Winter officially begins in our neck of the woods.

[countryboy]

Weird. Our contractors are ok with compensating for glass.
Anyway, can always say, "Thanks for not helping. I wonder if my lawyer has a suggestion".

AnnaG, you're in the "civlized zone" which includes pretty much anything south of Kamloops. We're in the "Twilight Zone" which includes everything north of Kamloops.

I don't know how we ended up with a seat in the provincial legislature, unless somebody down there in La-La Land (Vancouver/Victoria) made a mistake one day. Had to have been an accident.

Sad thing, really...when you consider that tourism is the province's second largest industry and they can't figure out why the numbers are in decline up this way. Who in their right mind would want to take their shiny vehicle into a 3rd world road zone? It's easier just to keep it south of Kamloops and keep 'er in shape for the next trip. To anywhere but the central Interior.

Winter tourism is really out of the question (staying on topic here) as ice, snow, flying rocks, and rude snowplow operators all combine to make a winter drive up here an unpleasant and dangerous experience. And some of that could be avoided.

 

[AnnaG]

It's way cheaper,the smaller it is the more expensive it is.
Anyone who's built roads will attest to that.
You also have to mix something with fines or it will freeze solid,coarse washed rock wont and they sometimes just used screened pit run so it is way cheaper.

You're just talking about the gravel. I was talking about the entire road budget that deals with winter.

The excess isnt allways cleaned up,once it's in the ditch it usually stays there and adds to the shoulder at the regular 3 to 1 slope.Thats natural repose and with erosion the extra material just fills in the low spots.

Right. But after a while it builds up. Around here they clean ditches every 2 or 3 years and that isn't a short term job. Besides that, the roads around here are usually bordered by hill on one side and lake on the other, so a lot of that particulate gets into the ditches, washed through the culverts under the road and end up in the lake causing a lot of grief for the wildlife living in the lake. Fish can't get up into the streams to lay if the particulate accumulates at the mouths of the creeks.
I wonder if it would cost a lot to recycle the crap off the roads after they clean them. I think the average here is 3 windshields per snowfall. As windshields atart about $150 and can go higher than $500, that isn't chumpchange.

The contractors are usually good about the windshields but you have to tell them or they wont know that some drivers arent turning the spinners off as it's protocol to allways do that.

lol As CB pointed out, though, what should be isn't always what is.

 

[Kakato]

You're just talking about the gravel. I was talking about the entire road budget that deals with winter.

Right. But after a while it builds up. Around here they clean ditches every 2 or 3 years and that isn't a short term job. Besides that, the roads around here are usually bordered by hillon one side and lake on the other, so a lot of that particulate gets into the ditches, washed through the culverts under the road and end up in the lake causing a lot of grief for the wildlife living in the lake. Fish can't get up into the streams to lay if the particulate accumulates at the mouths of the creeks.
I wonder if it would cost a lot to recycle the crap off the roads after they clean them.

lol As CB pointed out, though, what should be isn't always what is.

Budgets can be milked by useing inferior rock,happens all the time.

Ditches,backslopes and shoulders are allways finished at a 3 to 1 slope,that means natural repose,where the effect of gravity no longer makes any sediments run down hill except unless you introduce another factor like running water.

I have a hard time believing it's affecting any spawning fish as the amount of gravel laid down is minimal,if anything maybe bad engineering by the road builders that didnt account for run off is to blame.

I do this for a living Anna and I can tell you a couple rolls of silt fence are very cheap and will stop allmost 99.9% of any silt run off into any watershed and take only minutes to install.
If you have a problem area take pics and take it to your town council.
Tell them you want silt fences installed,it's such a cheap fix I cant see how they could say no.

 

[lone wolf]

Wow.... From an old Ministry of Trouble and Confusion (MTC) guy, your sand standards sound Wild West. Ours was always screened and washed ... then we went Empty Hole (MTO) and salt. Cheaper is bigger - but we had to use chutes for straight applications. Regardless, the sand/salt mix was restricted to a 6 foot diameter spread at 28 MPH.

Now, I see the contract guys doing highway speeds firing 50 calibre salt slugs off propeller speed spinners ... and guys with the plow blade dropped so the 75 dollar an hour saltshaker becomes a hundred buck an hour plow.


You get what you pay for....

 

[Kakato]

Wow.... From an old Ministry of Trouble and Confusion (MTC) guy, your sand standards sound Wild West. Ours was always screened and washed ... then we went Empty Hole (MTO) and salt. Cheaper is bigger - but we had to use chutes for straight applications. Regardless, the sand/salt mix was restricted to a 6 foot diameter spread at 28 MPH.

Now, I see the contract guys doing highway speeds firing 50 calibre salt slugs off propeller speed spinners ... and guys with the plow blade dropped so the 75 dollar an hour saltshaker becomes a hundred buck an hour plow.


You get what you pay for....

Yup,and lot's of contractors bid their quote for 1/4 inch minus but use pea gravel instead that is available and can be washed and screened without crushing,thing is it's smooth sided because it was'nt crushed and pretty well useless.

Guy's like me can pick out that kind of **** rock right away.;-)

 

[AnnaG]

Budgets can be milked by useing inferior rock,happens all the time.

Ditches,backslopes and shoulders are allways finished at a 3 to 1 slope,that means natural repose,where the effect of gravity no longer makes any sediments run down hill except unless you introduce another factor like running water.

Key phrase is "running water". What did you envision when I mentioned hill on one side and lake on the other side of the road? Water likes going downhill and carries stuff with it.

I have a hard time believing it's affecting any spawning fish as the amount of gravel laid down is minimal,if anything maybe bad engineering by the road builders that didnt account for run off is to blame.

Suit yourself.

I do this for a living Anna and I can tell you a couple rolls of silt fence are very cheap and will stop allmost 99.9% of any silt run off into any watershed and take only minutes to install.

Funny, I thought I read that you were sitting around at home, but whatever. You seem to be an expert on lots of areas of Canada and about all kinds of stuff so I shouldn't mention what runs around here in the form of news. It must be BS.

If you have a problem area take pics and take it to your town council.
Tell them you want silt fences installed,it's such a cheap fix I cant see how they could say no.

Interesting idea but, would those silt fences allow the fish to wander up and downstream?

 

[Kakato]

Key phrase is "running water". What did you envision when I mentioned hill on one side and lake on the other side of the road? Water likes going downhill and carries stuff with it.

Suit yourself.

Funny, I thought I read that you were sitting around at home, but whatever. You seem to be an expert on lots of areas of Canada and about all kinds of stuff so I shouldn't mention what runs around here in the form of news. It must be BS.
Interesting idea but, would those silt fences allow the fish to wander up and downstream?

First time since 1978 I havent been working every day,I never claimed to be an expert in anything but will throw my 2 cents in when I see mis info being posted as I have been around and been building roads and reclamation since 1978.

I've also done many other things so sorry if my experience doesnt cut the grade with you.

 

[Kakato]

I offer you solutions like silt fences and you counter with insult's.
Hmmm,ok.
Like it or not,I'm good at what I do and I will correct you when you are wrong when posting untruth's,,not my fault the industry is shut down right now.

 

[AnnaG]

What insult? I said the news must have been BS.
I said the silt fence idea sounded interesting but I wanted to know if they allow fish to pass by.

 

[Kakato]

What insult? I said the news must have been BS.
I said the silt fence idea sounded interesting but I wanted to know if they allow fish to pass by.

Maybe google silt fence,they are designed to stop sediment from entering a waterbody from any flowing stream or any runoff long before the water reaches fish habitat.

It's like cheesecloth and can be placed over any tributary or settling pond.

 

[AnnaG]

Cool. maybe they can put those at the downstream side of the culverts instead of in the streams.

 

[Kakato]

Cool. maybe they can put those at the downstream side of the culverts instead of in the streams.

Every five feet if you have to and most arent that big.
Even a stream 3 inches across will get one if needed.

 

[Kakato]

That pic is mis-leading,when dealing with run off down a slope(remember natural repose and stream flow at 3 to 1) you would typically use a silt fence about 6 or 8 inch's high.
I've set floating silt fence in settling ponds that are huge and the silt fence's were no where as big as that.:roll:
That's just a wee bit of overkill in that last pic.

It look's like it was used to maybe stop excessive runoff after a mini flash flood or to keep the water off the highway but that's not what silt fence is designed to do.

Or maybe someone was just charging out for the biggest most expensive fence they had,seen that many time's.

 

[VanIsle]

Hey Kakato, I agree with all that. But, the law of common sense doesn't exist here in this part of the world. I've been pointing this out for years, but no action.

When I see a plow truck coming, I just look for an emergency pull-off spot and try to point the windshield away from the oncoming window-breaker. This is the only province where I've ever encountered such butt-heads behind the wheel of those trucks, and it's always a consistent performance. Manitoba and Alberta have - in my opinion - the best, most sensible snow clearing crews of all. And BC wins the award for the absolute worst. Just an opinion...

I've never seen anything like what you describe but I do know that it wasn't like that before privitization.

 

[JLM]

I've never seen anything like what you describe but I do know that it wasn't like that before privitization.

Every highways district is different and it's got a lot to do with the District Highways Mgr. and the Road Foreman. Some are very service oriented toward the public and some are just there for the pay cheques. Privatization in B.C. in the late eighties did a lot to kill employee morale (the ones who managed to stay on and work for the contractor) On paper the Gov't managed to save money I guess- but even that probably turned out to be short term savings.

 

[countryboy]

I've never seen anything like what you describe but I do know that it wasn't like that before privitization.

That's what the local folks around here tell me. I moved here after privatization.

 

[AnnaG]

That pic is mis-leading,when dealing with run off down a slope(remember natural repose and stream flow at 3 to 1) you would typically use a silt fence about 6 or 8 inch's high.
I've set floating silt fence in settling ponds that are huge and the silt fence's were no where as big as that.:roll:
That's just a wee bit of overkill in that last pic.

It look's like it was used to maybe stop excessive runoff after a mini flash flood or to keep the water off the highway but that's not what silt fence is designed to do.

Or maybe someone was just charging out for the biggest most expensive fence they had,seen that many time's.

I can believe that. The one in the pic looked a bit impervious to me, but I thought maybe the perforations were just too small to see in the pic.

 

[VanIsle]

For a brief moment tonight I thought Juan's weather report of a couple of days ago was going to come true. Kids were playing downstairs and had the blinds kind of tangled up (probably staring out the window). I went over to straighten the blinds and looked outside as I did so and - it was snowing! That was about an hour or so ago and it's stopped now. Not even raining. I hope we don't wake to snow. Sounds bad down the States but they blame Canada. Oh well!:lol:

 

[VanIsle]

Have any of you hovered your mouse over your "greens" and read your fortune cookie? It's funny!

 

[VanIsle]

That's what the local folks around here tell me. I moved here after privatization.

As a North Bay trucker stops for a red light on Hwy.11, a
blonde catches up. She jumps out of her car, runs up to his

truck, and knocks on the door. The trucker lowers the

window, and she says, "Hi, my name is Heather, and you

are losing some of your load!"










The trucker ignores her and proceeds down the street.

When the truck stops for another red light, the girl

catches up again. She jumps out of her car runs up and

knocks on the door. Again, the trucker lowers the window.










As if they've never spoken, the blonde says brightly,

"Hi, my name is Heather, and you are

losing some of your load!"










Shaking his head, the trucker ignores her again and

continues down the street. At the third red light, the same

thing happens again.










All out of breath, the blonde gets out of her car, runs up,

knocks on the truck door.

The trucker lowers the window. Again she says, "Hi, my

name is Heather, and you are

losing some of your load!"










When the light turns green the trucker revs up and races to

the next light When he stops this time, he hurriedly gets

out of the truck, and runs back to the blonde. He knocks on

her window, and as she lowers it, he says,............










"Hi, my name is Kevin, it's winter in CANADA , and

I'm driving the f------ SALT TRUCK......."