Too Fat To Work - Need More Benefit Money

[Machjo]

I wonder who would volunteer to monitor that.;-)

Like I said, if we give them no money, they have no money to buy anything, be it booze, cigarettes, drugs, or sex.

How do you know that a person will not spend his social assistance check on drugs, booze, cigarettes, or sex and then get kicked out of his apartment for lack of rent, end up on the street, and rely on a food bank? Woudl it not be cheaper then to just give him room and board, teach him what he needs to get back on his feet, and then get him back on his feet?

I'm not saying it's the case, but how do we know. If they're in need of assistance, obviously there's something wrong, be it physical, emotional, psychological, social, chemical, etc.

I'm not pointing fingers or judging, but just suggesting how to make the system more efficient so that we can in fact really help them.

Help does not equal money, but actually teaching them, guiding them, training them, rehbilitating them.

 

[shadowshiv]

It didn't sound cruel to me. It was a valid point.

 

[Machjo]

It didn't sound cruel to me. It was a valid point.

I just wanted to cover my tracks. I've debated this with socialists before (othing against socialism per se), and they reacted like I was a member of the Nazi Party!

I just want to emphasize that I don't look at myself as superior to them in any way. Heck, if I was raised by their parents, maybe I'd be in tehir shoes right now, fat, eating junk, thinking that healthy means salad only, and genuinely not knowing where to start to find work.

If you then give me money, what do you expect me to do with that money? Of course I'll by junk like before. Not my fault. That's all I know. Cut the money and teach me.

I'm just clarifying because I don't want people to think that I look down on the needy, or that I couldn't have ended up in their position if I were in their shoes. I'm sure any of us could, so when I say don't give them money, I don't in any way intend to be judgemental or blame them. The intent is strictly to help them genuinely.

 

[Machjo]

By the way, I don't believe in giving money to people who beg on the street either. I give to charitable organizations only. Again, not because I blame them or judge them, but because I genuinely think that organizatiosn can hlp them better. I dont want to give them money and thus be contributing to hurting them.

As for socialists who'd say just give them the money, I admire those socialists' intentions. I'm sure they genuinely mean well. Unfortunately, the trick it to make them aware that by giving money directly, we might in fact be hurting them, not their fault. They're ignorant. It's then our fault. To reuse to give them money is in no way out of malice, hatred, cruelty, or looking down on them, but rather genuinely the best way to help them. Provide the necessary funding however much it costs, but don't give them the money directly. If they need a book, they can write it on a list, and we buy it for the local library. Problem solved. Whatever they need, wecan lend to them, buy for them, etc. always with the goal of genuinely helping them and never looking down on them or blaming them. It's not about pointing fingers, but helping them genuinely.

 

[Libra Girl]

We all know people whose weights range around 17 to 19 stone, I would think. I know at least 3 or 4.

One of those people is a man who is an Inspector for a bus company. He sits all day, or night, depending what shift he is on, in an office, at a computer and doing paperwork. Three or four days a month he goes out on the road checking drivers for infringments of company routes or policy, and passenger tickets, but even then he takes a company car out to some isolated bus stop and just sits and waits for the bus to come along, checks the tickets and then gets back in his car and goes to the next stop on his list, and sits and waits again.

He weighed, I think it was 19 stone at the last count before he discovered Paul Mckenna's 'I Can Make You Thin.' programme, about 3 or 4 months ago. He's lost three stone since then, and the theme is to eat what one wants, when one wants, (according to Paul) diets never work, because one usually regains all the weight that one originally lost.

His wife, a dear friend of mine, has lost two stone, or thereabouts, but she didn't start Pauls weight loss programme until later, being a bit skeptical of it all, until she saw how well her hubby was doing.

Paul Mckenna's programme swept the Uk, and is now, apparently sweeping America. His programme has had huge success in ratings, and converts. My friend the Inspector eats his favorite cream slices, and all the other things that he likes, but follows Pauls programme religiously, and he is so happy, after having tried all sorts of diets for years.

Paul even advocates that one goes to their fridge, freezer or larder and throw out all of those things that you don't like, regardless of their calories or health promises, and stock up on all the things that you do like to eat, and to heck with the calories or carbohydrates.

He's written some books also, but I haven't a clue as to titles etc... sorry.

As for the family in the article, well, someone here said that they just need educating about weight and food nutrition etc... I agree, but I would also add that they need to be a little more commited to at least trying to do something about their weight problems, instead of just sitting back and letting others do their work for them.

As for their weight stopping them from working... Pooh!! That's just utter nonsense! My friend who was 19 stone works long hours, as does his wife... incidently, she was thirteen stone and is only 4'10 and a half inches, (so it showed now she is down to ten and a half stone.

Another acquaintance of mine has just started the regime, and has lost 14 pounds in just a month, ok, she was only 12 stone to begin with, but still, we are all proud of her achievement, and she really feels good about herself.

 

[petros]

eating regime? How about a bowl of ping pong balls and see what happens over the next few months. On the other hand. They wil be the lucky ones when the food shortages hit.

 

[Libra Girl]

eating regime? How about a bowl of ping pong balls and see what happens over the next few months. On the other hand. They wil be the lucky ones when the food shortages hit.

lol, typo petros... it's been one of those days.

 

[JLM]

"They said they can't buy healthy food as it is too expensive." THAT has to be the biggest crock I've heard in awhile, as they are obviously buying too much of the food that isn't too expensive- Just cut that to about 1/3 and spend the money saved on vegetables, grains and fruit. And do a minimum of one hour STRENUOUS exercise each day.

 

[Twila]

How do you know that a person will not spend his social assistance check on drugs, booze, cigarettes, or sex and then get kicked out of his apartment for lack of rent, end up on the street, and rely on a food bank? Woudl it not be cheaper then to just give him room and board, teach him what he needs to get back on his feet, and then get him back on his feet?

In the US they give out food stamps that can only be used for certain things. No pet food, smokes etc.

Here in BC if a person keeps having issues paying they're rent, the ministry will make special arrangements to pay the landlord directly.

I guess the Ministry's figure that if they (the gov't) controlled all the money these people got, the people won't know how to handle money when they get a job. The Ministry has made great progress at keeping the handouts low and making sure it's not a comfortable process for those who are able to work to collect a chq.
They should mandate free birthcontrol for recipients.

There is a very real problem of children suffering for the cut backs rather then the parents, and in turn these children will grow up and be the parents...vicious circle.

 

[tracy]

I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. Social services don't have the resources to do everything FOR people. If you want to learn how to lose weight, how about going to a library and getting a book that tells you how? Libraries are free and they're open on weekends. People are making this situation much more complicated than it really is.

 

[JLM]

I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. Social services don't have the resources to do everything FOR people. If you want to learn how to lose weight, how about going to a library and getting a book that tells you how? Libraries are free and they're open on weekends. People are making this situation much more complicated than it really is.

Absolutely correct, Tracy, in all respects. Some people want the Gov't. (that's us) to do everything for them including tying their shoes. I suppose there are legitimate diseases that enable fatness, but what percentage of the population suffers from it? One or two percent? I'll bet well over 90% of the fatties suffers from "dropsy and heart fever", not to mention being mentally lazy as well. Beside throwing out the bad foods maybe they should throw out the T.V. and video games.

 

[lone wolf]

Sometimes the fat is on the body ... and sometimes it is the head....

 

[petros]

Beside throwing out the bad foods maybe they should throw out the T.V. and video games.

Doesn't anybody go bowling anymore?

 

[tracy]

Absolutely correct, Tracy, in all respects. Some people want the Gov't. (that's us) to do everything for them including tying their shoes. I suppose there are legitimate diseases that enable fatness, but what percentage of the population suffers from it? One or two percent? I'll bet well over 90% of the fatties suffers from "dropsy and heart fever", not to mention being mentally lazy as well. Beside throwing out the bad foods maybe they should throw out the T.V. and video games.

I would give the number of diseases which contribute to obesity a little higher than you, but that's not the case with these people as far as what they said. Heredity does a lot, but their diet is at least 1000 calories a day too much. Cut back to a regular diet and they'd lose 2lbs a week. That's safe and sustainable. Even if they don't lose weight, I don't see how they can say they are too fat to work. I have worked with nurses who were well over 300lbs. If they can work 12-16 hour shifts on their feet, then there is nothing stopping those people from working a regular 8 hour a day job.

 

[VanIsle]

Doesn't anybody go bowling anymore?

Love 5 pin but hate 10 pin. That huge heavy bowling ball is enough to throw your whole body out. They should call 10 pin bowling torture. There were a lot more bowling leagues when they had more 5 pin. For some silly reason they seem to think they get more people with 10 pin when I know of lots of people who would bowl if they could just go to a nice 5 pin lane.

 

[JLM]

Love 5 pin but hate 10 pin. That huge heavy bowling ball is enough to throw your whole body out. They should call 10 pin bowling torture. There were a lot more bowling leagues when they had more 5 pin. For some silly reason they seem to think they get more people with 10 pin when I know of lots of people who would bowl if they could just go to a nice 5 pin lane.

Yep, absolutely, I bowl on a 5 pin league and 5 is enough for me, sometimes I even have a problem getting all them down. Also with 10 pins it would only make sense if you got to throw 6 balls..........:lol:

 

[petros]

I'm SK. I'm out of your league. I like 5 Pin myself but I do like 10 as well for the challenge. Now that alley's are licensed, have half decent snacks, play music it's not as easy for me and the kid to get a lane like we used to. You actually have to phone in and book. It seems to be gaining popularity again.

 

[JLM]

I'm SK. I'm out of your league. I like 5 Pin myself but I do like 10 as well for the challenge. Now that alley's are licensed, have half decent snacks, play music it's not as easy for me and the kid to get a lane like we used to. You actually have to phone in and book. It seems to be gaining popularity again.

WE have six lanes here and I think the place is really struggling to make it, of course we're not like the big city basically lanes, balls,shoes for rent, coffee, chips and chocolate bars and that's about- Oh I forgot cosmic bowling.

 

[Unforgiven]

I would give the number of diseases which contribute to obesity a little higher than you, but that's not the case with these people as far as what they said. Heredity does a lot, but their diet is at least 1000 calories a day too much. Cut back to a regular diet and they'd lose 2lbs a week. That's safe and sustainable. Even if they don't lose weight, I don't see how they can say they are too fat to work. I have worked with nurses who were well over 300lbs. If they can work 12-16 hour shifts on their feet, then there is nothing stopping those people from working a regular 8 hour a day job.

Do you suppose that anorexia nervosa sufferers just need to eat more to solve their problem? Maybe it's just that they're too stupid to live?
Fact is there are so many reasons people over eat to the point of it ruining their health that you can't count them all.

Weight doesn't mean much either. It's the BMI that's going to tell the tale when it comes to fat. As well some people create fat differently than others. It's a complex issue that probably can't be reduced to a family that wants to have their own reality show.

 

[tracy]

Do you suppose that anorexia nervosa sufferers just need to eat more to solve their problem? Maybe it's just that they're too stupid to live?

Anorexia is a psychological disorder more than a physical one. In its simplest terms, yes the people just need to eat more but it obviously goes beyond that. They can't even see their bodies realistically. Overeating isn't the same in terms of the almost immediate physical toll or the psychological issues.

Fact is there are so many reasons people over eat to the point of it ruining their health that you can't count them all.

That's true, but it doesn't change the fact that at least some members of this family could work. I'm sure they are unhappy and have emotional reasons for eating. I'm sure it is a lifelong issue that will be difficult for them to change. We wouldn't have gastric bypass procedures if losing weight was easy. I'm even sure heredity plays a part in their weight. That doesn't make them unable to work. Millions of obese people go to their jobs every day. I'm not suggesting they dig ditches for a living because they obviously have physical limitations, but there are a lot of jobs out there which require minimal physical exertion.



Weight doesn't mean much either. It's the BMI that's going to tell the tale when it comes to fat. As well some people create fat differently than others. It's a complex issue that probably can't be reduced to a family that wants to have their own reality show.

Actually BMI isn't always so accurate in determining if someone is healthy or not. If you are muscular, you'll have a high BMI even if your overall size is normal and you're healthy. A smaller person without muscles can be a normal BMI even if their lifestyle habits are terrible and they have a nice potbelly which is priming them for health problems later in life. BMIs also ignore the more important issue of where you carry your fat. We know now that abdominal fat is much more harmful to health than fat carried around your hips or arms or whatever. So two people with the same BMI who are shaped differently can have very different health issues.