Obama urges future Palestinian state be based on '67 borders

[Unforgiven]

Gaza has their back to the sea.

Do you fail to understand the point? It's not a location it's a state of mind.

Us citizens do not live there, not even some 5-7M Arab Israelis are allowed to live there and when Gaza did vote for a Government the US and Israel declared it 'void'. Why would anybody from there listen to the US? lol look how fast the US backtracks as soon as money and winning are mentioned.

Syria, Egypt, Iran all have a voice there too. Just like the US. Most people in Gaza do listen to the US and others when they talk reason. There is a strong faction of activists that refuse any and all attempts to reach a peace agreement. When someone reasonable gains ground in working toward peace, these same activists will be at the root cause of an act that destroys any ground made toward a peaceful resolution.

The IDF has one purpose and that is to prevent attacks of Israelis. They do that well and their retaliation is overwhelming. Knowing that there will be a major response, these activist agent provocateurs step up and make sure there is no lasting negotiation between the Palestinian and Israeli people.

Israeli hands are clean but any time there is a reckoning there, some Palestinian sends rockets into Israel or suicide bomber attempts to kill people.

It isn't about land, that's a bluff to continue a war that has become a lifestyle.

 

[MHz]

Syria, Egypt, Iran all have a voice there too. Just like the US. Most people in Gaza do listen to the US and others when they talk reason. There is a strong faction of activists that refuse any and all attempts to reach a peace agreement. When someone reasonable gains ground in working toward peace, these same activists will be at the root cause of an act that destroys any ground made toward a peaceful resolution.

The IDF has one purpose and that is to prevent attacks of Israelis. They do that well and their retaliation is overwhelming. Knowing that there will be a major response, these activist agent provocateurs step up and make sure there is no lasting negotiation between the Palestinian and Israeli people.

Israeli hands are clean but any time there is a reckoning there, some Palestinian sends rockets into Israel or suicide bomber attempts to kill people.

No, not just like the US, the US always puts Israel's 'rights' above anybody else. She gives Israel that $3b in arms, the area also sees her 'donating' another $10B or so to other Nations in the are the general area.

How often does she 'talk reason' in that Gaza has the say in what is and is not acceptable, if she has grievances those have to be settled in a civilized fashion, take them to court. When that avenue is constantly blocked then the ones doing the blocking are probably not operating within the same guidelines that are demanded of others. Going after the money is a choice, after all that was a 'threat' she even used against the Prez of the US, successfully I might add but no real surprise. Independence for Palestine if they help win the 'war' and the Balfour Declaration II all in the same week. lol

 

[mentalfloss]

Netanyahu 'to tell truth' to Congress


WASHINGTON: The Israeli Prime Minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, has foreshadowed a vision of a ''secure peace'' for the Middle East in a planned address to a joint meeting of the US Congress. ''I intend to speak the unvarnished truth because now more than ever, what we need is peace,'' Mr Netanyahu said on Monday night in an address to the biggest pro-Israel lobby in the US, the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, during its annual meeting in Washington.

''I will talk about the dangers of a nuclear-armed Iran. I will also outline a vision for a secure Israeli-Palestinian peace.'' In his remarks to about 11,000 delegates at the Washington Convention Centre, Mr Netanyahu emphasised that ''Israel cannot return to the indefensible 1967 borders''. He said ''peace between Palestinians and Israelis is a vital interest for us, but it is not a panacea for the problems of the Middle East''.

Mr Netanyahu, who was heckled at least three times during his 30-minute speech by a Jewish group supporting territorial concessions, said it was crucial that Palestinians accepted Israel's nature as a Jewish state, which the Palestinian Authority President, Mahmoud Abbas, has been unwilling to do.

Netanyahu 'to tell truth' to Congress
​

 

[petros]

He's going to stop lieing?

 

[mentalfloss]

He's going to stop lieing?

 

[Colpy]

Netanyahu 'to tell truth' to Congress


WASHINGTON: The Israeli Prime Minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, has foreshadowed a vision of a ''secure peace'' for the Middle East in a planned address to a joint meeting of the US Congress. ''I intend to speak the unvarnished truth because now more than ever, what we need is peace,'' Mr Netanyahu said on Monday night in an address to the biggest pro-Israel lobby in the US, the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, during its annual meeting in Washington.

''I will talk about the dangers of a nuclear-armed Iran. I will also outline a vision for a secure Israeli-Palestinian peace.'' In his remarks to about 11,000 delegates at the Washington Convention Centre, Mr Netanyahu emphasised that ''Israel cannot return to the indefensible 1967 borders''. He said ''peace between Palestinians and Israelis is a vital interest for us, but it is not a panacea for the problems of the Middle East''.

Mr Netanyahu, who was heckled at least three times during his 30-minute speech by a Jewish group supporting territorial concessions, said it was crucial that Palestinians accepted Israel's nature as a Jewish state, which the Palestinian Authority President, Mahmoud Abbas, has been unwilling to do.

Netanyahu 'to tell truth' to Congress
​

Which he did:

The only truly free Arabs living in the Middle East are the one million who live in Israel, a combative and uncompromising Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu told a joint session of the U.S. Congress convened in his honor.

“Less than one half of one percent” of the region’s 300-million Arabs “are truly free and they all live in Israel,” he claimed to a largely supportive Congress.

Chew on THAT for awhile.......because, although slightly exaggerated, it is basically true.

He painted a stark picture of a malevolent Iran, a tyrannical theocracy determined to build nuclear warheads and pursue the annihilation of Israel.

“Those who dismiss it are sticking their head in the sand,” Mr. Netanyahu said of the threat posed by a nuclear-armed Iran.

Yep.

"I stood before my people and said, I will accept a Palestinian state,” Mr. Netanyahu said. “It’s time for (Palestinian) President Abbas to stand before his people and say, ‘ I will accept a Jewish state.”

And that is impossible, as long as Hamas exists........

And until Hamas recognizes Israel's right to exist and gives up its homicidal role, and until Fatah recognizes the "right of return" is a joke.....there will be no peace.

 

[mentalfloss]

Oh, I agree - there will be no peace. These guys can't even agree to a two state solution. We're at a point where we might be better off just giving up any support for either and letting them massacre each other to come to a solution.

 

[petros]

Oh, I agree - there will be no peace. These guys can't even agree to a two state solution. We're at a point where we might be better off just giving up any support for either and letting them massacre each other to come to a solution.

Works for me!

 

[CDNBear]

Stop! You're killing me with laughter!

Way to ignore reality. I guess the facts in that post were just too much for you.

They should have stayed in Russia.

Is that where your Christians are?

These guys can't even agree to a two state solution.

When you say these guys, you mean Palestinians right?

"I stood before my people and said, I will accept a Palestinian state,” Mr. Netanyahu said.

You do know who Netanyahu is right?

 

[ironsides]

Gaza has their back to the sea.

Us citizens do not live there, not even some 5-7M Arab Israelis are allowed to live there and when Gaza did vote for a Government the US and Israel declared it 'void'. Why would anybody from there listen to the US? lol look how fast the US backtracks as soon as money and winning are mentioned.

and Israel doesn't have their back to the sea? Gaza is just a city and territory belonging to the Hamas controlled Palestinian territory. Population of Gaza is about 1.5 million, 1 million being refugees. If the Gaza strip would leave Israel alone, Israel probably would give it back. Gaza has never been self ruled or independent.

 

[CUBert]

"I stood before my people and said, I will accept a Palestinian state,” Mr. Netanyahu said. "With an extraordinary amount of bull**** conditions. "


FixeD

 

[Just the Facts]

"I stood before my people and said, I will accept a Palestinian state,” Mr. Netanyahu said. "With an extraordinary amount of bull**** conditions. "


FixeD

lol well he could take a page out of the Arab book and just call the West Bank "Occupied Jewish West Jordan" and leave it that. End of Palestinian state aspirations. Fini. Syanara. Kaput. Hello fat lady.

Then the world can wonder about the brutal occupation of Jewish land by all those Arabs.

 

[Unforgiven]

No, not just like the US, the US always puts Israel's 'rights' above anybody else.

Well the right to exist over the right to exterminate Jews, yeah.

She gives Israel that $3b in arms, the area also sees her 'donating' another $10B or so to other Nations in the are the general area.

After the cost of WWII it's not a bad price. At least no Americans have to storm beaches to get a foothold to start the fight again.

How often does she 'talk reason' in that Gaza has the say in what is and is not acceptable, if she has grievances those have to be settled in a civilized fashion, take them to court.

Reason is always an option, but both sides have to accept that and no one is allowed to interrupt that discussion with violence without consequences. Security in Gaza has to be provided by the police in Gaza. No one in Toronto is allowed to fire off rockets trying to kill others they don't get along with without getting the hammer brought down on them. If the Palestinians in Gaza want peace they must act in a peaceful way. When they do, the rest of the world supports their efforts.

Continuing a life of attacking the IDF or Israelis by rocket or suicide bombing then crying about how terrible the IDF is to them doesn't win any support.

When that avenue is constantly blocked then the ones doing the blocking are probably not operating within the same guidelines that are demanded of others. Going after the money is a choice, after all that was a 'threat' she even used against the Prez of the US, successfully I might add but no real surprise. Independence for Palestine if they help win the 'war' and the Balfour Declaration II all in the same week. lol

He just pointed out the obvious. No one take Gaza seriously until the public there takes peace with Israel seriously. Once that happens in perpetuity, all the fears of the nay sayers like Netanyahu can be ignored for more reasonable voices within Israel. But if Netanyahu has a point about security and the people of Gaza have to act like blood thirsty maniacs breeding martyrs for the slaughter, Netanyahu becomes the reasonable one. So everyone listens to him.

You have to come to court with clean hands. If anyone is blocking that avenue it's the Palestinians themselves.

 

[MHz]

After the cost of WWII it's not a bad price. At least no Americans have to storm beaches to get a foothold to start the fight again.

lol the cost ow WWII was an increase in debt to the bankers, you should wish you were going into debt that slowly these days, tick, tock, tick tock.

8/29/2008 $9,645,725,555,640.02


6/30/1955 $274,374,222,802.62


$176,817,949,676 further into the hole every year. Perhaps you should have given up war as a career at the end of WWII.

 

[PoliticalNick]

And until Hamas recognizes Israel's right to exist and gives up its homicidal role, and until Fatah recognizes the "right of return" is a joke.....there will be no peace.

You mean that same 'right of return' that was the basis for the formation of Israel. So, ergo, Israel is a joke too! Glad your finally starting to see sense.

 

[Colpy]

The Middle East has no difficulty understanding that if (a) your war aim is not to have a Jewish state in your region, which has been the Arab/Muslim aim all along, then (b) making peace with a Jewish state next door, on whatever terms, means (c) defeat. Nor does the Middle East have any difficulty understanding that if (a) your war aim is to establish and defend a Jewish State, which has been the Israeli war aim from the beginning, then (b) achieving peace with neighbours who oppose it, on almost any terms, spells (c) victory.

George Jonas is a brilliant guy. A very good article.

George Jonas: Obama doesn’t get the arithmetic of the Israel-Palestine situation | Full Comment | National Post

 

[petros]

Would you prefer they formed a state as is and went for war reparations?

 

[gopher]

Over the years I have accused Republicans of never being consistent in the application of their so called principles and this thread again proves my point. I have always said that in order for a set of principles to be valid they must be applied on a uniform basis. There must never be any double standards. The Republicans (and their wannabe pals) repeatedly assert that they are the champions of democratization and integration both at home and abroad. If their ideas and actions were as valid as they claim them to be, they would have no choice but to apply them in Israel-Palestine by demanding a one state solution. Their failure to do so invalidates their claims because their policies are based on expediency, not principle. Thank you for again proving that in your heart you know that what I wrote is the truth.

 

[Unforgiven]

lol the cost ow WWII was an increase in debt to the bankers, you should wish you were going into debt that slowly these days, tick, tock, tick tock.

8/29/2008 $9,645,725,555,640.02


6/30/1955 $274,374,222,802.62

We just print our own money now.

$176,817,949,676 further into the hole every year. Perhaps you should have given up war as a career at the end of WWII.

As they say, if people don't start sh!t there won't be any sh!t. But people just keep starting it. We keep remodeling their countries in rustic stone age and dead.

 

[mentalfloss]

You do know who Netanyahu is right?

I'm very withdrawn from this conflict, so all apologies if I make any ignorant statements.

But the way I look at it is that whenever you have two powers in conflict, it is always the greater power that should bear the greater burden or make more concessions. The reason for this is that the greater power truly has more control over whether or not there can be peace in the region.

With that in mind, as far as I understand - since 1967 Israel began to use it's greater power to advance its own state...

1967 Palestinian exodus

The 1967 Palestinian exodus refers to the flight of around 280,000 to 325,000 Palestinians[1] out of the territories because their local leaders warned them to leave this land and they may come back after the war.Due to that this land taken by Israel during and in the aftermath of the Six-Day War including the demolition of the Palestinian villages of Imwas, Yalo, and Bayt Nuba, Surit, Beit Awwa, Beit Mirsem, Shuyukh, Jiftlik, Agarith and Huseirat and the "emptying" of the refugee camps of ʿAqabat Jabr and ʿEin Sulṭān.[2] The Special Committee heard allegations of the destruction of over 400 Arab villages, but no evidence in corroboration was furnished to the Special Committee to investigate Israeli practices affecting the human rights of the population of the occupied territories.[3]

Approximately 145,000 of the 1967 Palestinian refugees were refugees from the 1948 Arab-Israeli War.[4] By December 1967, 245,000 had fled from the West Bank and Gaza Strip to Jordan, 11,000 had fled from Gaza to Egypt and 116,000 Palestinians and Syrians had fled from the Golan Heights further into Syria.[4]

Before the Six-Day War, roughly half of all Palestinians still lived within the boundaries of former British Mandate of Palestine, but after the war the majority lived outside the territory.[citation needed][4]

A 1971 United Nations report claimed that:

The continual pressure applied by Israeli authorities on the Palestinian population created a climate of fear within the civil population leading to a cycle of resistance and Israeli reprisals.[5] The Israeli Government carried out a policy of the destruction of Palestinian society by harassment (parts of the rural population were transferred from their homes) and arbitrary deportation of leaders and intellectuals from among the inhabitants of the occupied territories (judges, barristers, advocates, doctors, teachers, religious leaders).[6]

After the psychological warfare unit made a visit to Qalqilya and many of the residents had fled, the UN representative Nils-Göran Gussing noted that 850 of the town's 2,000 houses were demolished.[7]


1967 Palestinian exodus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


So, in this case, it seems that this land was taken over unfairly and duly caused further disruption and conflict. When a state with greater power uses that power irresponsibly (as in the case above), they're just causing more trouble for themselves and everyone else.