Wisdom of Solomon ignored by Christians Today?

SirJosephPorter

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Atheists don't hate scripture, atheists don't hate anything in particular.

Quite right, darkbeaver, why would Atheists hate scripture? That would be as absurd as hating Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, the Great Beagle or the Great Pumpkin (a la Charlie Brown).

All are equally figment of somebody’s imagination. It would be illogical to hate a mythological creature such as God.
 

gerryh

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Atheists don't hate scripture, atheists don't hate anything in particular.

Quite right, darkbeaver, why would Atheists hate scripture? That would be as absurd as hating Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, the Great Beagle or the Great Pumpkin (a la Charlie Brown).

All are equally figment of somebody’s imagination. It would be illogical to hate a mythological creature such as God.

Yet, here you are, interprating scripture about Noah (a supposed character in a fable) to say that he was a drunk, a lush, and a rapscallion ( a term I am sure you don't know the meaning of)......something the scriptures ( or fables as you term them) don't support.
 

darkbeaver

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Atheists don't hate scripture, atheists don't hate anything in particular.

Quite right, darkbeaver, why would Atheists hate scripture? That would be as absurd as hating Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, the Great Beagle or the Great Pumpkin (a la Charlie Brown).

All are equally figment of somebody’s imagination. It would be illogical to hate a mythological creature such as God.

Myth is grounded in fact though embellished over time, most of what we call myth has quite solid beginnings buried in the allegorical. I actually do hate santa claus, and the easter bunny however scripture is to be read and unraveled, there is no point in belittleing the history of man SJP, that's pressing luck a bit too far.
 

SirJosephPorter

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however scripture is to be read and unraveled, there is no point in belittleing the history of man SJP, that's pressing luck a bit too far.

And what makes you think that Bible tells us the history of man, darkbeaver? At most it tells us history of the region where Christianity originated (i.e. Middle East), in allegorical form only.

When Christianity was established, the dominant religion in the world was Hinduism, the dominant religion in the Middle East was Zoroastrianism. Hindu civilization, Roman civilization, Greek civilization, Persia were flourishing.

If at all Bible tells the history of man, it does it over a very small religion, and that only in allegorical form. E.g. According to Asimov, Garden of Eden tells the story of transition from hunting gathering society to farming communities, and to me that makes sense.

As a history, Bible isn’t of much use.
 

MHz

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Atheists don't hate scripture, atheists don't hate anything in particular. Do they? Maybe they do. I never asked. What the hell is an atheist anyway and why do they have to be labeled to distinguish them from theists. I suppose I'll have to look that up by my onlyist. The flood story is a fact. There was a great big flood. Lots of things disappeared. Every culture on earth has a flood story. Near as I can fathom there will be new flood stories anon. Very similar to the old ones. There's only so much variation in global floods I guess. When the big tsunami slips accross the lands, all will die, except me, I got an underseaboot.
It would include denial that God (in any way, shape, or form) exists. Basically any form of being that is capable of exercising his will over ours. Talking about Scripture is not the same as reading them. For instance the answer to the question of "Is God incapable of doing anything other than writing a book?" would bring this verse in how that questioned would be answered if God was asked (answer given before question asked)
1Co:4:20: For the kingdom of God is not in word, but in power.

You can probably read it with tolerance, some here cannot. Personally some of the ways He describes certain things is quite vivid indeed.
 
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MHz

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Atheists don't hate scripture, atheists don't hate anything in particular.

Quite right, darkbeaver, why would Atheists hate scripture? That would be as absurd as hating Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, the Great Beagle or the Great Pumpkin (a la Charlie Brown).

All are equally figment of somebody’s imagination. It would be illogical to hate a mythological creature such as God.
figment...how many of your 4000 or so posts are in threads that are based on some concept of God?
Do you even understand the parables in Scripture?
 

Cliffy

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For those who don't know it, jimminy was pronounced '' yimminy '' here in Gopherland for many decades -- it was the old Scandinavian pronunciation.

Yumpin' Yimminy! You got Scandahouvians down your way? Sarah Palin looks Scandahouvian but she must be well preserved if she was married to Noah.:lol:
 

gopher

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Your post reminds me of the 1935 classic ''Come & Get It'' where Walter Brennan made that quote because he portrayed a Scandinavian (he also won an Oscar):





It is acknowledged as one of Hollywood's greatest movies.

:)
 

JLM

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The flood story is a fact. There was a great big flood. Lots of things disappeared. Every culture on earth has a flood story.

That is true, darkbeaver. I myself think that a great big flood did occur (Noah’s story is of course, just that, a story, a fable).

Actually there is a story similar to Noah’s story in Hindu mythology, it wouldn’t surprise me if Noah’s story was taken from there.

I'm getting confused, you don't believe in the Bible, but you believe in the flood, you believe Noah was an evil man, but you believe God is just a figment of someones imagination. HOw do you distinguish between fact and B.S.?
 

SirJosephPorter

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Yumpin' Yimminy! You got Scandahouvians down your way? Sarah Palin looks Scandahouvian but she must be well preserved if she was married to Noah.:lol:

Indeed. Who would have thunk it? The Saviour of USA married to the Saviour of the world. Surely a match made in Heaven.

For those who don’t know, ‘thunk’ is, well, never mind.
 

SirJosephPorter

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I'm getting confused, you don't believe in the Bible, but you believe in the flood, you believe Noah was an evil man, but you believe God is just a figment of someones imagination. HOw do you distinguish between fact and B.S.?


I transpose fact and fiction in a seamless web, JLM. It is not at all difficult to separate the two. It is quite simple.

Flood probably did occur. There may have been a man named Noah, we don’t know (just as there may have been a man named Jesus).

But the fable of how Noah saved the life on earth is just that, a fable, since it involves supernatural occurrences.

I did not say Noah was an evil man. I said that according to Bible, Noah was not a nice man, a different thing altogether. And as God being a figment of somebody’s imagination, absolutely.

I use sarcasm integrally blended with fiction, but it does not need a lot of brain to separate the two. Thus, do I believe that the match between Noah and Palin was made in Heaven (or that they were married)? Absolutely not, that is sarcasm.

But the point about sarcasm is, if you state that you are being sarcastic, that diminishes some of its punch. So I don’t mention it. As to those who confuse sarcasm with truth, well, that is not my problem.



Anyway, if you are ever in doubt as to if I am being serious or sarcastic, just ask me.
 

JLM

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Obviously

I think what he means is what he believes to be fact and what he believes to be fiction. All the answers haven't revealed themselves yet, like 150 years ago If someone told us we would be flying like the birds, or switching on a light, most people would have said "bullsh*t".
 

Cliffy

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One thing most people seem to ignore is that though there were flood myths in many cultures, it doesn't mean they all happened at the same time. I doubt very much that archaeologists and climatologist have ever found evidence that the entire planet was flooded at any given time. The middle east was all there was to the world back when this flood supposedly happened so all the biblical account tells us that there might have been a flood in that area. Taking the bible literally is ludicrous.
 

JLM

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One thing most people seem to ignore is that though there were flood myths in many cultures, it doesn't mean they all happened at the same time. I doubt very much that archaeologists and climatologist have ever found evidence that the entire planet was flooded at any given time. The middle east was all there was to the world back when this flood supposedly happened so all the biblical account tells us that there might have been a flood in that area. Taking the bible literally is ludicrous.

Nope, not enough water on the planet for that Cliff. One theory I've read that does have a ring of truth to it, is that Noah's flood was caused by the sinking of the Lost Continent of Atlantus. I'm not sure how much evidence there is.
 

Walter

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Nope, not enough water on the planet for that Cliff. One theory I've read that does have a ring of truth to it, is that Noah's flood was caused by the sinking of the Lost Continent of Atlantus. I'm not sure how much evidence there is.
Another theory is that the strait of Gibraltar was formed when the Altlantic Ocean broke through and flooded the area we know as the Mediterranean Sea.
 

petros

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Nov 21, 2008
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"Sol Om On's Wisdom" was demon summoning that is still in use today by alchemists and occultists. Many of the sygils are very familiar to you but if you don't know their meaning they remain hidden in plain site.

Take the alleged "Star of David" for instance...there is no "holy" text that ever says David ever had a star. Most simply take that for granted it has something to do with Judaism but in reality it doesn't. It is Hermetics going all the way back to Egyptian, Indian/Himalayian and Chinese mythology.

< ------- Thoth



<-------Hermes Trismegistus



Hear ye and list ye, O children of Khem (Egypt),
to the words that I give that shall bring ye to the Light.
Ye know, O men, that I knew your fathers,
aye, your fathers in a time long ago.
Deathless have I been through all the ages,
living among ye since your knowledge began.

Leading ye upward to the Light of the Great Soul
have I ever striven,
drawing ye from out of the darkness of night.

Know ye, O people amongst whom I walk,
that I, Thoth, have all of the knowledge
and all of the wisdom known, to man since the ancient days.
Keeper have I been of the secrets of the great race,
holder of the key that leads into life.
Bringer up have I been to ye, O my children,
even from the darkness of the Ancient of Days.
List ye now to the words of my wisdom.
List ye now to the message I bring.
Hear ye now the words I give thee, and
ye shall be raised from the darkness to Light.

Far in the past, when first I came to thee,
found I thee in caves of rocks.
Lifted I thee by my power and wisdom
until thou didst shine as men among men.
Aye, found I thee without any knowing.
Only a little were ye raised beyond beasts.
Fanned I ever the spark of thy consciousness
until at last ye flamed as men.

Now shall I speak to thee knowledge ancient
beyond the thought of thy race.
Know ye that we of the Great Race
had and have knowledge that is more than man's.
Wisdom we gained from the star-born races,
wisdom and knowledge far beyond man.
Down to us had descended the masters of wisdom
as far beyond us as I am from thee.
List ye now while I give ye wisdom.
Use it and free thou shalt be.

Know ye that in the pyramid I builded are the Keys
that shall show ye the Way into life.
Aye, draw ye a line from the great image I builded,
to the apex of the pyramid, built as a gateway.
Draw ye another opposite in the same angle and direction.
Dig ye and find that which I have hidden.
There shall ye find the underground entrance to
the secrets hidden before ye were men.

Tell ye I now of the mystery of cycles
that move in movements that are strange to the finite,
for infinite are they beyond knowledge of man.
Know ye that there are nine of the cycles;
aye, nine above and fourteen below,
moving in harmony to the place of joining
that shall exist in the future of time.
Know ye that the Lords of the Cycles
are units of consciousness sent from the others to unify
This with the All.
Highest are They of the consciousness
of all the Cycles, working in harmony with the Law.
Know They that in time all will be perfected,
having none above and none below, but all One
in a perfected Infinity, a harmony of all in the Oneness of All.

Deep neath the Earth surface in the Halls of Amenti
sit the Seven, the Lords of the Cycles,
aye, and another, the Lord from below.
Yet know thee that in Infinity there is
neither above nor below.
But ever there is and ever shall be
Oneness of All when all is complete.
Oft have I stood before the Lords of the All.
Oft at the fount of their wisdom have drunken and
filled both my body and Soul with their Light.

Spake they to me and told me of cycles
and the Law that gives them the means to exist.
Aye, spake to me the Lord of the Nine saying:
O, Thoth, great are ye among Earth children,
but mysteries exist of which ye know not.
Ye know that ye came from a space-time below
this and know ye shall travel to a space-time beyond.
But little ye know of the mysteries within them,
little ye know of the wisdom beyond. Know ye that
ye as a whole in this consciousness
are only a cell in the process of growth.

The consciousness below thee is ever-expanding
in different ways from those known to thee.
Aye, it, though in space-time below thee,
is ever growing in ways that are different from
those that were part of the ways of thine own.
For know that it grows as a result of thy growth
but not in the same way that thou didst grow.
The growth that thou had and have in the present
have brought into being a cause and effect.
No consciousness follows the path of those before it,
else all would be repetition and vain.
Each consciousness in the cycle it exists in
follows its own path to the ultimate goal.
Each plays its part in the Plan of the Cosmos.
Each plays its part in the ultimate end.
The farther the cycle, the greater its
knowledge and ability to blend the Law of the whole.

Know ye, that ye in the cycles below us
are working the minor parts of the Law,
while we of the cycle that extends to Infinity
take of the striving and build greater Law.

Each has his own part to play in the cycles.
Each has his work to complete in his way.
The cycle below thee is yet not below thee
but only formed for a need that exists.
For know ye that the fountain of wisdom
that sends forth the cycles is eternally
seeking new powers to gain.
Ye know that knowledge is gained only by practice,
and wisdom comes forth only from knowledge,
and thus are the cycles created by Law.
Means are they for the gaining of knowledge
for the Plane of Law that is the Source of the All.

The cycle below is not truly below but only
different in space and in time.
The consciousness there is working and
testing lesser things than those ye are.
And know, just as ye are working on greater,
so above ye are those who are also working
as ye are on yet other laws.
The difference that exists between the cycles
is only in ability to work with the Law.
We, who have being in cycles beyond thee,
are those who first came forth from the
Source and have in the passage through
time-space gained ability to use
Laws of the Greater that are far beyond
the conception of man.
Nothing there is that is really below thee
but only a different operation of Law.

Look thee above or look thee below,
the same shall ye find.
For all is but part of the Oneness
that is at the Source of the Law.
The consciousness below thee is
part thine own as we are a part of thine.

Ye, as a child had not the knowledge
that came to ye when ye became a man.
Compare ye the cycles to man in his journey
from birth unto death,
and see in the cycle below thee the child
with the knowledge he has;
and see ye yourself as the child grown older,
advancing in knowledge as time passes on.
See ye, We, also, the child grown to manhood
with the knowledge and wisdom that came
with the years.
So also, O Thoth, are the cycles of consciousness,
children in different stages of growth,
yet all from the one Source, the Wisdom,
and all to the Wisdom returning again.

Ceased then He from speaking and sat
in the silence that comes to the Lords.
Then again spake He unto me, saying:
ìO Thoth, long have We sat in Amenti,
guarding the flame of life in the Halls.
Yet know, we are still part of our
Cycles with our Vision reaching unto them and beyond.
Aye, know we that of all,
nothing else matters excepting the growth
we can gain with our Soul.
Know we the flesh is fleeting.
The things men count great are nothing to us.
The things we seek are not of the body
but are only the perfected state of the Soul.
When ye as men can learn that nothing but
progress of Soul can count in the end,
then truly ye are free from all bondage,
free to work in a harmony of Law.

Know, O man, ye should aim at perfection,
for only thus can ye attain to the goal.
Though ye should know that nothing is perfect,
yet it should be thy aim and thy goal.
Ceased again the voice of the Nine,
and into my consciousness the words had sunk.
Now, seek I ever more wisdom
that I may be perfect in Law with the All.

Soon go I down to the Halls of Amenti
to live beneath the cold flower of life.
Ye whom I have taught shall nevermore see me.
Yet live I forever in the wisdom I taught.

All that man is is because of his wisdom.
All that he shall be is the result of his cause.

List ye, now to my voice and become
greater than common man.
Lift thine eyes upward,
let Light fill thy being,
be thou ever Children of Light.
Only by effort shall ye grow upward to
the plane where Light is the All of the All.
Be ye the master of all that surrounds thee.
Never be mastered by the effects of thy life.
Create then ever more perfect causes
and in time shalt thou be a Sun of the Light
Free, let thine soul soar ever upward,
free from the bondage and fetters of night.
Lift thine eyes to the Sun in the sky-space.
For thee, let it be a symbol of life.
Know that thou art the Greater Light,
perfect in thine own sphere,
when thou art free.
Look not ever into the blackness.
Lift up thine eyes to the space above.
Free let thine Light flame upward
and shalt thou be a Child of the Light.

As translated By Newton
 
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