The Foods We Eat and what they can do.

#juan

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Aug 30, 2005
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The good thing about doing that is that the ground beef that you buy comes from one cow, and the butcher (and you) look at it before it's ground. When the packing house ground beef is sold to the stores, some estimates are that any pound of ground beef could have meat from hundreds of different cows in the package.

Never thought of that. I have a small meat grinder and when I bought it, I was going to use it for all our ground meat needs. Alas my laziness creeps in and here and there, I buy the odd bit of ground beef. If they only made these things easier to clean...;-)
 

talloola

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Nov 14, 2006
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If I am remembering correctly, mad cow disease is because live beef have been fed
"ground up dead animals', which could have died from disease", which I'm sure isn't done any more, and don't know if it ever was done in Canada.
Does anyone know the stats.
 

karrie

OogedyBoogedy
Jan 6, 2007
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If I am remembering correctly, mad cow disease is because live beef have been fed
"ground up dead animals', which could have died from disease", which I'm sure isn't done any more, and don't know if it ever was done in Canada.
Does anyone know the stats.

breakouts are caused that way, but, it does happen occasionally without being fed other animals (ie, the animals that first get sick and end up fed). It's why we're not supposed to eat 'downed' animals. But, not all slaughter houses are honest enough not to.
 

Ron in Regina

"Voice of the West" Party
Apr 9, 2008
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You are probably safer eating liver than ground beef. It seems to me that spongif....Mad Cow disease is passed through nerve tissue and you don't know what part or parts of the animal are in ground beef.


The good thing about doing that is that the ground beef that you buy comes from one cow, and the butcher (and you) look at it before it's ground. When the packing house ground beef is sold to the stores, some estimates are that any pound of ground beef could have meat from hundreds of different cows in the package.


I don't know how much I can expand on this, but for a short time when I was
much younger, I worked in a Packing Plant (beef) in Red Deer, Alberta for
all of four months while I was waiting for a call to head into the Patch.

I worked in what was called the Boning room. The last stage in a Packing
Plant, where final cuts where made and meat was sorted, cry-vac'd, boxed,
and shipped to a cooler.

The meat for ground beef would be gathered in boxes that just fit on a pallet.
Four foot x four foot x five foot tall. We'd fill six to eight of those each day
between myself and my partner....both of us running Wizard Knives. These
wickedly nasty tools looked like an ice cream scooper with the scoop missing
so just a hollow hole. It had a circular razor blade on this tool and a heavy cable
that ran through the handle and up to the motor, which spun that razor blade at
11,000rpm. That power knife in one hand, and a hook in the other which was
wrapped in a chain-link glove and a fiberglass forearm guard.

My partner & I worked back to back as the two Wizard Knife Operators worked
best if one each was Left & Right handed. Being the Left handed Guy, I cleaned
the Right side of the 1/2 carcass. Each side at that point consisted of the neck
connected to the entire spine & ribs, but literally sliced down the middle.

We would strip everything off the spines and ribs and necks, very quickly getting
into every nook and cranny with those nasty tools...that others on the line couldn't
get with their knives. That meat into those 4'x4'x5' is your meat that gets ground
into commercial ground beef. It's many years ago, but 125 workers processed
(if I recall correctly) about 600 Head/day....and about 2/3rds of those where shipped
out as 1/2's & 1/4's in refrigerated rail-cars and Reefer unit trailers...so quick math
says about 200 through the Boning Room, and 6-8 of those 4'x4'x5' palleted bins
filled each day....so each bin shipped out & eventually ground up would contain on
average the meat from maybe 35 different animals. That would be a more realistic
number for the potential number of different animals your pound of ground beef
most likely might contain.

I don't miss that job, and it took years to really get over the Tendonitis in my left wrist
from that vibrating Wizard Knife.
 

#juan

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Aug 30, 2005
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If I am remembering correctly, mad cow disease is because live beef have been fed
"ground up dead animals', which could have died from disease", which I'm sure isn't done any more, and don't know if it ever was done in Canada.
Does anyone know the stats.

Here is the full story

Mad Cow in Canada: The science and the story
CBC News Online | August 24, 2006

In August 2006, the Canadian Food Inspection Agency, the federal regulator responsible for monitoring the safety of Canadian cattle, confirmed a case of mad cow disease in an older cow in Alberta. It was the fifth case in 2006 and the eighth since 2003.

The agency said locating the cow shows the success of its monitoring program.

Brad Wildeman, vice-president of the Canadian Cattlemen's Association, took the same line.

More infected animals have been found because of the extent of the testing, he said.

"We probably have the most aggressive, safest beef supply of any country in the world."

For years, Canada had been virtually free of mad cow disease. But in May 2003, veterinary officials in Alberta confirmed that a sick cow sent to a slaughterhouse in January of that year had been inspected, found to be substandard, and removed so that it would not end up as food for humans or other animals.

The carcass was, however, sent to a processing plant for rendering into oils. Its head was kept for testing. Samples were sent to the world testing laboratories in the U.K., which confirmed the case of mad cow.

"What is important is that the system worked," said Shirley McClellan, Alberta's agriculture minister at the time. "We have a very thorough and respected inspection system." She was insistent to remind the public that the disease is not contagious within a herd.

But McClellan's assurances didn't stop the U.S., Japan, South Korea, Australia and other countries from imposing temporary import bans of Canadian beef.

QUICK FACTS

Canada has close to 13.5 million cows and calves. About 5.7 million (or 42 per cent) are in Alberta. Canada's total beef exports amount to $2.2 billion annually, and have risen sharply in recent years. Since 1991, beef exports have risen from 100,000 tonnes to about 500,000 tonnes. Growth in exports has been greatest to Japan, South Korea and Mexico. Alberta's share of total beef exports is 39 per cent (worth about $860 million a year).

Several ranches in Alberta, B.C. and Saskatchewan were quarantined as a precaution, including the infected cow's home ranch.

In an investigation into the source of the infection, 1,400 cows were slaughtered and tested for the disease. No other cows were found to have BSE until late December, 2004.

Western premiers demanded $360 million compensation from the federal government for losses to the beef industry because of the mad cow scare. Ottawa would later offer $190 million.

Over the summer of 2003, cattle ranchers held barbeques across Canada to help promote Canadian beef.

In August, the U.S. reopened its borders to some Canadian beef, but the border was still closed to live cattle. By this time, a cow that would have normally sold for $1,300 was selling for $15. Canadian beef producers asked Ottawa to approve a mass slaughter of 620,000 cattle to reduce the size of the herd and prevent further damage to the industry.

In October, CBC News reported that the border would reopen to live cattle in December 2003. But on Dec. 23, 2003, the U.S. announced that it had discovered its first apparent case of BSE in a cow in Washington state.

Several countries banned beef from the U.S. soon after the announcement, but Canada restricted imports only on some products made from cattle and other ruminants. It still allowed the import of cattle destined for immediate slaughter, boneless beef from cattle under 30 months of age and dairy products.

DNA evidence later revealed that the cow was born in Canada, and the U.S. kept its border shut to live Canadian cattle.

QUICK FACTS

March 29, 2005: Federal government announces $321 million in immediate assistance to cattle ranchers and other animal producers. Sept. 10, 2004: Federal government gives $488 million in aid to cattle producers. March 22, 2004: Federal government releases $680 million in mad cow relief to cattle farmers. June 19, 2003: Federal government announces $190 million in BSE compensation and pledges to spend $30 million on excess beef. The joint federal-provincial aid program totals $460 million.

It took a little more than a year for the United States to announce that it would reopen its border to live Canadian cattle younger than 30 months..

On Dec. 29, 2004, The USDA announced that it recognized Canada as a "minimal-risk region" for BSE and imports of young Canadian cattle would resume March 7, 2005.

The new classification means the U.S. will not again close its borders to Canadian beef unless there are two or more cases of BSE per one million cattle older than 24 months of age in each of four consecutive years. Simply put, Canada can have up to 11 cases of BSE and still be considered a safe country for cattle exports.

The move came less than a month after U.S. President George W. Bush made his first official visit to Canada and said the process for reopening the border was underway.

However, five days before the ban was to be lifted, a U.S. judge granted a temporary injunction to stop the reopening of the border. The ban came at the request of a group of American ranchers called R-CALF, who filed a lawsuit saying reopening the border would cause irreparable damage to the U.S. beef market.

In June 2005, the U.S. Department of Agriculture confirmed the country's second known case of BSE, in a Texas-born cow.

And on July 14, 2005, a three-judge panel of the U.S. Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals overturned a temporary injunction that banned importation of Canadian cattle. U.S. Agriculture Secretary Mike Johanns announced that day that the U.S. border was "immediately" open to live Canadian cattle.

The British connection

Previously, Canada had only one case of a cow infected with BSE. The animal, reported on a farm near Red Deer, Alta., in December of 1993, was imported from Britain. Agriculture Canada opted to destroy the animal and its five herd mates.

Mexico, one of the largest importers of Canadian beef at the time, temporarily banned imports of Canadian cattle after the incident. The United States, another major consumer of Canadian beef, sent observers to Canada to see how the incident was handled.

As a result, and because of the rumours of possible human health implications circulating in Britain, the Ministry of Agriculture decided to destroy any animal imported from Britain between 1982 and 1990, the year a ban was placed on British beef imports to Canada. This slaughter also included the offspring of any of those animals.

All told, 363 animals were destroyed and their owners compensated. Some said the destruction was unnecessary, especially the farmers whose cattle were killed, but the ministry said it was better to err on the side of caution after seeing what was happening in Britain. As of January 2005, 148 Britons had died of vCJD and five others were infected but still living.

During the summer of 1995, the disease surfaced again. The Canadian Red Cross Society revealed two of its donors had died of Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease, CJD. Two years later, concern over blood was raised again after a man was found to be a carrier of a gene linked to a hereditary form of CJD.

In August 2002, doctors confirmed a man in Saskatchewan died from new variant CJD – the human counterpart to mad cow disease. He had spent some time in the United Kingdom and it appeared he acquired the disease while he was there, doctors said.

The man had an endoscopic examination before he died and that equipment was then used on other patients. However, because of disinfection and cleaning procedures, the risk of cross contamination is minute. Public health officials phoned patients who had received examinations with the endoscope to inform them.

It's still not known if the disease can be transmitted through blood products.

In 1996, the Canadian government suspended imports of British beef embryos and semen. Agriculture Canada also began a review of the practice of using meat meal and bone meal as a protein source in beef cattle feed.

In 1997, changes designed to keep animal parts out of animal feeds were implemented. Among them, Ottawa made it illegal to give beef herds products made from rendered cattle. However, rendered cattle could be used in feed for pigs and poultry.

A month after Canada's first case of BSE, a panel of experts recommended that the parts of the cow that can pass on BSE, such as the brain and spine should be kept out of all animal feed. That's policy in most European countries.

It's a recommendation that has met stiff resistance in the beef industry. Including rendered cattle parts in feed means disposing of heads and intestines can make money for cattle farmers instead of costing them money.

Meanwhile, documents obtained by CBC News through the Access to Information Act show that in the weeks after that first case of BSE, cattle were allowed to eat feed meant for chicken and pigs. Some of the feed was likely made from the original diseased cow.

The federal agriculture minister at the time, Andy Mitchell, said the government is moving to ban the use of cattle remains in all feed. The regulations were due to be in place by the middle of 2005.

In fact, the CFIA got the right in July 2005 to make violators of its rules pay penalties; before that, it had been limited to warnings, seizure of products that broke the rules, suspension or cancellation of permits and prosecutions.

In June 2006, the agency said that effective July 2007, it "is banning cattle tissues capable of transmitting bovine spongiform encephalopathy from all animal feeds, pet foods and fertilizers."

But small establishments will get additional time to comply. The government said it had allocated $80 million to help the industry implement the new rules.
 

AnnaG

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Jul 5, 2009
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The good thing about doing that is that the ground beef that you buy comes from one cow, and the butcher (and you) look at it before it's ground. When the packing house ground beef is sold to the stores, some estimates are that any pound of ground beef could have meat from hundreds of different cows in the package.
That's exactly what happens. The grinders have hoppers, and the ground meat (pork, beef, chicken, etc) cuttings from the better cuts are all thrown into the hopper. So you get a half dozen butchers each with a side of beef all throwing bits into the hoppers, or adding the bits to a conveyor belt, or boxes which feed the hopper and you get ground beef (chicken, pork, etc) ....
 

talloola

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Nov 14, 2006
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Here is the full story

Mad Cow in Canada: The science and the story
CBC News Online | August 24, 2006

Thanks Juan, good article, and seems there was much politics going on, from
below the 49th, I am satisfied with our Canadian approach to this problem,
and feel comfortable with our farmers, and everyone else down the line, to
take the best care of our beef products that they can.
 

Liberalman

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Mar 18, 2007
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America has no reported case of Mad cow or BSE because they don't test their animals and the ones they suspect of haning any illness is simply exported
 

Mowich

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I stopped eating beef and pork about 15 years ago on the advice of my doctor. I was starting to have constant pain in my joints, especially those in my hands. He told me that if I quit eating beef and pork, it would improve, and he was absolutely right, it did.

I found out from him later that the antibiotics and hormones that are fed to feedlot cattle, where the majority of supermarket meat comes from, can have adverse affects on people, and I lucked out.

I missed eating meat, a lot, then our local butcher came to the rescue, in a manner of speaking. He began to bring in local bison. Grass-fed, open range bison that were not finished on corn or grain- thank you very much. No antibiotics, no hormones, just good and very tasty meat.

At first, all John was able to bring in was ground bison. Word spread, demand grew and now we can buy roasts, steaks, and sausages too.
 

VanIsle

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Nov 12, 2008
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I stopped eating beef and pork about 15 years ago on the advice of my doctor. I was starting to have constant pain in my joints, especially those in my hands. He told me that if I quit eating beef and pork, it would improve, and he was absolutely right, it did.

I found out from him later that the antibiotics and hormones that are fed to feedlot cattle, where the majority of supermarket meat comes from, can have adverse affects on people, and I lucked out.

I missed eating meat, a lot, then our local butcher came to the rescue, in a manner of speaking. He began to bring in local bison. Grass-fed, open range bison that were not finished on corn or grain- thank you very much. No antibiotics, no hormones, just good and very tasty meat.

At first, all John was able to bring in was ground bison. Word spread, demand grew and now we can buy roasts, steaks, and sausages too.
That's very interesting.
 

Nuggler

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Feb 27, 2006
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Backwater, Ontario.
You are probably safer eating liver than ground beef. It seems to me that spongif....Mad Cow disease is passed through nerve tissue and you don't know what part or parts of the animal are in ground beef.


Lips and assholes, Juan. Or is that hotdogs?

Gonna be a lot of people getting Loonie Cow if it's in hamburg. Local grocery bistro puts HB on sale, and the lineups go on forever. Worse than HINI supplicants.

A long long long long time ago when we were so poor the mice used to bring us food, we ate a lot of liver, baloney, small potatoes, and day old bread n greens.

Swear to hoosehisname, I smell liver cooking now, and just about puke; don't care if it's from a dead calf or deceased porker.........just can't freakin stand it.

Here's a kicker. In Canada, they still feed animal byproducts to chickens and pigs. They have well, sorta, maybe, stopped feeding cows to cows, but, hey, really no time to check that .

So we all live on borrowed time, and may end our days walking into walls and drooling...............even more than we do now.

Gotta hand it to the Brits. When their mad cow stuff surfaced, they just STOPPED feeding animals to animals. We should do the same, but no one seems to give a fark.:tard:
 

JLM

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I stopped eating beef and pork about 15 years ago on the advice of my doctor. I was starting to have constant pain in my joints, especially those in my hands. He told me that if I quit eating beef and pork, it would improve, and he was absolutely right, it did.

I found out from him later that the antibiotics and hormones that are fed to feedlot cattle, where the majority of supermarket meat comes from, can have adverse affects on people, and I lucked out.

I missed eating meat, a lot, then our local butcher came to the rescue, in a manner of speaking. He began to bring in local bison. Grass-fed, open range bison that were not finished on corn or grain- thank you very much. No antibiotics, no hormones, just good and very tasty meat.

At first, all John was able to bring in was ground bison. Word spread, demand grew and now we can buy roasts, steaks, and sausages too.

I don't think it matters much what red meat you eat as long as you get some. Red meat is virtually the only practical source of vitamin B12, also I find personally that meat is important for strength. What amazes me is that some people rather than just cutting back on meat quit it altogether, like they are afraid of it. I find the answer for eating is to include as many foods as possible (with the exception of limburger cheese, yogurt and tofu) and the total elimination of any food is not going to do you any good. Having said that a couple of ounces of red meat a day is all that is necessary, as long as you get enough, eggs, fish, cheese and poultry.
 

Mowich

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I don't think it matters much what red meat you eat as long as you get some. Red meat is virtually the only practical source of vitamin B12, also I find personally that meat is important for strength. What amazes me is that some people rather than just cutting back on meat quit it altogether, like they are afraid of it. I find the answer for eating is to include as many foods as possible (with the exception of limburger cheese, yogurt and tofu) and the total elimination of any food is not going to do you any good. Having said that a couple of ounces of red meat a day is all that is necessary, as long as you get enough, eggs, fish, cheese and poultry.

Just wondering, JLM, if you have ever visited a feedlot?
 

JLM

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Just wondering, JLM, if you have ever visited a feedlot?

Sorry, I got a little carried away and forgot to mention one thing, thinking instead about buffalo or any red meat being preferable to meat being contaminated in the meat production process. Sign of old age creeping up.
 

Mowich

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Sorry, I got a little carried away and forgot to mention one thing, thinking instead about buffalo or any red meat being preferable to meat being contaminated in the meat production process. Sign of old age creeping up.

You too, eh? :lol: Some days I think my brain has gone on holiday.

Actually, it was a real question, JLM. I will never, ever forget my first encounter with cattle in a feedlot. I got physically ill and barfed my cookies. I think it was a combination of the overwhelming stink, the condition of the cattle - some could barely stand up, most were covered in ****, some had open sores on their hides and legs, many of them were bawling so loudly you could hardly hear yourself think - and the way the employees treated the animals. It was quite the eye-opener. 8O
 

JLM

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You too, eh? :lol: Some days I think my brain has gone on holiday.

Actually, it was a real question, JLM. I will never, ever forget my first encounter with cattle in a feedlot. I got physically ill and barfed my cookies. I think it was a combination of the overwhelming stink, the condition of the cattle - some could barely stand up, most were covered in ****, some had open sores on their hides and legs, many of them were bawling so loudly you could hardly hear yourself think - and the way the employees treated the animals. It was quite the eye-opener. 8O

I can believe that, many years ago while we lived in Squamish, we went to Vancouver and shopped for meat at Save On Foods. When we got home much to our chagrin we found the roast we bought was absolutely rotten, so I phoned them and they told me just to freeze it and next time I was in town to return it. When I took the roast back to Save On, they had me bring it right into the meat area, talking about barfing your cookies as long as I live I will never forget the sour stench in there. How the employees can work in it is beyond me and my smeller isn't particularly keen.
Enough to gag a maggot on a gut wagon.
 

Mowich

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I can believe that, many years ago while we lived in Squamish, we went to Vancouver and shopped for meat at Save On Foods. When we got home much to our chagrin we found the roast we bought was absolutely rotten, so I phoned them and they told me just to freeze it and next time I was in town to return it. When I took the roast back to Save On, they had me bring it right into the meat area, talking about barfing your cookies as long as I live I will never forget the sour stench in there. How the employees can work in it is beyond me and my smeller isn't particularly keen.
Enough to gag a maggot on a gut wagon.

You are sooo right, JLM. A friend of mine, Lloyd, is a real 'foody' and decided to try an experiment with meat one day. He invited me over to take part and see for myself why he is a proponent of grass-fed, non-grain-finished beef. He had a package of feedlot beef and a package of grass-fed.
The first thing we noticed was the color of each type of hamburger. The feedlot beef was this unreal red color, whereas the grass-fed was a normal slightly pinkish color.
The next thing we noticed was the smell which only intensified, for the worse in the case of the feedlot beef, once cooking got underway.
The color of the fat in the pan for each type of meat was totally different too. The grass-fed was almost clear but the feedlot beef was a sickly whitish color and there was almost double the quantity of fat. When the fat of each congealed, the grass-fed was still almost clear but the feedlot resembled lard and still stank.
The taste test was the icing on the cake for the grass-fed and the death knell for the feedlot. There was simply no comparison.
The one thing I did notice was that the grass-fed was a bit more chewy than the feedlot because grass-fed beef has more muscle and less fat.
 
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JLM

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You are sooo right, JLM. A friend of mine, Lloyd, is a real 'foody' and decided to try an experiment with meat one day. He invited me over to take part and see for myself why he is a proponent of grass-fed, non-grain-finished beef. He had a package of feedlot beef and a package of grass-fed.
The first thing we noticed was the color of each type of hamburger. The feedlot beef was this unreal red color, whereas the grass-fed was a normal slightly pinkish color.
The next thing we noticed was the smell which only intensified, for the worse in the case of the feedlot beef, once cooking got underway.
The color of the fat in the pan for each type of meat was totally different too. The grass-fed was almost clear but the feedlot beef was a sickly whitish color and there was almost double the quantity of fat. When the fat of each congealed, the grass-fed was still almost clear but the feedlot resembled lard and still stank.
The taste test was the icing on the cake for the grass-fed and the death knell for the feedlot. There was simply no comparison.
The one thing I did notice was that the grass-fed was a bit more chewy than the feedlot because grass-fed beef has more muscle and less fat.

Funny how things change over time- going back 30 odd years I remember buying grass fed beef as it was much lower priced than grain fed, but at that time was considered to be of inferior quality. I never had a problem with it, but did think as I recall that it wasn't quite as tasty.
 

Tonington

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Mmm, I love bison. Did you try organic beef and pork?

It's funny that he fingered beef and pork, but not poultry. Pork production uses 2-500 g of a wide assortment of antibiotics per ton of feed to promote growth and feeding efficiency, poultry uses about 1-400 g per ton of feed, and beef/dairy use up to about 140 g per ton of feed.

Poultry is one of the most efficient animals at utilizing dietary components, much better than beef/dairy, and better than pork.

Many people don't know this, but pharmaceutical companies have a large stake in the ownership of poultry agriculture.