Why is discrimination of the majority ok?

[Nuggler]

The barber has since relented, apologized, and offered to cut anyone's hair. Male, Female, in between.

I woulda sat her right down and got out the clippers.

# 2 or 3 would be just about right.

:brave::blob7:

 

[Downhome_Woman]

I did and came up with stuff like this:

Law: Storming The Last Male Bastion - TIME

It also came up with stuff like this:

Lawyer's Suit Challenges Women-Only Gyms - NYTimes.com

IOW, it is a game for fools and lawyers and the fools will lose, the lawyers will win.

Who said that? The stuff pops up once in a while on the news, but the immaturity of the issue is blatant and catering to the issue is making mountains from molehills. IOW, people should bluddy well grow up. Most women don't care what men do in their precious little clubs and most men don't care what goes on in women's. But most people will take up the issue for purely childish reasons. No, I am not necessarily for equal treatment for all. Women and men are friggin different, both physically and psychologically. That fact seems to escape people and they get on this "equality" wagon and drive it down the road waaaaaaaay past the turnoff into the driveway.

Nut if I'm capable - and other women as well - of doing something as you say, why should the law or society deny me the ability to do it? I know full well that men and women are different, but a lot of the things that women supposedly are not able to do - is bunk. Look at what women have done throughout the centuries. when life was mostly rural, women worked the fields with their spouses and they also took care of the inside chores and birthed them babies. during the industrial revolution? Women worked their asses off in the factories (not to mention on the farms alone, when the men went off to the factories/ off to sea/ off to war.
Women paid their dues during the war by keeping the home fires burning and also doing the jobs that men left to go to war. By the way, it turns out that Rosie the Riveter liked her job and didn't want to go back to the kitchen. and don't even get me going on the roles played by women in occupied countries during the war. they did all manner of things that in a more peaceful time they had been told that they were 'physically and psychologically ' unfit for. again, they seemed to thrive on the challenge and do quite well, thank you.
As far as the men only golf courses? One of the biggest beefs with them is that so many high powered deals are made tin those men only golf clubs. You exclude women you are denying them the chance to deal make and network along side their male counterparts.

 

[AnnaG]

Nut if I'm capable - and other women as well - of doing something as you say, why should the law or society deny me the ability to do it? I know full well that men and women are different, but a lot of the things that women supposedly are not able to do - is bunk. Look at what women have done throughout the centuries. when life was mostly rural, women worked the fields with their spouses and they also took care of the inside chores and birthed them babies. during the industrial revolution? Women worked their asses off in the factories (not to mention on the farms alone, when the men went off to the factories/ off to sea/ off to war.
Women paid their dues during the war by keeping the home fires burning and also doing the jobs that men left to go to war. By the way, it turns out that Rosie the Riveter liked her job and didn't want to go back to the kitchen. and don't even get me going on the roles played by women in occupied countries during the war. they did all manner of things that in a more peaceful time they had been told that they were 'physically and psychologically ' unfit for. again, they seemed to thrive on the challenge and do quite well, thank you.

I understand that quite well, DHW. That's why I think equal pay for equal work, equal opportunities to do whatever women can compete with men at, etc. is fine.

As far as the men only golf courses? One of the biggest beefs with them is that so many high powered deals are made tin those men only golf clubs. You exclude women you are denying them the chance to deal make and network along side their male counterparts.

That can go both ways. And if women think that men can't find a little hidey hole to tell each other ribald jokes and talk business deals, they need a little tuning. We can find our own little hidey holes, too. I can't say how many lunches and stuff I've had with female suppliers when I had my giftshop. Same for the odd beer at a pub. Women can pull that trick just as well as men. And that is equality.

 

[Downhome_Woman]

I understand that quite well, DHW. That's why I think equal pay for equal work, equal opportunities to do whatever women can compete with men at, etc. is fine.
That can go both ways. And if women think that men can't find a little hidey hole to tell each other ribald jokes and talk business deals, they need a little tuning. We can find our own little hidey holes, too. I can't say how many lunches and stuff I've had with female suppliers when I had my giftshop. Same for the odd beer at a pub. Women can pull that trick just as well as men. And that is equality.

i don't disagree, but let's say you're in a large corporation or law firm, and all the male members of the firm go to a men only golf club where they play a few rounds with boss and shoot the **** about life and clients. you and your other female collegues get to sit back and mind the shop, so to speak. you can't tell me that the boys who got to golf and chat with the boss and may6be a few big clients, aren't going to have a leg up when it comes to promotion and a chance to be the one to handle the next biggest client? That's how not allowing women into THOSE clubs puts them at a disadvantage. It's not the game, it's that chance to schmooze with your boss, the clients and your peers.
I know men will always find their little hidey holes - just like women do - those clubs, however, aren't hidey holes - they're important business tools.

 

[ansutherland]

Well I can agree with Anna that it is childish to take such issues to court. Most women probably don't care what the men do in their private clubs, and vise versa. When it is challenged in court however, I find it bothersome because it seems that one side is generally favoured over the other, as can be seen in the Law: Storming The Last Male Bastion - TIME article. Do I think that women should be able to have their own clubs?? Sure, as long as men can have theirs. Should Jewish only or Muslim only clubs exist? As long as Athiest only clubs can. Am I making a little much of an issue that really in no tangible way effects my life....ya, probably. That does not mean that it can't be argued or shouldn't be argued.

 

[gopher]

"quotas for federal jobs where your ethnic background is more important than merit to get a job."

does that include prime ministers?

 

[AnnaG]

i don't disagree, but let's say you're in a large corporation or law firm, and all the male members of the firm go to a men only golf club where they play a few rounds with boss and shoot the **** about life and clients. you and your other female collegues get to sit back and mind the shop, so to speak. you can't tell me that the boys who got to golf and chat with the boss and may6be a few big clients, aren't going to have a leg up when it comes to promotion and a chance to be the one to handle the next biggest client? That's how not allowing women into THOSE clubs puts them at a disadvantage. It's not the game, it's that chance to schmooze with your boss, the clients and your peers.
I know men will always find their little hidey holes - just like women do - those clubs, however, aren't hidey holes - they're important business tools.

hehe Yes, they are. And when women are allowed in to them, the men squawk and find another spot to peddle their BS. And we women can also be pretty sneaky. I'd try something like chatting with the wives of these bigwigs. "Hey, did you know what your hubby did the other day?"

Well I can agree with Anna that it is childish to take such issues to court. Most women probably don't care what the men do in their private clubs, and vise versa. When it is challenged in court however, I find it bothersome because it seems that one side is generally favoured over the other, as can be seen in the Law: Storming The Last Male Bastion - TIME article. Do I think that women should be able to have their own clubs?? Sure, as long as men can have theirs. Should Jewish only or Muslim only clubs exist? As long as Athiest only clubs can. Am I making a little much of an issue that really in no tangible way effects my life....ya, probably. That does not mean that it can't be argued or shouldn't be argued.

And it will even out eventually. It did in the courts over divorces and stuff. Judges are a lot less likely to award the women the gold mine and the men the shaft (Thanks, Jerry Reed ) regardless of circumstances than they used to be.

 

[gopher]

Canadian PM's:

Canada's Prime Ministers - Prime Minister of Canada

Gee, if Canada discriminates against whites, why do we see only white faces there?

 

[AnnaG]

"quotas for federal jobs where your ethnic background is more important than merit to get a job."

does that include prime ministers?

Do you know a good married, lesbian, Inuit in a wheelchair we can elect as PM?

 

[ansutherland]

i don't disagree, but let's say you're in a large corporation or law firm, and all the male members of the firm go to a men only golf club where they play a few rounds with boss and shoot the **** about life and clients. you and your other female collegues get to sit back and mind the shop, so to speak. you can't tell me that the boys who got to golf and chat with the boss and may6be a few big clients, aren't going to have a leg up when it comes to promotion and a chance to be the one to handle the next biggest client? That's how not allowing women into THOSE clubs puts them at a disadvantage. It's not the game, it's that chance to schmooze with your boss, the clients and your peers.
I know men will always find their little hidey holes - just like women do - those clubs, however, aren't hidey holes - they're important business tools.

I see this as just a poor and unfair business practice. Such issues should be addressed to the law firm, not the social club.

 

[AnnaG]

Canadian PM's:

Canada's Prime Ministers - Prime Minister of Canada

Gee, if Canada discriminates against whites, why do we see only white faces there?

Most of Canada is paleface, Goph. lol

I see this as just a poor and unfair business practice. Such issues should be addressed to the law firm, not the social club.

Or at least convince clubs that they shouldn't allow business talk in them.

 

[gopher]

"ethnic background is more important than merit to get a job."

How does that work in private industry?

Here are Canada's wealthiest people:

The Rich 100: Canada's wealthiest people | After Hours | Canadian Business Online

You will have to pardon my American ignorance, but how many of these are not white?

''Do you know a good married, lesbian, Inuit in a wheelchair we can elect as PM?''

Well, I don't discriminate but if those are the preferred attributes to land a good job in Canada, why don't we see any such people in high office there?


''Most of Canada is paleface, Goph. lol''

I know that. But if they are the only ones suffering from discrimination, why are they in high office and others living as lesser peons?

 

[AnnaG]

"ethnic background is more important than merit to get a job."

How does that work in private industry?

Here are Canada's wealthiest people:

The Rich 100: Canada's wealthiest people | After Hours | Canadian Business Online

You will have to pardon my American ignorance, but how many of these are not white?

Thomsons, Weston, and Pattison are white. I have no idea about the rest.

''Do you know a good married, lesbian, Inuit in a wheelchair we can elect as PM?''

Well, I don't discriminate but if those are the preferred attributes to land a good job in Canada, why don't we see any such people in high office there?

Tradition.

''Most of Canada is paleface, Goph. lol''

I know that. But if they are the only ones suffering from discrimination, why are they in high office and others living as lesser peons?

Tradition.

 

[Downhome_Woman]

"ethnic background is more important than merit to get a job."

How does that work in private industry?

Here are Canada's wealthiest people:

The Rich 100: Canada's wealthiest people | After Hours | Canadian Business Online

You will have to pardon my American ignorance, but how many of these are not white?

''Do you know a good married, lesbian, Inuit in a wheelchair we can elect as PM?''

Well, I don't discriminate but if those are the preferred attributes to land a good job in Canada, why don't we see any such people in high office there?


''Most of Canada is paleface, Goph. lol''

I know that. But if they are the only ones suffering from discrimination, why are they in high office and others living as lesser peons?

They're ALL white!!And I'm pretty sure that most of them are Christian as well!

 

[YukonJack]

JLM, attempting to be funny, admonished me thus:

"What would we do Y.J. without you to give us a good laugh for the day? :lol:"

JLM, are you doing your level best to be obtuse, or does it come to naturally?

 

[JLM]

JLM, attempting to be funny, admonished me thus:

"What would we do Y.J. without you to give us a good laugh for the day? :lol:"

JLM, are you doing your level best to be obtuse, or does it come to naturally?

Lighten up Y.J. , a little light criticism never hurt anyone. :smile::smile::smile:

 

[YukonJack]

JLM, just please, answer the question.

 

[JLM]

JLM, just please, answer the question.

Not easy to do Y.J. - you are presuming two possibilities both of which may be false. :smile::smile:

 

[gopher]

''They're ALL white!!And I'm pretty sure that most of them are Christian as well!''


So where is all the proof that only white Canadians suffer from discrimination?

 

[karrie]

I just read this: Ottawa barbershop won't cut woman's hair - Yahoo! Canada News
It is about a lady complaining that she could not get her hair cut at a barber shop because they only cut mens hair. She is, as a result, contemplating legal action. My question is, why is it not ok for services to be rendered exclusively to one group when they are provided exclusively to another? The best example I can think of is women's only gyms, but there are plenty of others such as sporting events that are directed towards certain racial groups. The way I see it, what's good for the goose is good for the gander.

I think she should be forced to send her hubby to a gynecologist for his erectile dysfunction.

Certain things are specialty based.

Trying to get a decent haircut when your hair is short and you're a woman is not the same as going to a gym and being gawked at. Also, at unisex salons, I have the same length of hair and would get it cut the same way as many guys might, but I get charged more - I was told that women's hair is 'different'. Oh - and do you realize that the cost for dry cleaning a womans shirt at me dry cleaners is more than for a man's- even if it's the same cut? Please - she was a fool to claim it was a 'human rights' issue, (I live in Ottawa - I know the story) but not cutting her hair because she's a woman? What? Is the barber shop some sort of sanctum sanctorum? Before you get your 'man hair' curt you perform some secret man hair ritual? It's only hair, for Pete's sake!

that's all fine and dandy if she was trying to get a men's hair cut. Was she? i got my hair cut recently and it was an hour long ordeal with layering of two feet long of hair. What we could be talking about here has a huge range of possibilities.

Um - If I missed what I am asking - I apologize - but are there female BARBERS in the Canadian Barbers' Union?

If so are they only allowed to cut male hair in a Barbershop or are restricted to working in a Woman's Beauty Salon?

My son gets his hair cut by a female barber. BUT... for $12, you get a barber shop cut which ranges a select variety of essentially formulaic cuts. She is NOT versed in layering women's hair, etc. She has mastered men's cuts.

molehill ---> mountain
If I were the barber I'd have cut her hair in such a manner that the dummy wouldn't be back.

Might I suggest what we normally cut my son's... the ceasar.... clipper length #2 on the sides, finger length on top. Done.

I personally don't really care all that much what we end up with in terms of having clubs for certain groups and not others as long as it's consistent. If women can have clubs that men can't attend, then men should have the same right......if men however can't have them, then neither can women. If it's cool to have the Punjabi Games, then the Caucasian Games should be OK too. If however whites cannot have their own games, then neither can anyone else. I have a feeling though that even if you named it the Caucasian Games yet made it open to anyone, you would have a public outrage.

Since Punjabi is cultural, and still qualifies as Caucasian (which is a race qualification, not a cultural one), I don't get your comparison.

What you're discussing is equal to wanting to stop the French cultural celebrations on race grounds.