Provincial Debt getting more expensive
- Thread starter Goober
- Start date
I don't need to, I already know the answer.
BTW - The biggest holder of (outright) mineral rights is the CPR.
I suspect that the mining companies that you are referring to have to purchase certain rights along with a royalty for the resources they extract.
If CPR were to extract any resources from the lands to which they hold the mineral rights, they would not have to pay one thin dime in royalties.. That's a far cry from the (max) 40% royalty rate that AB oil companies have to pay to produce oil.
...as do the folk harvesting 'your' oil. Now, what has any of it to do with equalization (my sidetrack) or the Ontario debt (the topic)?
It does.... Either your steering is screwed or there's a loose nut behind your wheel
WTF!?
You bring up equalization out of the clear blue sky and then wonder how the issue came about?
Get some sleep man, me thinks that you're getting delerious
You bring up equalization out of the clear blue sky and then wonder how the issue came about?
Get some sleep man, me thinks that you're getting delerious
Equalization will affect the have not provinces if the formula is changed. Presently approx 50 % of natural resources are included in the formula. My best guess on that.
If it is changed then less money becomes available. Look to Quebec who receives the lions share. If equalization payments were frozen at a top level / some cap of sorts much like Medicare funds.This would result in an overall reduction in funds as inflation eats away.
Many Have Provinces are unhappy with the present formula. Look at BC with a deficit - high debt - are they going to be happy about sending more money. Same with AB.
Regardless Ontario was put on a watch due to interest rate increases that are not factored into the budget. Quebec will be next on the Watch block along with some Maritime Provinces.
When this affects 2 or 3 provinces in a negative way it impacts across the country.
Just my thoughts is all.
If it is changed then less money becomes available. Look to Quebec who receives the lions share. If equalization payments were frozen at a top level / some cap of sorts much like Medicare funds.This would result in an overall reduction in funds as inflation eats away.
Many Have Provinces are unhappy with the present formula. Look at BC with a deficit - high debt - are they going to be happy about sending more money. Same with AB.
Regardless Ontario was put on a watch due to interest rate increases that are not factored into the budget. Quebec will be next on the Watch block along with some Maritime Provinces.
When this affects 2 or 3 provinces in a negative way it impacts across the country.
Just my thoughts is all.
This is just the start.
Moody’s downgrades Ontario credit rating - The Globe and Mail
One of the world's major credit rating agencies has downgraded Ontario, citing its swollen debt burden and the challenges of meeting its fiscal targets.
Thursday's decision by Moody's Investors Service followed a warning, and dimmer outlook, a day earlier by rival Standard & Poor's.
Moody's downgraded the province to Aa2 from Aa1. The latter carried a “negative outlook,” while the new, lower grade carries a “stable” one.
The downgrade of Ontario's rating reflects the growing debt burden and the risks surrounding the province achieving its medium-term fiscal plan given the subdued growth outlook, extended timeframe back to balance and ambitious expenditure targets,” said Jennifer Wong, the lead Moody's analyst where Ontario is concerned.
Moody’s downgrades Ontario credit rating - The Globe and Mail
One of the world's major credit rating agencies has downgraded Ontario, citing its swollen debt burden and the challenges of meeting its fiscal targets.
Thursday's decision by Moody's Investors Service followed a warning, and dimmer outlook, a day earlier by rival Standard & Poor's.
Moody's downgraded the province to Aa2 from Aa1. The latter carried a “negative outlook,” while the new, lower grade carries a “stable” one.
The downgrade of Ontario's rating reflects the growing debt burden and the risks surrounding the province achieving its medium-term fiscal plan given the subdued growth outlook, extended timeframe back to balance and ambitious expenditure targets,” said Jennifer Wong, the lead Moody's analyst where Ontario is concerned.
There are some things to consider here. First governments have concentrated on
tax breaks for companies to encourage them to invest. These governments should
have instead made them pay their share of the tax burden for the services that all
Canadians receive. The way it is now, at all levels, ordinary citizens pay for it all.
Business small and large, get the services, without paying their share.
The second mistake for government is that they have had the wrong priorities for
far too long. Investment is social programs is fine and noble. Without some limits
and financial oversight these programs get out of control and threaten the over all
integrity of the original program. Employment Insurance is one for example it became
a catch all to compensate everyone for everything. It started as an insurance program
on a temporary basis if one lost their job.
The list goes on. What has to happen is, we need a national discussion to set our
mutual priorities, and we need to ensure that all citizens pay their share. The rich, companies
middle class folks, and even the poor. Those on assistance could pay as little as ten bucks
a month in taxation on income. It would ensure they were at least paying something and
therefore contributing.
Governments are getting the idea, it is time to pay the bills.
tax breaks for companies to encourage them to invest. These governments should
have instead made them pay their share of the tax burden for the services that all
Canadians receive. The way it is now, at all levels, ordinary citizens pay for it all.
Business small and large, get the services, without paying their share.
The second mistake for government is that they have had the wrong priorities for
far too long. Investment is social programs is fine and noble. Without some limits
and financial oversight these programs get out of control and threaten the over all
integrity of the original program. Employment Insurance is one for example it became
a catch all to compensate everyone for everything. It started as an insurance program
on a temporary basis if one lost their job.
The list goes on. What has to happen is, we need a national discussion to set our
mutual priorities, and we need to ensure that all citizens pay their share. The rich, companies
middle class folks, and even the poor. Those on assistance could pay as little as ten bucks
a month in taxation on income. It would ensure they were at least paying something and
therefore contributing.
Governments are getting the idea, it is time to pay the bills.
I don't know about 'living' there, but it's probably fair to say that there are too many in the government
'Have not' provinces get the greater amount of equalization for two options with respect to natural resources. They can fully exclude natural resources, or exclude 50%. Which ever scenario gets them more money, that is what goes into the formula. The reason we have these two parallel schemes is that the Conservatives accepted an expert panel's recommendations in 2006 to include 50% of natural resource revenue, but the Conservatives had campaigned on excluding natural resources from the formula. So they compromised.
Ontario has blowin er, sorry, spent 8 BILLION dollars on "green" energy that hasn't done a thing for Ontario but raise utility rates with no "green" solutions in sight and still, McGuinty was (unbelievably) re-elected. How does that happen?
Probably because he is the only person on the planet that can untangle this massive knot that has been developed.
Kinda sad really, the only person that can possibly understand the scope of the mess and provide any form of solution is the one that created the problem in the first place.
Kinda sad really, the only person that can possibly understand the scope of the mess and provide any form of solution is the one that created the problem in the first place.
I wouldn't say "created".... The sale of a public utility - Ontario Hydro-Electric Commission to the for-profit sector - most likely did a lot more to create the problem. "Green" just added its weight to a snowballing clusterf**k
Ontario's situation today is the result of many decisions made by multiple administrations over many years. I believe that the recent crop of politicians zigged when they should have zagged - but that's all hindsight now.
On the sale of Ontario Hydro Electricity; I can see that having an impact, but ultimately, the reality is that the province was probably subsidizing electricity to keep the costs down to the consumer. That may have meant that the 'public company' was losing money and adding a burden to the provincial operating costs.
Only if we were able to review both the audited and unaudited books relative to both the public and private ops could we realistically provide an educated opinion on the utility and make comparisons, but I suspect that the circumstance in Ont is/was not different than when AB deregulated (and sold-off) the utilities
On the sale of Ontario Hydro Electricity; I can see that having an impact, but ultimately, the reality is that the province was probably subsidizing electricity to keep the costs down to the consumer. That may have meant that the 'public company' was losing money and adding a burden to the provincial operating costs.
Only if we were able to review both the audited and unaudited books relative to both the public and private ops could we realistically provide an educated opinion on the utility and make comparisons, but I suspect that the circumstance in Ont is/was not different than when AB deregulated (and sold-off) the utilities