Hey guess what...Quebec wants to separate again
- Thread starter Locutus
- Start date
Well... there sure is lots of whining about Quebec separatists on this site don't you think?
Nope, what I "think" is all the useless separatist twats should pack up their bags and find some other plot of land to call their own. I'm tired of hearing how much they hate Canada. Don't like it here, pack your bags and go somewhere else.
Like I told my teens, don't like my house, then go find somewhere else to live.
You think expressing disagreement towards people who spend their lives blackmailing Canada into giving them more or they'll rip the country apart is "whining"? I think it's pretty natural. Having said that, I also don't think it’s a problem. Quebec leaders just want more power - to be national leaders instead of provincial leaders. Like many of their ilk they don't care who they have to hurt as long as they benefit personally. We can't do without them (generically) because hereditary and unelected leaders are even worse.
What is this current threat about? From what I have read the federal government passed a national law to control any separation. Not forbidding it, just controlling the process and ensuring that separatists can’t take Quebec out unfairly or dangerously. The Quebec government then passed a law contradicting the federal law. The Canadian constitution says that in any case where federal and provincial law contradict, federal law prevails – it’s a doctrine known as paramountcy that has been around since 1867. Quebec knows this – it is basic constitutional law taught in first year law. All that we’re seeing now is PQ politicians doing something they know is illegal, and expressing surprise and indignation when Ottawa does what it must. It’s a gong show.
As natural as it is for someone who wants to live in a country to which they can truly identify with don't you think? It's natural for Canadians to want to keep their country whole. As it's equally natural for many Québecois to feel alienated from Canada as a country. There are historical roots to this and it would be foolish to try and deny it. It's all ''natural'' because that's the way it is. What's also natural is for both sides of the debate to be littered with whiners who can't rise above an us vs. them mentality which hinders any attempt at intelligent debate on the issue.
Following the conquest, French Canadians soon understood that France wasn't coming to the rescue. They eventually stopped identifying to France but that sure didn't make them start identifying to Great Britain. The fact is that French Canadians had a forced head start when it came to developing their own ''national'' identity. While anglophones saw themselves as British subjects, francophones simply became ''Canadiens'' who happened to be ruled by the British. The impact of this historical reality is that the idea of Canada as ''notre pays'' is only half a success (because we are Canadians after all) and half a failure (because the separatist movement is persistent and deeply rooted in Québecois identity).
There's whining on both sides. When it comes to federalists (which is pretty much the crushing majority around here), I don't have much patience for those who knee jerk their hatred of separatists. In my book, they're whiners.
As for blackmailing Canada... Separatists have no interest in blackmailing Canada. They want to leave Canada and therefore have no interest in showing how being part of Canada can be a good deal for Quebec. Successfully blackmailing Canada would simply show how it's advantageous to be part of Canada.
Then stop whining about how hard done by you are. When you and your families have been put into re-education schools, your language forcibly removed from you, your culture and spirituality beaten out of you, and your land stolen..... then...maybe.... you;ll have something to whine about.... but that hasn't happened to French Canadians, so suck it up buttercup or find somewhere else to live.
If you think for any second that I compare the fate of French Canadians to First Nations, you're dead wrong. First Nations had very rough. French Canadians not really. We were fortunately numerous enough so that the British had to let us keep Catholicism and French language in order to avoid constant rebellion and most especially to avoid having them join the US Americans in their journey towards independence from the British Crown. The fact that we didn't join the Americans actually is a testament to the fact that most Canadiens felt everything was pretty much OK with the British ruling over them. So long as they could feed their families and take care of their crops...The Church had a lot to do with it of course, the clergy was overwhelmingly in favour of accepting the status quo and had a strong influence up to the 1960s.
But all this doesn't change the fact that in terms of nationalist feelings, a good part of French Canadians fail to identify to Canada. Much of it has to do with language being the backbone of culture. See that as whining if you want. I just see it as a fact of life.
And of course, I don't really need to explain in detail that when separatists say they want to leave Canada, they don't mean packing up and emigrating to another country.
You make some good arguments. All I was saying is that it's inappropriate to call us whiners. It does no more good than to attack individual Quebecois. The people who want to separate are by and large a group of urban intellectuals who want the power of being a nation. They are not interested in the good of the commoner.
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Finally a good plan to deal with Quebec. ;-)
Yet! But we are about ready to start. :lol:
Wow, a perfect message to the french-canadians and the natives!
Quote: Originally Posted by gerryh
Then stop whining about how hard done by you are. When you and your families have been put into re-education schools, your language forcibly removed from you, your culture and spirituality beaten out of you, and your land stolen..... then...maybe.... you;ll have something to whine about.... but that hasn't happened to French Canadians, so suck it up buttercup or find somewhere else to live.
Don't pay too much attention to Gerry, s-lone. He's a half-educated First Nations whiner whose specialty is name calling. I have not yet read an honest attempt by him to take a reasonable position on any issue.
As far as I'm concerned, they shouldn't have a choice in that. Don't like living in my house, then move somewhere else. No you can't co-oped your bedroom and call it a separate house.
again, showing your ignorance.... it's amazing how much stupidity you assume.
It seems clear to me that this movement is clearly not limited to urban intellectuals. How do you explain the 1995 referendum results?
Regional and Linguistic Distribution Results of the 1995 Quebec Referendum on Sovereignty - Statistical Material and Charts - Quebec History
It seems to me that this has a lot to do with whether or not French is your mother tongue. Ottawa Valley is the only place francophones voted in majority for the NO side. On average, I think it's safe to say at least 60% of francophones have a separatist bent.
That is until the natives in northern quebec say they want to stay in Canada and all of a sudden it has to ba all of the current Quebec. No one can seperate from them.
Quote: Originally Posted by gerryh
Then stop whining about how hard done by you are. When you and your families have been put into re-education schools, your language forcibly removed from you, your culture and spirituality beaten out of you, and your land stolen..... then...maybe.... you;ll have something to whine about.... but that hasn't happened to French Canadians, so suck it up buttercup or find somewhere else to live.Don't pay too much attention to Gerry, s-lone. He's a half-educated First Nations whiner whose specialty is name calling. I have not yet read an honest attempt by him to take a reasonable position on any issue.
Perhaps a "reasonable" position isn't a realistic position. Gerry calls 'em as he sees 'em! -
MONTREAL — Leaders of Quebec’s sovereignty movement are gearing up for a fight with the federal government over its decision to intervene in a provincial court case challenging a law at the heart of their cause.
The head of the Bloc Quebecois, Daniel Paille, contends the federal justice department is infringing on Quebec’s right to make its own decisions.
The province’s Parti Quebecois government, meanwhile, is planning a news conference for Sunday to lay out its own objections.
Alexandre Cloutier, the PQ’s minister of intergovernmental affairs, said Saturday on Twitter that Ottawa’s actions demanded an “exceptional response.”
more
Quebec sovereigntists prepare for battle with Ottawa over right to secede
Here's mine:
One thing for sure....................nothing is going to come of it!
Not really. Reading your posts gives me lots of opportunity to presume that you are really stupid, and nothing seems to be changing. You never make a pleasant post. Everything contains nastiness. Am I nasty sometimes? Certainly. Ought I to just ignore nastiness? Certainly. But the majority of what I receive is because posters disagree with my positions. I embarrass some people. You don't embarrass anybody. Your kind of childish name calling is irritating, not embarrassing. Presuming that you are stupid is no effort at all.