Funny, I was just studying the notion of cognitive dissonance in class. Changing one's view in order to try to justify one's actions. "If I was willing to do it, it must be because it's not really wrong."
Bus driver returns money
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Funny, I was just studying the notion of cognitive dissonance in class. Changing one's view in order to try to justify one's actions. "If I was willing to do it, it must be because it's not really wrong."
............A free bus pass, which can only be used when he's working.
Damn, that's gratitude.Hey, we all know bus drivers make 155,893.28 a year, so he can afford to give it back. Them and their damn unions, eh. Otta be a law.
I'da done the same thing and I make a lot less money!! It doesn't BELONG to me. I give it back. 'Sides', I'd probably get caught, have my name in the paper and all. Oh the shame..................:lol:
Good for you! The second honest person to post in this thread!
Cognitive research has proved we don't know how we decide things and in fact we just make up stories why we decided them - stories that have nothing to do with why we decided in the first place!!! We decide things before we know the decision has been made!
The fact is no one knows how they would act. Making stories up after with no cost or investment is too easy. A quick brownie point is gained (maybe) but it does have a cost - it reveals the depths to which people delude themselves.
The reality is that you and I are probably the only ones that might return the money.
I can say that because we recognize the real temptation the money would offer to our human natures. In that recognition there is a real ability to oppose it if we wished. If someone won't recognize it then how can they oppose it? They can't.
Bull****, Scott. I didn't say there would be no TEMPTATION, there would be. But, I'd give it back. Pretty ****ing morally superior, ain't we!
I said I would keep the money, complete with a story why; how is that morally superior?
Yark!!
"The reality is that you and I are probably the only ones that might return the money."
If that is true, how do you know? Cognitive studies aside, since they probably are taken from Psych 101, or some other ivy-halled bull**** regimine.
:lol:.......gotcha goin, eh!!
Call it experience then if scientific studies are too suspect.
I found a wallet once with $500+ dollars in it. I would have sworn that I would keep such a find but instead (to my surprise) I turned it in. I thought that amount of money must have been the guys rent or something.
So with the bank money I expect I would keep it. I hate banks, they are vile institutions. They don't own money: they print it and steal it. But that's what I say, maybe I would think of the guy that would lose his job? I really don't know how I would act. I might treat it like a bowl of Halloween candy left out on a stoop and just take a handful. The thing is though, I could return it, that is a real option, since I am aware that I would be making up all kinds of stories to justify my decision, I am also aware that any decision I make is just a story.
Yes, thank you. I like a good argument. This is the only place I can get one.
It's interesting what we infer from someone's stance on a position.
Only about half of the people in here bothered to guess what they would do, yet, for the ones who didn't even try to guess, their statements on how they viewed it, 'right or wrong', were enough for people to decide that they would act in accordance with their value judgement. Odd considering how often people lie, cheat, steal, and just generally break laws, knowing full well that they consider it wrong to do so.
Only about half of the people in here bothered to guess what they would do, yet, for the ones who didn't even try to guess, their statements on how they viewed it, 'right or wrong', were enough for people to decide that they would act in accordance with their value judgement. Odd considering how often people lie, cheat, steal, and just generally break laws, knowing full well that they consider it wrong to do so.
You have no idea what sort of Hell the Brink's guards would face for having lost $80,000.
Repeated interogations, demands to submit to a polygraph, probably loss of his job........believe me, a lost parcel can make your life hell, and nobody punishes you worse than yourself.
As it is, even with the money returned, he will probably get a five day suspension without pay.
And they'll be damned lucky to get a reward out of Brinks....once my partner found $15,000 in the bottom of a bag, already written off, from another branch, free and clear. He turned it in. They gave him a ball cap. He called his "15 grand hat". Brinks was the cheapest and one of the nastiest employers I ever worked for.....but Damn, I loved that job!
And everyone makes a mistake sometime and gets days off.....usually though it is money left out inside a bank, so it is only their employees that know you screwed up......I once left a bundle of about 60 deposited envelopes sitting on top of a PCF ATM machine in a Superstore........somebody turned it in to customer service. Another time we loaded a $5 cassette in a machine with $20 bills.........so if you took out say $50, you got 4 - $20 instead of 2 - $20 and 2 - $5. The FIRST person to use the machine called the number on the front and reported it......
Most people are quite honest.
Kudos to the bus driver!
And, BTW, the banks never lose money.....either Brinks or the insurance company does.
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Myself, I would have returned it. Would I be tempted? Of course I would be tempted, but in the end I would return the money. I am not a thief and no matter who the money belongs to, I do know one thing. The money isn't mine. If I had lost money(or a personal item such as a family heirloom) I would be quite thankful that it was returned.
While neither the bank nor Brinks gave a crap about the bus driver's honesty, I know damned well that the Brinks employee did. Kudos to the bus driver.
While neither the bank nor Brinks gave a crap about the bus driver's honesty, I know damned well that the Brinks employee did. Kudos to the bus driver.
Funny you should mention that. I have found a few wallets in my time, but none more recently that seven years ago. It was small time cash, and my philosophy at the time was: Keep the the petty cash as my "reward", and put the wallet with the cards, and ID in the mailbox. Buddy will be happy just for his ID and sh!t, I know I would. Plus I had not so desirable occupations back then, and was mad at the world for being broke...
On that note, I'm pretty confident that I'm a lot more mature now, then when I was in my teens and early twenties. I have a better paying career now, and I'm pretty sure I would return petty cash and property to the rightful owner....:lol: There's a limit though. Eighty thousand? ... You only had to ask me once!;-)
This has more to do with our current debate on objective morality, but believe I have never been more pleased with one of your statements. I unequivocally agree.
To know what's right, you have to know what's wrong.
"A man can't call a line crooked, unless he has some idea of a straight one." -CS Lewis
And that's why in the "Do you believe in Evil?" thread, I posed the questions:
How do you know what evil is, UNLESS you have an idea of what good is? And how do know what good is, UNLESS there is an objective standard of such thing?
Like I said, this has less to do with this threads certain act, but more the bigger debate we've been having. I hate spreading the debate all over the map, but whatever.
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I think anyone who seriously considers walking out of a Tim Horton's with $80,000 in a bag that doesn't belong to them is putting a lot of faith in some employees they don't know from Tom, Dick, or Harry...a lot.
They have TV shows exhibiting the kind of linear thought processes these types of criminals are known for...
They have TV shows exhibiting the kind of linear thought processes these types of criminals are known for...
If you feel its ok to walk away with the money then it speaks volumes about your sense of morality, pride and overall character. Not someone I would want to pal around with. How long before someone like that starts to pilfer from your own personal belongings. I've had my car broken into on a couple of occasions and it left me fuming. Once they stole a bag of microphones, cables, effects units...tools of my trade. The last time my car was robbed I was parked in an underground lot at my apartment building. The thief took my cool sunglasses and an old wallet with nothing of value in it. The didn't take any of my cds though, which was disappointing. What, no one likes Led Zeppelin or Deep Purple anymore?...geesh. Nearest I can figure, he must have been a hip hop fan. Anyway, the dumbass missed the golf clubs in the trunk.
Where do people get off on thinking they can relieve others of their hard earned goods?
Where do people get off on thinking they can relieve others of their hard earned goods?
Well, whatever. We're talking about eighty thousand dollars here.
Start the car Scott! Start the car!....
Every one has the same sense of morality, when you choose to do wrong, you're just suppressing conscience.
I have no pride in myself whatsoever; it helps in a scenario whereas eighty thousand dollars is right in front of you...screaming "take me!"
The doors are right there.
You glance around quickly, all the sheople are busy choking down breakfast sandwiches and coffee.
You quietly and calmly, walk out with the loot, head down.
Scott starts the car, and its good times for Robin Hood and his nerdy christian friend Friar Tuck!
That's the difference, screw Brinks, I would never steal from a friend! That's low! I would feel horrible!
Those are drug addicted chronic criminals, not the loose moral, but usually good behaving person. Everyone hates the chronic criminal guys!
Damn kids, with their MTV's and Snoop Daddys!! :angryfire:
Pheww!
*alley shrugs shoulders*
I dunno.
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Thank you Alley. I'm starting to see a pattern unfold here. The criminal mind is fascinating isn't it? So lets see, you start with a false sense of morality which you can suppress at a moments notice. You hide this alter ego behind a christian front, enabling you to steal without a thought of the consequences because god is on your side. Of course you need a friend around to keep patting you on the back and telling you you're on the right track, further building your false sense of security. You fool yourself into thinking it's alright to steal from a large corporation because heck they have more than enough to go around. But you draw the line at stealing from your friends, 'cause dammit that's just plain wrong. *although that new flat screen tv my buddy just bought would look good in my basement* What a Jekyll and Hyde scenario we're building here. You tell yourself you're better than the common criminal who steals the petty stuff. If you're gonna go...go big you say to yourself.
Thanks for clearing that up for me Alley.
Thanks for clearing that up for me Alley.
No problem!
But please tell me how I have a false sense of morality. I know stealing is wrong. I already told you I have no pride. I'm uncomfortable in my own skin knowing how unscrupulous I am. I know I shouldn't even consider these things.
As for the Jekyl and Hyde thing, you should ask my coworkers about that one! LOL!
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The short answer, if you feel it's justified to steal from others because your mind tells you so, then you have stepped outside the normally accepted behaviour of a civilized individual.
Yes, in the criminal's mind he is totally justified in his actions because he has resolved it in his head that it's perfectly ok to carry out an act of injustice, whether it's stealing or killing. Thankfully, we have laws and barriers in place to keep this sort of thing in check. Otherwise we would indeed fall into anarchy. I've stared into the face of evil and believe me you would not want to cut loose some of the characters out there who would do you and others irreparable harm.
Yes, in the criminal's mind he is totally justified in his actions because he has resolved it in his head that it's perfectly ok to carry out an act of injustice, whether it's stealing or killing. Thankfully, we have laws and barriers in place to keep this sort of thing in check. Otherwise we would indeed fall into anarchy. I've stared into the face of evil and believe me you would not want to cut loose some of the characters out there who would do you and others irreparable harm.
Agreed. So its not that I have a different sense of morals, I know what the morals are. Some people just choose to ignore, or break those morals. And that's stepping outside the normally accepted behavior of a civilized individual.