Israel stands alone

Colpy

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Nov 5, 2005
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I can't describe Zionism better than these people:

YouTube - Jewish Mom Realizes Zionist Upbringing Was Racism

YouTube - Good Jews Who Refuse to Kill Palestinians

YouTube - Israeli Soldiers Refuse To Serve In Palestine: Part 1 (2002)

YouTube - Zionism is Racism and racism is bad...

I support Jews and Israelis who want to live in peace. I am against violence, war crimes and crimes against humanity.

Yep.

Anywhere there are two Jews there are three opinions.

The Jews are the most hated people on earth. One third of the world population were murdered 1941-45.......and that was merely the climax of 2000 years of extreme persecution. The Jewish population has never recovered from the loss of the Holocaust, and probably never will. There are less than 14 million Jews alive today. They need and deserve a secure homeland, as the world has proven that Jews will never be safe living in other societies.

The creation of Israel was only good sense.

Israel as a Jewish state is here to stay.

The Arab population needs to deal with that.
 

CDNBear

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Sep 24, 2006
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Any reason why this sentence was not in the quote of the OP?

"It’s a lie, a blood libel, a politically motivated and blatantly dishonest campaign to use Soviet-style propaganda to condemn Jews."

It's in the original Op/Ed piece.

I hate Jews that disagree with me and Israelis in general, who wantto live in peace.

I am against violence, war crimes and crimes against humanity, if someone says the Jews did it. But when the Palestinians do it, they're just upset because the Jews have invaded their country.
fify EAO.

The neo Nazi's need to deal with that.
fify too Colpy.
 

Johnny Utah

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Mar 11, 2006
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There are so many who hate others they don't even know, I find it hard to do that.
Israel is no worse and no better than any other group on the planet. yes they are
in an area of the world that is surrounded by their enemies, and the world does in
fact recognize the right of Israel to exist. Israel is also an unofficial listening post
for what is happening in the Arab World next door. I would suggest that the threat
from fundamentalist Muslims is far greater than any threat we have from Israel,
As Benjamin Netanyahu said Islamic Extremists have aliened themselves with the Extreme Left forging an alliance for their hatred of Israel which has been demonstrated here on more than one occasion..
 

Avro

Time Out
Feb 12, 2007
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A follow up article by Coren.

Slaughter of innocents

Amid Israeli Apartheid Week nonsense, a family bled to death

Last week I wrote of how proud I was of being a Zionist, and how much I admired and respected the flawed but still remarkable state of Israel. The vomit of abuse was predictable — sent to me privately but also on display in the comment section of this newspaper.
Just hours later, the militant, violent face of such race-hatred and irrational anti-Israel hysteria revealed itself when five innocent people, three of them tiny children, were slaughtered like animals as they slept in their beds.

Udi Fogel, 36, was knifed to death, as was his wife, Ruth, a year younger. The other three victims were Yoav, who was 11, Elad, who was four, and tiny Hadas, a mere three months old. One of the children who survived, just two years old, found his mother and father in pools of blood and hugged them and cried as he told them to wake up, wake up, please wake up.

This was not a bomb, not a random shot, not an accidental attack. A terrorist spent time trying to enter various homes until he found one where a family was asleep. He then plunged a knife into each person, taking what must have been quite some time as he systematically murdered them. He would have looked at the sleeping babes, heard their breaths, smelled their child-like innocence, and then stabbed them over and over again.

The coverage of the horror has been limited, partly because of the catastrophe in Japan, but also — let’s be honest — because compassion fatigue set in a long time ago when Israelis suffer. The Israeli government has made an official complaint about CNN’s jaundiced coverage of the event, but there is not much it can do about media indifference. Imagine for a moment if an Israeli had done this to Palestinians. There would have been full front pages within a day and documentaries, dramas and books already planned.
Not here, not now, not for these people. In Gaza, the allegedly starving inhabitants were given cake and candies to celebrate the event, and even in parts of the West Bank there was celebration. Many Arab leaders did, however, condemn the atrocity, but what is said in English to the greater world is often different from what is said in Arabic to their own world.

It is not the first time that children have been targeted by Palestinian terrorists. In fact, kindergartens and schools are common attack sites. Then there are discos, old people holding Seder meals, or even hospitals. It is one thing, and a terrible thing, for an Israeli shell to accidentally kill innocent people, but quite another to deliberately kill the weakest and most precious and needy.

There is a culture of life and a cult of death at war in the Middle East, and if we do not see beyond fashionable politics and the perverse sacraments of modern leftist theology we ought to be ashamed of ourselves. Palestinians deserve justice, but justice demands humanity.

By the way, this slaughter of innocents took place while publicly funded Canadian students were trying to silence and intimidate their opponents by holding Israel Apartheid Week. The irony bleeds, and so do the Fogels.
 

earth_as_one

Time Out
Jan 5, 2006
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There are so many who hate others they don't even know, I find it hard to do that.
Israel is no worse and no better than any other group on the planet. yes they are
in an area of the world that is surrounded by their enemies, and the world does in
fact recognize the right of Israel to exist. Israel is also an unofficial listening post
for what is happening in the Arab World next door. I would suggest that the threat
from fundamentalist Muslims is far greater than any threat we have from Israel,

Before Zionism, Palestine was a peaceful place where Muslims, Jews, Christians and other religions lived in peace. The area became a war zone when Zionists started cleansing Palestine of Palestinians over 60 years ago. I suggest you listen to the other side of the story for balance:

The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine by Ilan Pappe



Yep.

Anywhere there are two Jews there are three opinions.

The Jews are the most hated people on earth. One third of the world population were murdered 1941-45.......and that was merely the climax of 2000 years of extreme persecution. The Jewish population has never recovered from the loss of the Holocaust, and probably never will. There are less than 14 million Jews alive today. They need and deserve a secure homeland, as the world has proven that Jews will never be safe living in other societies.

The creation of Israel was only good sense.

Israel as a Jewish state is here to stay.

The Arab population needs to deal with that.

How very generous of you to give away someone else's property. Would you be as generous with your own home?

Concentrating the world's remaining Jews into a few cities in former Palestine in the age of nuclear weapons hardly makes these people safer.

The cruel Zionist State of Israel will eventually collapse.

M.K. Gandhi
When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love has always won. There have been tyrants and murderers and for a time they seem invincible but in the end, they always fall -- think of it, ALWAYS.
History will judge harshly those who supported Israeli war crimes and crimes against humanity.
 

CDNBear

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Sep 24, 2006
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Before Zionism, Palestine was a peaceful place where Muslims, Jews, Christians and other religions lived in peace.


A hypocrite and delusional!!!

The area became a war zone when Zionists started cleansing Palestine of Palestinians over 60 years ago. I suggest you listen to the other side of the story for balance:
You should try that some time!

How very generous of you to give away someone else's property. Would you be as generous with your own home?
Cool, so when can my family move into yours. You do live on my land after all.

The cruel Zionist State of Israel will eventually collapse.
There you go, condemning the whole of Israel again.

To bad you can't practice what you preach!

When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love has always won.
To bad you don't know what either is.

There have been tyrants and murderers and for a time they seem invincible but in the end, they always fall -- think of it, ALWAYS.
So Hamas will fall?

History will judge harshly those who supported Israeli war crimes and crimes against humanity.
Even more harshly, those that chose to ignore reality and support the ugliest blight to grace the earth, Nazism.

Like yourself.
 

taxslave

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Nov 25, 2008
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Before Zionism, Palestine was a peaceful place where Muslims, Jews, Christians and other religions lived in peace. The area became a war zone when Zionists started cleansing Palestine of Palestinians over 60 years ago. I suggest you listen to the other side of the story for balance:

The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine by Ilan Pappe





How very generous of you to give away someone else's property. Would you be as generous with your own home?

Concentrating the world's remaining Jews into a few cities in former Palestine in the age of nuclear weapons hardly makes these people safer.

The cruel Zionist State of Israel will eventually collapse.

M.K. Gandhi
History will judge harshly those who supported Israeli war crimes and crimes against humanity.

Are you sure you live in the same dimension as the rest of us? or do you have wild hallucinogenic drugs?
 

earth_as_one

Time Out
Jan 5, 2006
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Part of the myth which allows Israel to get away with war crimes and crimes against humanity is the fable that Palestine was a violent area before it was civilized by Zionists.

Please list the war and atrocities which occurred in what is today Israel and the Occupied Palestinian Territories while it was controlled by the Ottomans:

Palestine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This area was peaceful for at least four centuries until WW I. Unlike Europe, this area did not have death camps and gas chambers for exterminating Jews. With a few exceptions, the Ottomans didn't care about religion. They just wanted their taxes. In return you got protection and a flawed criminal justice system.
 

CDNBear

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Sep 24, 2006
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Part of the myth which allows Israel to get away with war crimes and crimes against humanity is the fable that Palestine was a violent area before it was civilized by Zionists.
Part of the myth you tout as fact is the resulte of ignoring a long and tumultuous history.

Please list the war and atrocities which occurred in what is today Israel and the Occupied Palestinian Territories while it was controlled by the Ottomans:
You narrowed the field to just prior to 60 some odd years ago.

Before Zionism, Palestine was a peaceful place where Muslims, Jews, Christians and other religions lived in peace. The area became a war zone when Zionists started cleansing Palestine of Palestinians over 60 years ago.
That is pure BS.
Wikiality is not an accepted, nor reliable source.
This area was peaceful for at least four centuries until WW I.
Oh, now it's WWI

Unlike Europe, this area did not have death camps and gas chambers for exterminating Jews.
Mo, just Grand Mufti's that had homicidal tendencies and a hate on for Joos, just like you.

With a few exceptions, the Ottomans didn't care about religion. They just wanted their taxes. In return you got protection and a flawed criminal justice system.
That was as hard as an anvil. That isn't peace, that is controlled tyranny.
 

Johnny Utah

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Mar 11, 2006
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Before Zionism, Palestine was a peaceful place where Muslims, Jews, Christians and other religions lived in peace. The area became a war zone when Zionists started cleansing Palestine of Palestinians over 60 years ago. I suggest you listen to the other side of the story for balance:

You've been drinking the Beav's Kool-Aid..
 

Machjo

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Oct 19, 2004
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By MICHAEL COREN

I will defend all of my beliefs, but one of the ideas I most proud of is Zionism. No apologies, no hiding, no doubts.

Fair enough.

Zionism is arguably the most successful example of the restoration of an indigenous people to their rightful homeland in human history. It is a liberation struggle, a story of the creation of a light on a hill, that light being the Jewish state in the Middle East.

'Arguably'is right. I'm in two minds on this one. On the one hand, I admire the decision in 1844 of the Ottoman Empire to allow foreign Jews to move to the Holy Land. This allowed foreign Jews to join the domestic Jews in establishing a new community there. I do not, however, admire the way Zionists then politicized the Jews' return to Palestine to their own ends, essentially displacing non-Jewish Palestinians in a planned and methodical manner, to the chagrin of even other Jews who wanted to maintain peaceful relations with their non-Jewish neighbours.

Though I disagree with the eventual establishment of the State of Israel, I also recognize that now that it's established, to dismantle it would cause more harm than good. For that reason, I defend the right of the state of Israel to exist within its borders as defined in international law, and so do not defend its occupation of territories beyond those boundaries.

I also admire Israel's success in reviving Hebrew as a national and not just a language of liturgy and having established a vibrant culture there. So yes, 'arguably' is right seeing that there are both pros and cons to it.

I write this now in particular because it is Israel Apartheid Week. Which is an attempt to bully and silence supporters of Israel and close down any civilized debate on university campuses concerning Israel and Palestine. It singles out for particular contempt one small country that, while far from perfect, has a human rights record eminently superior to that of any around it.

I do agree that the very term as applied to Israel is intent not on legitimate criticism, but rather on sparking emotional response, and so that alone legitimation 'Israeli Apartheid Week' in my mind. After all, Apartheid is an Afrikaans word, nothing to do with Israel.

It attempts to equate the Jewish state — where all citizens irrespective of religion, race, gender or sexuality enjoy equality — to the hideously immoral racist society that was apartheid South Africa. It’s

As for the attempt of the 'Week', I agree with the author. However, I take issue with the idea that all citizens are equal in Israel. Israel does have various laws that discriminate on the basis of Faith. To take a few examples:

1. The Right of Return applies to Jews only. In other words, it's easier to immigrate to Israel if you're a Jew than if you aren't. Add to that that there has also been controversy over the definition of 'Jew', whereby some have argued that only Orthodox Jewish synagogues abroad ought to be allowed to vouch for a person's 'Jewishness', risking rejection for Liberal and Conservative Jews.

2. Interfaith marriage in Israel is prohibited, meaning that people of different Faiths have to marry abroad.

3. Conversion is regulated by the state, whereby there is actually an office that keeps track of it and who has converted.

4. Non-Jewish proselytism is restricted in Israel.

Equality for all Faith groups? I think not.


So I was delighted to accept the offer to speak to four different universities during this death-dark celebration of doublespeak and anti-intellectual posing.

No comment.

A few brief comments: Kurdistan is occupied by four different Islamic nations. Morocco forcibly prevents hundreds of thousands of people who have the right to live in the country from entering. Most Arab countries reject black immigration and embrace passive, if not aggressive racism. In the Gulf States, and Pakistan in particular, slavery exists in the guise of “servants” who are treated as virtual animals.

Interesting that he never brought up our treaties with the First Nations or our separate school system. As for Kurdistan, sure I agree, at least in principle, but what does that have to do with Zionism. I thought he was talking about Israel and Zionism, not whatever other country in the world.

In Lebanon, Palestinians are denied dozens of different occupations simply because of who they are.

Ridiculous argument. Palestinians are denied occupations here in Canada too simply because of who they are. That's what immigration, passports and visas are for. By the way, they're denied the same occupations in Israel too, as are Canadians. That is the nature of a world comprised of sovereign states.

In Iran, homosexuals are publicly hanged and innocent women stoned to death. The secret police suppress freedoms in Syria and even relatively free Jordan. We have seen what Egypt and Libya are like, with other Arab countries little better and sometimes worse.

Again, what does this have to do with Isreal? Create a thread on Arab and Iranian attrocities, and I'll gladly participate. In fact, I remember such a thread already a few weeks or months ago. But the argument that 'he's worse so I'm Ok' doesn't cut it for a democratic state like Israel. It might be a fine argument for a dictatorship, but not a parliamentary democracy like Israel.

Gay Palestinians are forced to flee to Haifa and Tel Aviv to live openly and safely as homosexuals, gender apartheid exists in massive chunks of the Arab and greater Islamic world, yet Israel is supremely open and progressive. And so on and so on.

Links please. I'm not denying the possibility of the latter, but seeing how strict Israel is with regards to non-Jewish immigration, I can't imagine it being easy for homosexual Palestinians to flee to Israel without first converting to Judaism, and to likely have to be approved by an Orthodox Rabbi who's not likely to condone homosexuality. So while Israel might grant homosexuals freedom within the state, I have a hard time imagining, based on its religion-oriented immigration policy, that it would allow gay foreigners to settle there.

For a Palestinian to travel to Israel on a visit, maybe. To reside, highly doubtful.
 

earth_as_one

Time Out
Jan 5, 2006
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Careful Machjo, you are thinking critically and forming a rational independent opinion. That's potentially dangerous.
 

Machjo

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Yep.

Anywhere there are two Jews there are three opinions.

The Jews are the most hated people on earth. One third of the world population were murdered 1941-45.......and that was merely the climax of 2000 years of extreme persecution. The Jewish population has never recovered from the loss of the Holocaust, and probably never will. There are less than 14 million Jews alive today. They need and deserve a secure homeland, as the world has proven that Jews will never be safe living in other societies.

Not even Canada?

I'm all for allowing the Jews to have gone back to Israel. Now that Israel is an established fact, I'm all for defending the right of Israel to exist within its legal borders as defined in international law.

That however is no excuse for territorial expansion and the occupation of a foreign people.

Israel as a Jewish state is here to stay.

The Arab population needs to deal with that.

I certainly can agree to that (though I'd say right now it would be more accurately described as a Zionist and not Jewish state in the strictest sense of the word). However, Israelis must also acknowledge their territorial limits as defined in international law and not cross beyond those limits as they have.

Jews do not approve of such occupation, and so why should Isaelis approve of such occupation if they are Jews.
 

Avro

Time Out
Feb 12, 2007
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Links please. I'm not denying the possibility of the latter, but seeing how strict Israel is with regards to non-Jewish immigration, I can't imagine it being easy for homosexual Palestinians to flee to Israel without first converting to Judaism, and to likely have to be approved by an Orthodox Rabbi who's not likely to condone homosexuality. So while Israel might grant homosexuals freedom within the state, I have a hard time imagining, based on its religion-oriented immigration policy, that it would allow gay foreigners to settle there.

For a Palestinian to travel to Israel on a visit, maybe. To reside, highly doubtful.

Here.

Here.

Here.

Here.

Try google sometime, it's a handy new tool all the kids are using.