U.S. war resister granted stay of deportation order

[Scott Free]

Spare me the color would you. "Jack Boots", "Nazis"... please.

The proof is in the evidence.

Conformity is PART of being in the military. That is what makes armies work. Individualism is how armies fail.

He signed up...He deserted...Now he's going to get a BIG CHICKEN DINNER...otherwise known as a BAD CONDUCT DISCHARGE. Then...after he does his hundred days or so in the brig he can go back to Canada and mooch off you folks as he has been. His name will forever be MUD in the states.

Fair enough but it still doesn't explain why so many americans are so angry at deserters when they themselves don't support the war. It seems to me this makes them complicit in the war crime. If you wish to perpetuate the crime instead of stopping it, then your demonstration of holding your nose while you do so isn't very convincing. Do you just like killing people? Is it fun? Good times?

 

[EagleSmack]

The proof is in the evidence.

Which is?

Fair enough but it still doesn't explain why so many americans are so angry at deserters when they themselves don't support the war. It seems to me this makes them complicit in the war crime. If you wish to perpetuate the crime instead of stopping it, then your demonstration of holding your nose while you do so isn't very convincing. Do you just like killing people? Is it fun? Good times?

Because they are deserters...that is why. They deserted our armed forces and that is not looked on kindly by most Americans.

So...in the end... ALL of the deserters will be caught and punished. The anti-war movement is losing steam and has been for quite sometime. Soon the cheering will stop and these deserter hold outs will return to the US to be forever branded a deserter and pretty much shunned from any meaningful job.

"Hey...there is that Robin guy that deserted. What does he do now?"
"Oh...yeah...that guy...I heard he works nights stocking shelves at the super market." :lol: :lol:

 

[Scott Free]

Which is?

You interfered with an international investigation to invaded a sovereign nation illegally and under false pretence only imagining a reason after the fact (oops my hand? this cookie jar?). An action which has displaced 2 million people and killed 1 million more.

Because they are deserters...that is why. They deserted our armed forces and that is not looked on kindly by most Americans.

So...in the end... ALL of the deserters will be caught and punished.

So you fight, right or wrong doesn't matter?

The anti-war movement is losing steam and has been for quite sometime.

So what? That doesn't make the war any more legal or less horrific. So a nation of brainwashed zombies approve? So what? It is the opinion of the world that matters now. Where do you think your precious country is going to be in 2050 when India, China and Mexico have bigger economies? You think all your war crimes won't catch up to you but they will. Unfortunately it won't be you who pays though, it will be your children that do.

Soon the cheering will stop and these deserter hold outs will return to the US to be forever branded a deserter and pretty much shunned from any meaningful job.

So that's the cost of having balls in a jack boots country huh? Never forget; never forgive - conformity or else!

"Hey...there is that Robin guy that deserted. What does he do now?"
"Oh...yeah...that guy...I heard he works nights stocking shelves at the super market." :lol: :lol:

Shelves don't stock themselves. Do you despise janitors too?

 

[EagleSmack]

You interfered with an international investigation to invaded a sovereign nation illegally and under false pretence only imagining a reason after the fact (oops my hand? this cookie jar?). An action which has displaced 2 million people and killed 1 million more.

False

So you fight, right or wrong doesn't matter?

That is about the amounts to it. You join...you may fight. The guy joined in 2005...two years after the invasion and he says the recruiters said he wouldn't go to Iraq. C'mon...I wouldn't expect even you to believe that.

So what? That doesn't make the war any more legal or less horrific. So a nation of brainwashed zombies approve? So what? It is the opinion of the world that matters now. Where do you think your precious country is going to be in 2050 when India, China and Mexico have bigger economies? You think all your war crimes won't catch up to you but they will. Unfortunately it won't be you who pays though, it will be your children that do.

It's not illegal. Sure people say it is illegal but the fact of the matter is that it is not. My precious country will still be here in 40 years. I wonder where yours will be though.

So that's the cost of having balls i a jack boots country huh? Never forget; never forgive - conformity or else!

Yup. When you join the military you are expected to conform to standards of discipline, and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. In that code there is a line that says in so many words...Don't Desert.

He deserted...he is in BIG TROUBLE. :lol:

Shelves don't stock themselves. Do you despise janitors too?

No way... I LOVE janitorial sciences. Shelves don't stock themselves, but that type of job is typically held by kids who are in school and will eventually be moving up in life. Our friend Robin and the rest of them are pretty much going to have to make a profession of stocking shelves.

 

[Risus]

We don't want them, we don't need them, send them back...

 

[EagleSmack]

We don't want them, we don't need them, send them back...

I hope Canada does. That way we can put them in jail, then give them a Bad Conduct Discharge, and THEN they can run back up to Canada and whine how bad the US is.

Maybe they can pick up fur-trapping or maple syruping. Be a logger or something like that.

 

[Zzarchov]

That is about the amounts to it. You join...you may fight. The guy joined in 2005...two years after the invasion and he says the recruiters said he wouldn't go to Iraq. C'mon...I wouldn't expect even you to believe that.

I had alot of smart-ass comments about how once the Chinese take all your manufacturing work (and thats all you got) you'll all be stocking shelves...

But since im in Ontario I might be in the same boat so I'll save it for when I move out west

But that comment. The war was on, the recruiter told him (in alot of commonlaw places, Im not sure about all states, but I know its so in Ontario), parole evidence on the part of the sales person is considered part of the contract whether or not its written in the contract.

So if the recruiter told him that, then it isn't the saps job to believe that the US agent is lying to him at every turn.

In alot of places that contract for him to serve became null and void the second they sent him to Iraq. In such a case he wouldn't be a deserter, he'd have fullfilled his contract before the US government breached it and removed any further obligations form him.

That being said, Im not a fan of deserters in a volunteer army. If the war is illegal and immoral, you are expected to take tougher actions than deserting to protect your nation from its own government.

Especially in the USA which is based upon that concept.

But no one thinks the war is THAT bad.

 

[EagleSmack]

I am not sure if you agree with me or not. But about Military Recruiting...

Every deserter or former soldier/sailor, etc that sides with the dwindling anti-war crowd has said...

"My recruiter lied to me!"

Every disgruntled employee has a complaint and whines. That is the same with these guys. What makes their word truth? Because they are against the war?

Please!

I laugh whenever I hear a deserter say in front of a microphone...
"My recruiter said I wouldn't have to go to Iraq."

Basically what he is saying is...
"I am very stupid, please coddle me." or "I am a liar"

There is a war on...you are signing up to be a soldier...you are going to go to Iraq!

 

[Risus]

I hope Canada does. That way we can put them in jail, then give them a Bad Conduct Discharge, and THEN they can run back up to Canada and whine how bad the US is.

Maybe they can pick up fur-trapping or maple syruping. Be a logger or something like that.

We don't need them for us to know how bad the US is....

Oh where would your shuttles be without the Canada Arm???

 

[Zzarchov]

I am not sure if you agree with me or not. But about Military Recruiting...

Every deserter or former soldier/sailor, etc that sides with the dwindling anti-war crowd has said...

"My recruiter lied to me!"

Every disgruntled employee has a complaint and whines. That is the same with these guys. What makes their word truth? Because they are against the war?

Please!

I laugh whenever I hear a deserter say in front of a microphone...
"My recruiter said I wouldn't have to go to Iraq."

Basically what he is saying is...
"I am very stupid, please coddle me." or "I am a liar"

There is a war on...you are signing up to be a soldier...you are going to go to Iraq!

If its "Im stupid, please coddle me"

Its really "The recruiter your tax dollars are paying for is an idiot, as he basically gave me free reign to go to college on your dime and not fight in Iraq, you should look into court martialling him for gross incompetance".


The law is the law, and if you sign on the dotted line you are held to that contract, so is the US government. If you don't live up to your end of the contract (ie showing up) they stop paying you, and do other things, even if you think the war is a bad idea, you signed the agreement.

likewise if the US government does something stupid, like telling a recruit he doesn't have to go to Iraq, and then doesn't live up to their end of the contract (Depending on local laws), even if they think that clause is stupid, they signed the agreement.

And I think we both know recruiters do lie, alot. And depending exactly what he said (ie, you PROBABLY won't go to Iraq is fine) and the local laws, the kid may be right.

The contract may be void, in which case he isn't a deserter. In which case the first matter is a trip to civil court to weigh the balance of probabilities and, failing that, time to go back to war kid.

But the idea the Government can change a soldiers contract and turn them into slaves is daft.

The kid has a case or doesn't. Whether or not he SHOULD serve is irrelevant he, as an adult, made a decision to sign the contract. The government made a decision to send out certain recruiters and is bound by them as agents if they agree to something stupid.

 

[lone wolf]

I am not sure if you agree with me or not. But about Military Recruiting...

Every deserter or former soldier/sailor, etc that sides with the dwindling anti-war crowd has said...

"My recruiter lied to me!"

No salesman ever lied? Recruiters have to offer perks. PT Barnum was American too. Would you believe that old Studebaker was only ever driven to church on Sundays too.

Every disgruntled employee has a complaint and whines. That is the same with these guys. What makes their word truth? Because they are against the war?

Please!

I laugh whenever I hear a deserter say in front of a microphone...
"My recruiter said I wouldn't have to go to Iraq."

Basically what he is saying is...
"I am very stupid, please coddle me." or "I am a liar"

Please! How gullible are you? The only fault with his argument is it wasn't in writing ... and even then the odds are in the House's favour.

There is a war on...you are signing up to be a soldier...you are going to go to Iraq!

He deserted. He deserves his lumps. Uncle Sam might want to wake up too. This ain't a model of the real world. Lying to yourself gets your butt smacked....

 

[Scott Free]

False

You're right, my bad: 5 million displaced Iraqis.

And again, my bad: 1.2 million dead Iraqis.

 

[Zzarchov]

So, about 20% of Iraqi's are homeless, and 5% dead?

considering the Kurds are largely untouched

That means the numbers are even more hideous in South and Central Iraq (about 25% then). So, where are all of these people staying for FIVE YEARS, if they don't have a home? 1 in 4 is waaay to many for those situations.

 

[Scott Free]

So, about 20% of Iraqi's are homeless, and 5% dead?

considering the Kurds are largely untouched

That means the numbers are even more hideous in South and Central Iraq (about 25% then). So, where are all of these people staying for FIVE YEARS, if they don't have a home? 1 in 4 is waaay to many for those situations.

Looks that way, yep - opps something you won't see on FOX or CNN.

 

[Colpy]

Looks that way, yep - opps something you won't see on FOX or CNN.

Hmmm...one street....where? Proves very little, except that someof Iraq has been shattered by war. No surprize there.....BTW, why would you even watch a film made by "Nazis", in your words?

 

[Scott Free]

Hmmm...one street....where? Proves very little, except that someof Iraq has been shattered by war.

It proves a great deal actually. It's a main drag completely empty. There is no one living anywhere near it - obviously.

BTW, why would you even watch a film made by "Nazis", in your words?

You have a better source? I don't. The propaganda is pretty pervasive.

 

[lone wolf]

Hmmm...one street....where? Proves very little, except that someof Iraq has been shattered by war.

Naw ... that's the land of Tigres and Euphrates. DaNile is in Egypt.

No surprize there.....BTW, why would you even watch a film made by "Nazis", in your words?

Would it have something to do with trying to be informed? ...maintaining an open mind? ...or are they alien phrases among the rabid right?

 

[gopher]

Those who resist imperialistic wars are heroes!

 

[lone wolf]

Those who resist imperialistic wars are heroes!

I agree ... but there IS a right way to do it....

Woof!

 

[Zzarchov]

Looks that way, yep - opps something you won't see on FOX or CNN.

I see videos like that quite frequently, that doesn't show 25% of South and Central Iraqs population homeless. That shows a few city blocks being patrolled by tanks being deserted.

Im not saying there isn't big levels of displacement, huge ones even. But I don't think you realise that 25% of the populace being displaced, for five years, would equal 25% of the populace (or more) dead of disease.