’t accept that Switzerland is a Libertarian government. It is more direct democracy.

Well, you and I agree on liberatarian government, one which I think is ideal. I said that Switzerland is as close as we can get, (and so is Israel for that matter). But you have also highlighted the folly of direct democracy. Whether you or I agree with them is irrelevent, direct democracy will certainly do the same for me as it will for you, or to you or I. Democracy is inherently bad, but what Switzerland has otherwise is good, for the time being, but it ain't black and white.

 

[bobnoorduyn]

I don't see anything wrong with occasional candy, bob.

Nor do I, but it's use for making policy isn't a good idea.

 

[L Gilbert]

Can't find anything that refutes what I posted below, Bob? I am not surprised.

I don't give a crap who controls what, facts are facts.
Show us some links that prove Wiki wrong then.

According to Princeton University left-wing means "those who support varying degrees of social or political or economic change designed to promote the public welfare "
and right-wing means " those who support political or social or economic conservatism; those who believe that things are better left unchanged ".

Random House Dictionary says left-wing is,
"1.members of a liberal or radical political party, or those favoring extensive political reform.

2.such a party or a group of such parties.

3.the part of a political or social organization advocating a liberal or radical position."


and right-wing is
"1.members of a conservative or reactionary political party, or those opposing extensive political reform.

2.such a political party or a group of such parties.

3.that part of a political or social organization advocating a conservative or reactionary position: The union's right wing favored a moderate course of action."

Left-wing, leftist: A Glossary of Political Economy Terms - Dr. Paul M. Johnson
Right-wing, rightist: A Glossary of Political Economy Terms - Dr. Paul M. Johnson

Left-wing and right-wing ideologies are independent of libertarian/authoritarian ideologies.

 

[bobnoorduyn]

The way you talk just shows how little you know about guns, you've been watching too much T.V. I grew up in an era and area where guns were as common place as hammers, saws, shovels and rakes. To a lot of men it was one of their top possessions rating up there with their wife and their truck. Guns are only dangerous in the hands of criminals and those who are ignorant of their use and how to handle them.

You are far to close to the truth, Hollywood demonizes the the gun, (even through glorification, you have to understand subliminal messages) in the their Wild West, gangster, war, whatever movies. Hollywierd is not real, but that is what people see and percieve as reality. To bad. I'm sorry I've had to live reality, it would make for a Hollywood blockbuster, but they're not interested, because it is too real.

 

[bobnoorduyn]

Can't find anything that refutes what I posted below, Bob? I am not surprised.

You are a busy little beaver Les, but sorry, I've been busy myself. I don't really care what you think of what I say, I just see a train coming at me at a great rate of speed. If you want to embrace it, suit yourself. I'm jumping out of the way. See ya.

 

[L Gilbert]

You are a busy little beaver Les, but sorry, I've been busy myself. I don't really care what you think of what I say, I just see a train coming at me at a great rate of speed. If you want to embrace it, suit yourself. I'm jumping out of the way. See ya.

Sorry, I'm neither little nor am I a beaver. And it isn't what I think of what you say, it's what the facts are that points to your errors. I proved what I said and you can't prove what you've said. It's simple.
What do trains have to do with anything?

 

[SirJosephPorter]

Hmmm....how 'bout Crimes committed with Guns. Who's higher? The East or the West?

The West (as I recall). A few days ago I posted a comparison of crime in Ontario and Alberta. Crime rate in Alberta was much higher in almost every category. Murder, rape assault, the whole thing.