Then feel free to poison yourself all you want. Their track record of killing people is undeniable.
Swine Flu Update, 1100 Dead So Far
- Thread starter dumpthemonarchy
- Start date
The exact same thing could be said about herbal meds. The big difference is that big pharma has science on its side. You have folksy tales of Spanish women
I have my own 45 years of study and experience. Big Pharma has billions of dollars and millions of corpses on its side.
Billions of dollars I can see. That's what you get when you make a product that people want. Millions of corpses? I've seen as much proof of that as I have that oregano cures warts. I good salesman doesn't have to tear down the competition. One would think that (if your potions are half as good as you claim) you should be able to sell people on your ideas without knocking Jeff Kindler, calling him a killer and a liar.(that is what you are doing isn't it?)
Actually it would be safer to wash before you pee, unless it is a public washroom. If you have spent 4 hours touching a multitude of surfaces available to a multitude of people and then use a washroom designated for Staff only, that may not be where the harm will get you.
For all of you who thinks it's just big pharma - how about this news -
TORONTO - The swine-flu death of an otherwise healthy hockey-playing teen came without warning and should serve as a lesson to parents to keep a close eye on their ill children, the boy's grief-stricken father said Tuesday.
Paul Frustaglio said it took barely more than a day for the H1N1 flu virus to kill Evan - his "best friend" - who turned 13 last month, a fatality that public health officials called rare.
"He fell so quickly," Frustaglio told The Canadian Press. "I was watching him. I was there when he died."
Evan's death Monday came on the same day health authorities across Canada began rolling out a vaccination program against H1N1.
The teen would not have been considered a priority for the flu shot because he wasn't in a high-risk group.
The Grade 8 student began feeling ill over the weekend during a hockey tournament. His symptoms included fever and some vomiting.
His dad took him to a walk-in clinic on Sunday afternoon, where he was seen and sent home with advice to take over-the-counter medication.
The family felt confident it was a simple case of flu that would soon pass.
That seemed to be happening. By Monday morning, his fever had broken and he was no longer nauseated. The family thought he was on the mend.
Evan asked to take a bath. Ten minutes later, as his horrified father watched, he suddenly went limp.
His father tried CPR as paramedics rushed to the west-end home.
"They worked on my son feverishly for over two hours," Frustaglio said. "His heart wasn't responding. The disease had taken over his heart."
The tragedy follows the death Saturday of a 10-year-old eastern Ontario girl from H1N1. Vanetia Warner of Cornwall, Ont., was sick for several days before her condition rapidly deteriorated.
She died Saturday in Ottawa. It was not immediately known if she had any underlying medical conditions.
The swine flu has now killed close to 100 people across Canada. Ontario has had close to 30 deaths, six of them children, since April.
Three more deaths in British Columbia over the past week raised that province's total to 12.
Most victims - about 90 per cent - had underlying health conditions.
"Death is a rare event, and it's a particularly rare event in young people," said Dr. Arlene King, Ontario's medical officer of health.
Why the same strain of virus can cause mild symptoms in one healthy person and be lethal in another is a mystery, although its newness may be a factor.
"We don't have all of the answers," King said. "The key thing for all of us is to try to prevent ourselves from getting infected to begin with."
Dr. David McKeown, Toronto's medical officer of health, said Evan had "mild asthma," something his father disputed.
"Evan didn't have asthma; he had been prescribed puffers a few years ago when he had a cold," Frustaglio said.
"Most doctors do that these days, but it wasn't due to asthma."
Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty expressed sympathy for the family, calling it a "terrible tragedy."
The province, he said, was doing everything it could to provide a vaccination program as quickly as possible.
"I continue to have confidence in our public health officials," McGuinty said.
"They're making the right decisions, getting the vaccine into the communities as quickly as they can and respecting the order of priorities that they've put in place."
Frustaglio refused to criticize the walk-in clinic, saying he was in too much grief to think about what might have been done differently.
However, he did warn parents against complacency or thinking that patients with swine flu will show symptoms for many days before deteriorating gradually.
"This didn't even take a day and a half - it hit my son within 10 minutes," he said.
"If any one of your children has any kind of flu-like symptoms, please don't take your eyes off of them. Make sure you get the medical attention you need and, if at any time, they don't seem right, especially with their breathing, just get medical attention."
Evan's family began taking Tamiflu after his death as a precaution and immediately informed Evan's teammates of what had happened so they, too, could seek medical attention.
Evan is survived by his brother Will, 10, and his mom, Anne-Marie, who was too distressed to speak about her loss.
"I'm really having a hard time with this," she said.
Ontario Health Minister Deb Matthews said the "very sad case" should impress on people the need to get inoculated.
"It doesn't protect just you, it protects all the people around you," Matthews said.
Evans' death sparked an outpouring of sympathy and tributes on Facebook and YouTube, with numerous pictures and even a tribute video.
One Facebook writer said she hoped the tragedy would heighten awareness of the dangers of H1N1.
"I feel for your loss; my heart aches for your sorrow," Tracey Parr wrote.
"Hope Evan's passing will heighten the awareness of this flu, and preventative measures needed to be taken."
Frustaglio called Evan a "wonderful" boy who was "full of spirit." His son had switched this year to the Hill Academy north of Toronto - a small school with an emphasis on athletics - because "it was all about hockey."
"My son is gone. He was here just 24 hours ago and now he's not here. He was 13. He didn't deserve to die," he said.
"Whenever you hear stories like this in the press, I say to myself, 'Oh my god, I can never imagine how I could ever live without one of my kids,' and now I'm asking myself that question."
TORONTO - The swine-flu death of an otherwise healthy hockey-playing teen came without warning and should serve as a lesson to parents to keep a close eye on their ill children, the boy's grief-stricken father said Tuesday.
Paul Frustaglio said it took barely more than a day for the H1N1 flu virus to kill Evan - his "best friend" - who turned 13 last month, a fatality that public health officials called rare.
"He fell so quickly," Frustaglio told The Canadian Press. "I was watching him. I was there when he died."
Evan's death Monday came on the same day health authorities across Canada began rolling out a vaccination program against H1N1.
The teen would not have been considered a priority for the flu shot because he wasn't in a high-risk group.
The Grade 8 student began feeling ill over the weekend during a hockey tournament. His symptoms included fever and some vomiting.
His dad took him to a walk-in clinic on Sunday afternoon, where he was seen and sent home with advice to take over-the-counter medication.
The family felt confident it was a simple case of flu that would soon pass.
That seemed to be happening. By Monday morning, his fever had broken and he was no longer nauseated. The family thought he was on the mend.
Evan asked to take a bath. Ten minutes later, as his horrified father watched, he suddenly went limp.
His father tried CPR as paramedics rushed to the west-end home.
"They worked on my son feverishly for over two hours," Frustaglio said. "His heart wasn't responding. The disease had taken over his heart."
The tragedy follows the death Saturday of a 10-year-old eastern Ontario girl from H1N1. Vanetia Warner of Cornwall, Ont., was sick for several days before her condition rapidly deteriorated.
She died Saturday in Ottawa. It was not immediately known if she had any underlying medical conditions.
The swine flu has now killed close to 100 people across Canada. Ontario has had close to 30 deaths, six of them children, since April.
Three more deaths in British Columbia over the past week raised that province's total to 12.
Most victims - about 90 per cent - had underlying health conditions.
"Death is a rare event, and it's a particularly rare event in young people," said Dr. Arlene King, Ontario's medical officer of health.
Why the same strain of virus can cause mild symptoms in one healthy person and be lethal in another is a mystery, although its newness may be a factor.
"We don't have all of the answers," King said. "The key thing for all of us is to try to prevent ourselves from getting infected to begin with."
Dr. David McKeown, Toronto's medical officer of health, said Evan had "mild asthma," something his father disputed.
"Evan didn't have asthma; he had been prescribed puffers a few years ago when he had a cold," Frustaglio said.
"Most doctors do that these days, but it wasn't due to asthma."
Ontario Premier Dalton McGuinty expressed sympathy for the family, calling it a "terrible tragedy."
The province, he said, was doing everything it could to provide a vaccination program as quickly as possible.
"I continue to have confidence in our public health officials," McGuinty said.
"They're making the right decisions, getting the vaccine into the communities as quickly as they can and respecting the order of priorities that they've put in place."
Frustaglio refused to criticize the walk-in clinic, saying he was in too much grief to think about what might have been done differently.
However, he did warn parents against complacency or thinking that patients with swine flu will show symptoms for many days before deteriorating gradually.
"This didn't even take a day and a half - it hit my son within 10 minutes," he said.
"If any one of your children has any kind of flu-like symptoms, please don't take your eyes off of them. Make sure you get the medical attention you need and, if at any time, they don't seem right, especially with their breathing, just get medical attention."
Evan's family began taking Tamiflu after his death as a precaution and immediately informed Evan's teammates of what had happened so they, too, could seek medical attention.
Evan is survived by his brother Will, 10, and his mom, Anne-Marie, who was too distressed to speak about her loss.
"I'm really having a hard time with this," she said.
Ontario Health Minister Deb Matthews said the "very sad case" should impress on people the need to get inoculated.
"It doesn't protect just you, it protects all the people around you," Matthews said.
Evans' death sparked an outpouring of sympathy and tributes on Facebook and YouTube, with numerous pictures and even a tribute video.
One Facebook writer said she hoped the tragedy would heighten awareness of the dangers of H1N1.
"I feel for your loss; my heart aches for your sorrow," Tracey Parr wrote.
"Hope Evan's passing will heighten the awareness of this flu, and preventative measures needed to be taken."
Frustaglio called Evan a "wonderful" boy who was "full of spirit." His son had switched this year to the Hill Academy north of Toronto - a small school with an emphasis on athletics - because "it was all about hockey."
"My son is gone. He was here just 24 hours ago and now he's not here. He was 13. He didn't deserve to die," he said.
"Whenever you hear stories like this in the press, I say to myself, 'Oh my god, I can never imagine how I could ever live without one of my kids,' and now I'm asking myself that question."
As one doctor said to me, 'you can't kill youself with your own urine, but god knows where your hands have been...'
That has to be the saddest thing I've heard for awhile, and yet I'm not sure if there's a lesson to be learned from outside of everytime you see a person could the last. Sometimes seemly healthy young kids drop dead from a heart attack while playing hockey or soccer. I guess it just drives home the old adage "there's no guarantees in life".
Is it possible to have a proven vaccine for a pandemic? The definition of a pandemic is a new and unexpected outbreak, so how can there be a proven vaccine for something which is new and unexpected?
ill take the vaccine, but im going to wait till january JUST to be sure for MY own piece of mind... I dont want to turn into a zombie but be one of the humanities last few jk
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I think this is a good time to take the word of medical professionals and put aside dogmatic thinking.
We've been told this was coming for months. Playing at semantics only proves your ignorance.
The US food and drug investigated and tested the "swine flu" vaccine months ago, and declared it "safe" (barring the very few cases which are going to prove the rule). The US F&D is a very conservative element, and does not take its job lightly.
Canada is basing its' declaration of safety on a small study done in Belgium. We DON'T HAVE the public health research infrastructure to do it quickly thanks to government underfunding in the past and at present, both by libs and cons. For this the govt. should hang its' head in shame, which, of course, it won't.
This flu is cutting a sort of swath through our primary schools in E. Ont. at the moment, and all of our grandchildren have the flu. Swine?? hooonose. Couple of kids have died in Ont., and that's two too many. They got sick before the vaccine was released.
This info was gleaned from the Ottawa Citizen, and from various online sites. Refer to "Weakened system put to the test" in today's Citizen online.
So, this if for info only, and I'm not interested in debating it with anyone. Just a bit too close to home and personal for me. Read it, use it, or run around with your head up your ass. No difference to me.
I can't get the vaccine (over 65), until it's released to us old fogies later in Nov., at which time, I shall. Any media hysteria concerning "side effects" should be documented and wafting away by that time.
Amongst other things, Canadian ineptitude has to be the best in the world.
The H1N1 Vaccine is a different mix in the USA than it is in Canada. The
American version doesn't have the Adjuvant, and Canada's does (except
for a small percentage that is being shipped in from Australia).
Canada can't base it's testing on the Vaccine on American results for this
reason. I'll be getting the shot (& the seasonal flu shot too) in the later 1/2
of November once it's available to the general public in Saskatchewan,
assuming it is available in sufficient quantities at that time still.
American version doesn't have the Adjuvant, and Canada's does (except
for a small percentage that is being shipped in from Australia).
Canada can't base it's testing on the Vaccine on American results for this
reason. I'll be getting the shot (& the seasonal flu shot too) in the later 1/2
of November once it's available to the general public in Saskatchewan,
assuming it is available in sufficient quantities at that time still.
I don't know what information you are getting but even on our local health site, they explain the adjuvant and it's lack of danger to each person. I think people have to bear in mind that we are talking about one shot here. Our vaccine was made in France. Americans have been having the adjuvant all along with regular flu shots.
Every year I have received the flu shot.. I started to get it when I worked at Health Canada as a precaution to my own health after discussing the topic with many of the directors and then following up with my own doctors opinion for my own health condition. I have never suffered ill effects from any of the shots and it has always served me well in protecting me in some form or shape against the worse of the flu effects.
This week I need to go see my Family GP and they have the H1N1 Flu shot that his receptionist told me they might give me as i fall within the risk group people. My son ( 5 years old ) also falls within the risk group category but he will not be with me as the doctor is "too busy" to see him as well and can only have time to see me.
That boy in Toronto would not have been saved by the flu shot as it had not been released yet, or so they said in the news I saw. Now from what I understand, the clinics and doctors offices will be even more rushed to get this shot then they were before.
For some of us in the "risk group" category it could be the difference between life or death. Basically your damned if you do and you could be worse off if you do but hey that's life. That said I will stick with what I have known for years and take the shot I always have. After all its no different then the new blend of strains that come out every year.
This week I need to go see my Family GP and they have the H1N1 Flu shot that his receptionist told me they might give me as i fall within the risk group people. My son ( 5 years old ) also falls within the risk group category but he will not be with me as the doctor is "too busy" to see him as well and can only have time to see me.
That boy in Toronto would not have been saved by the flu shot as it had not been released yet, or so they said in the news I saw. Now from what I understand, the clinics and doctors offices will be even more rushed to get this shot then they were before.
For some of us in the "risk group" category it could be the difference between life or death. Basically your damned if you do and you could be worse off if you do but hey that's life. That said I will stick with what I have known for years and take the shot I always have. After all its no different then the new blend of strains that come out every year.