On the evolution of The Origin of Species

ironsides

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Now on a more serious note. Why do they still call evolution a theory? There is more than enough evidence to prove that it is a fact.
 

Dexter Sinister

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Oct 1, 2004
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Because it IS a theory, in the scientific sense, which means it's a coherent body of observations, ideas, information, and analyses that describe and explain a specified range of phenomena; it is empirical, falsifiable, predictive, and testable. In common usage the word theory is used in a weak sense to mean a belief or speculation, but that's not what it means in science.
 

GreenFish66

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If there is no God we will create one ..Then we will know for sure...Humans are creationists by nature ...

I always found it unfair as to how a grub can turn into a flying june bug ..While us apes still have to walk...When will we evolve wings ?..If only we could talk to the birds to find out how they did it..:)

Thank God for airplanes..

Panspermia Theory - creationism at it's finest.. God shoots the seed, mother planets watch their children bloom into new life..

" Space the final frontier.."
 
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Tonington

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petros

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Dexter pretty much covered it, but I started a thread on the conventions in science with respect to fact, and the differences between hypotheses, theories and laws. A little over a year ago.

http://forums.canadiancontent.net/s...ng-scientific-naming-convention-theories.html

There is a biblical connection.

Dr. Al A. "Louis" Jah PhD was the first biologist and second cousin to Abraham.

He was told by God that tree of life was in reality the tree of evolution.

But he got smote by zealots.
 

karrie

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Now on a more serious note. Why do they still call evolution a theory? There is more than enough evidence to prove that it is a fact.

I don't think it's quantifiable enough to call it fact. You can't accurately predict the outcome of a+b+c, at least not with our current knowledge.
 

Tonington

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But evolution is a fact of life here on Earth.

If you could predict it with a simple formula, then it would be a law. But it's more involved than that, there are too many factors to make a simple equation.
 

karrie

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But evolution is a fact of life here on Earth.

If you could predict it with a simple formula, then it would be a law. But it's more involved than that, there are too many factors to make a simple equation.

law, that's what I meant. I'll go drink more coffee and stay out of the brainy conversations. lol.
 

karrie

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No, don't leave! Drink coffee and stay. :smile:

lol.. alrighty then.

So, you were saying there are too many factors to make a simple equation, but, I can't help but wonder at what point in science's evolution, that we will have quantified the way genes are passed on, and the effect that environmental factors have on them. Surely not a simple equation, but, I can't help but wonder if there will be a day where an equation will exist nonetheless.
 

petros

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He is my favourite question to ask those who doubt evolution.

Fossils are truths correct? We all agree fossils were once living beings. We all agree that Lignum and coal was once life. We all agree the carboniferous rock piled up everywhere was once alive.

So here is my question; If all of this was living during the time previous to the "deluge" a mere 2000ish years. How did anything move and run free? There would be life piled 10km high on the earth from the deeps of the oceans to far far above the tops of the highest mountains. Where is that described in the bible?
 

karrie

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He is my favourite question to ask those who doubt evolution.

Fossils are truths correct? We all agree fossils were once living beings. We all agree that Lignum and coal was once life. We all agree the carboniferous rock piled up everywhere was once alive.

So here is my question; If all of this was living during the time previous to the "deluge" a mere 2000ish years. How did anything move and run free? There would be life piled 10km high on the earth from the deeps of the oceans to far far above the tops of the highest mountains. Where is that described in the bible?

Where does the Bible claim life began with Jesus? I don't recall him being in the creation story, nor do I recall the Bible giving a real timeline for how long the time between creation and the birth of Christ was.

Of course, I'm Catholic, and view the creation story as just that... a story... so I'm not truly your target audience with this challenge, but, your argument seems a bit flawed.
 

petros

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Nor do I. Where did you come up with that notion? Jesus lived between 4000BC and 2000BC before Noah?

I guess maybe the second coming already happened ?
 

karrie

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Nor do I. Where did you come up with that notion? Jesus lived between 4000BC and 2000BC before Noah?

I guess maybe the second coming already happened ?

Sorry... I read you wrong. I get what you're asking now. But I don't quite get why you would think all of it had to be alive right up until the 'deluge'. Does it say somewhere in the Bible that nothing died until the flood? I will admit to not being polished on all my Bible knowledge.
 

petros

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It's not that they were all alive at once but that much life to have lived within that short time is such an impossibility that it shatters any notion of the age of the earth being 6000years old.

For example. To make 1 ft of coal it takes 20feet of dead forest compressed. Nearly the same goes for limestone formation in either solution or compression. Limestone can be compressed even further into marble etc etc etc.

The amount of life to create such strata is mind bogglingly vast.
 

Tonington

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lol.. alrighty then.

So, you were saying there are too many factors to make a simple equation, but, I can't help but wonder at what point in science's evolution, that we will have quantified the way genes are passed on, and the effect that environmental factors have on them. Surely not a simple equation, but, I can't help but wonder if there will be a day where an equation will exist nonetheless.

I think it's nearly impossible. The best explanation to my knowledge is that genetics loads the gun, and the environment pulls the trigger. Just exactly what the trigger is, and how those triggers become more or less likely in the future is impossible to model accurately. When does a new species cross boundaries into the niche occupied by the previously dominant species? Impacts from meteors, climatic changes, random genetic drift....

I think it's too much to ever be a law, but that's not a bad thing. Laws and theories are useful for different reasons. A theory works much better when there is significant amounts of dynamic processes in a system. Evolution I think is not conducive to a Law. You would need to integrate probably hundreds of equations...and then how do you overcome the butterfly effect? The starting point would certainly matter, but subsequent changes would matter equally, if not more...

Maybe some day. Maybe. Onwards and upwards!