Alberta GTFO?

spaminator

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Alberta judge upholds review of proposed separatist referendum question
"It is not plain and obvious that the constitutional referendum proposal is constitutional"

Author of the article:Matthew Black
Published Aug 14, 2025 • Last updated 12 hours ago • 4 minute read

Mitch Sylvestre, CEO of Alberta Prosperity Project displays an image taken during the Holocaust while drawing comparisons between the current economic situation in Alberta and Nazi Germany. Sylvestre spoke at an event hosted by the Alberta Prosperity Project on Tuesday, March 18, 2025, in Strathcona County.
Mitch Sylvestre, CEO of Alberta Prosperity Project displays an image taken during the Holocaust while drawing comparisons between the current economic situation in Alberta and Nazi Germany. Sylvestre spoke at an event hosted by the Alberta Prosperity Project on Tuesday, March 18, 2025, in Strathcona County.
A court will determine the constitutionality of the separatist Alberta Prosperity Project’s (APP) proposed referendum question despite the group’s effort to have that review struck, a judge ruled Thursday.


The APP and its leader Mitch Sylvestre is seeking to ask in a referendum, “Do you agree that the province of Alberta shall become a sovereign country and cease to be a province in Canada?”


Last month, Alberta chief electoral officer Gordon McClure referred the group’s proposed question to the courts for their opinion on if it violates the Constitution.

Last week, APP lawyers argued that referral should be struck, saying it was premature, an abuse of process, and an affront to democracy

On Thursday, Court of King’s Bench Justice Colin Feasby told a Downtown Edmonton courtroom that he was rejecting those arguments, stating the referral “is none of those things.”

“The process under the Citizen Initiative Act fosters the conditions for the clear expression of the will of the population of the province by dispeling the cloud of unconstitutionality that might otherwise hang over a referendum unknown,” he said.


“The referral to the court may result in delay, but it reinforces the legitimacy of the referendum process by ensuring that unconstitutional questions are not put to a vote.”

He added a full hearing was required to determine the constitutionality of the APP’s question, which he described as being not plain and obvious.

“The citizens of Alberta deserve to have these arguments made properly and heard in full; democracy demands nothing less,” he said, noting a potential separation referendum was “serious business.”

“There are legitimate arguments to be made on both sides of the issue before the court.”

Feasby said he would attempt to expedite future hearings on the constitutionality of APP’s proposed question, with preliminary legal filings for individuals or groups seeking to act as interveners to be due next month.


“Interveners will be chosen that represent a broad spectrum of perspectives on the issues before the court,” Feasby’s ruling reads, noting the court was not inviting “every adult citizen in Alberta to intervene.”

Alberta Justice Minister Mickey Amery’s office has previously indicated it plans to make submissions to the court, as have other groups, including the Athabasca Chipewyan First Nation.

“We are Canadians, and we’ve been Canadians ever since our ancestors signed treaty in 1899,” Athabasca Chipewyan Chief Allan Adam told reporters after the ruling.

“We honour that commitment that was signed back in 1899 and this prosperity project that’s coming forward to separate Alberta to become an independent state, is step one to becoming the 51st state of America.”


‘Confederation is doing little for Alberta’
Sylvestre’s lawyer, Jeffrey Rath, said after the hearing that the ruling came as no surprise and that the APP would continue fighting.

“We’re happy to be engaged in the process, and we see this as a real opportunity to continue to talk about the benefits of independence to our fellow Albertans,” he said.

“Confederation is doing little for Alberta, and we’re looking forward to getting this process forward and having Albertans finally have their say on whether or not Alberta should remain part of Canada.”

Premier Danielle Smith and Amery both also publicly opposed McClure’s referral.

Government of Alberta lawyers were in court but took no position on Rath’s application to strike the referral.


Lawyers for Elections Alberta also did not make arguments on the issue of question’s constitutionality.

A spokesperson for Amery’s office said the provincial government supported a sovereign Alberta within a united Canada and reiterated its prior belief the APP’s petition should go ahead.

“Alberta’s government believes that the proposal is not unconstitutional and therefore should be approved and permitted to proceed,” it reads.

“It is settled law that any province is entitled to consult its population by referendum on any issue.”

Opposition justice critic Irfan Sabir accused the provincial government of fuelling separatist sentiment.

“This UCP government has encouraged a separatist referendum that would devastate our province’s economy, hurt investment and make life more expensive,” he said, adding Smith and Amery had “inappropriately interfered” in McClure’s work.


“The premier and this UCP government need to stop pandering to these extremist groups, especially those led by her own party members, who want to destroy our country, and let the Chief Electoral Officer and courts do their job without any political interference.”

Rival petition continues
On July 30, McClure approved a rival petition fronted by former Progressive Conservative deputy premier Thomas Lukaszuk, who is gathering signatures to support his own potential referendum question that asks, “Do you agree that Alberta should remain in Canada?”

Lukaszuk’s petition must meet the much higher bar as set by legislation that was later superseded by current rules that set out reduced thresholds.

“Today was a win, not only for democracy, but for Elections Alberta and its independence and for our First Nations, without a doubt,” he said outside of court after the ruling.


His campaign, which also intends to seek intervenor status, must secure 293,976 signatures within 90 days (Oct. 28), whereas the Sylvestre petition follows the new rules, which would require approximately 177,000 signatures within 120 days.

Provincial legislation requires any referendum question to not violate the Constitution and also bars multiple questions on the same subject.

mblack@postmedia.com
 

Serryah

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Maybe a bit of warning to the West.

Or maybe this is just what the West wants and should just bend over for it, eh?


"Just as it seemed the 51st state talk from south of the border had cooled off, Courtenay-Comox MLA Brennan Day says he received a letter from a Maine State Senator suggesting Western provinces join the U.S.


“Honestly, I couldn’t believe it’s legitimate, but we reached out to his office. It is a legitimate memo,” said MLA Day in an interview with 1130 NewsRadio.

“I’m not entirely sure why it was sent or who it was sent to, but I assume other elected officials across the country got it as well.”


Day says that the letter, penned by Republican Senator Joseph E. Martin from Maine, is concerning as it oversteps his position as a state-level senator.


“He is a state-level senator, so he has way overstepped his boundaries here, speaking for the country. And I certainly know most Americans I know don’t share his feelings,” explained Day.


Day said that the letter “reads like a recruitment brochure for a political ideology, not a sincere offer to neighbours.”"


The "letter" in question

1755259059533.jpeg

1755259078103.jpeg


And Day's reply.




If you are Canadian and this arrogance and bullshit doesn't piss you off then I'd question your status as a Canadian.
 

Dixie Cup

Senate Member
Sep 16, 2006
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Edmonton
Alberta judge upholds review of proposed separatist referendum question
"It is not plain and obvious that the constitutional referendum proposal is constitutional"

Author of the article:Matthew Black
Published Aug 14, 2025 • Last updated 12 hours ago • 4 minute read

Mitch Sylvestre, CEO of Alberta Prosperity Project displays an image taken during the Holocaust while drawing comparisons between the current economic situation in Alberta and Nazi Germany. Sylvestre spoke at an event hosted by the Alberta Prosperity Project on Tuesday, March 18, 2025, in Strathcona County.
Mitch Sylvestre, CEO of Alberta Prosperity Project displays an image taken during the Holocaust while drawing comparisons between the current economic situation in Alberta and Nazi Germany. Sylvestre spoke at an event hosted by the Alberta Prosperity Project on Tuesday, March 18, 2025, in Strathcona County.
A court will determine the constitutionality of the separatist Alberta Prosperity Project’s (APP) proposed referendum question despite the group’s effort to have that review struck, a judge ruled Thursday.


The APP and its leader Mitch Sylvestre is seeking to ask in a referendum, “Do you agree that the province of Alberta shall become a sovereign country and cease to be a province in Canada?”


Last month, Alberta chief electoral officer Gordon McClure referred the group’s proposed question to the courts for their opinion on if it violates the Constitution.

Last week, APP lawyers argued that referral should be struck, saying it was premature, an abuse of process, and an affront to democracy

On Thursday, Court of King’s Bench Justice Colin Feasby told a Downtown Edmonton courtroom that he was rejecting those arguments, stating the referral “is none of those things.”

“The process under the Citizen Initiative Act fosters the conditions for the clear expression of the will of the population of the province by dispeling the cloud of unconstitutionality that might otherwise hang over a referendum unknown,” he said.


“The referral to the court may result in delay, but it reinforces the legitimacy of the referendum process by ensuring that unconstitutional questions are not put to a vote.”

He added a full hearing was required to determine the constitutionality of the APP’s question, which he described as being not plain and obvious.

“The citizens of Alberta deserve to have these arguments made properly and heard in full; democracy demands nothing less,” he said, noting a potential separation referendum was “serious business.”

“There are legitimate arguments to be made on both sides of the issue before the court.”

Feasby said he would attempt to expedite future hearings on the constitutionality of APP’s proposed question, with preliminary legal filings for individuals or groups seeking to act as interveners to be due next month.


“Interveners will be chosen that represent a broad spectrum of perspectives on the issues before the court,” Feasby’s ruling reads, noting the court was not inviting “every adult citizen in Alberta to intervene.”

Alberta Justice Minister Mickey Amery’s office has previously indicated it plans to make submissions to the court, as have other groups, including the Athabasca Chipewyan First Nation.

“We are Canadians, and we’ve been Canadians ever since our ancestors signed treaty in 1899,” Athabasca Chipewyan Chief Allan Adam told reporters after the ruling.

“We honour that commitment that was signed back in 1899 and this prosperity project that’s coming forward to separate Alberta to become an independent state, is step one to becoming the 51st state of America.”


‘Confederation is doing little for Alberta’
Sylvestre’s lawyer, Jeffrey Rath, said after the hearing that the ruling came as no surprise and that the APP would continue fighting.

“We’re happy to be engaged in the process, and we see this as a real opportunity to continue to talk about the benefits of independence to our fellow Albertans,” he said.

“Confederation is doing little for Alberta, and we’re looking forward to getting this process forward and having Albertans finally have their say on whether or not Alberta should remain part of Canada.”

Premier Danielle Smith and Amery both also publicly opposed McClure’s referral.

Government of Alberta lawyers were in court but took no position on Rath’s application to strike the referral.


Lawyers for Elections Alberta also did not make arguments on the issue of question’s constitutionality.

A spokesperson for Amery’s office said the provincial government supported a sovereign Alberta within a united Canada and reiterated its prior belief the APP’s petition should go ahead.

“Alberta’s government believes that the proposal is not unconstitutional and therefore should be approved and permitted to proceed,” it reads.

“It is settled law that any province is entitled to consult its population by referendum on any issue.”

Opposition justice critic Irfan Sabir accused the provincial government of fuelling separatist sentiment.

“This UCP government has encouraged a separatist referendum that would devastate our province’s economy, hurt investment and make life more expensive,” he said, adding Smith and Amery had “inappropriately interfered” in McClure’s work.


“The premier and this UCP government need to stop pandering to these extremist groups, especially those led by her own party members, who want to destroy our country, and let the Chief Electoral Officer and courts do their job without any political interference.”

Rival petition continues
On July 30, McClure approved a rival petition fronted by former Progressive Conservative deputy premier Thomas Lukaszuk, who is gathering signatures to support his own potential referendum question that asks, “Do you agree that Alberta should remain in Canada?”

Lukaszuk’s petition must meet the much higher bar as set by legislation that was later superseded by current rules that set out reduced thresholds.

“Today was a win, not only for democracy, but for Elections Alberta and its independence and for our First Nations, without a doubt,” he said outside of court after the ruling.
.

His campaign, which also intends to seek intervenor status, must secure 293,976 signatures within 90 days (Oct. 28), whereas the Sylvestre petition follows the new rules, which would require approximately 177,000 signatures within 120 days.

Provincial legislation requires any referendum question to not violate the Constitution and also bars multiple questions on the same subject.

mblack@postmedia.com
I was at a town hall last night about this very issue & the misinformation is staggering. It seems those who don't "approve" of a referendum have decided to spew falsehoods with the hope of not having a referendum at all. Apparently, they feel we're too stupid to make our own decisions & would prefer that THEY make decisions for us. The NDP (I'm assuming) were in full force last night & it was embarrassing to hear them spew their garbage with hateful rhetoric loud screaming & vile language. They were repeatedly asked to "calm down" say what they came to say in a more dignified way & to stop swearing but they refused to shut the F up! Finally, there were a couple or so that were forcefully removed so that the rest of us could hear what the panel had to say AND others who attended had to say what their concerns were. I attended to get more information & also to find out what others thought. It's truly disturbing that one can't have an actual conversation or debate on these things. Why is that?
 

pgs

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 29, 2008
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I was at a town hall last night about this very issue & the misinformation is staggering. It seems those who don't "approve" of a referendum have decided to spew falsehoods with the hope of not having a referendum at all. Apparently, they feel we're too stupid to make our own decisions & would prefer that THEY make decisions for us. The NDP (I'm assuming) were in full force last night & it was embarrassing to hear them spew their garbage with hateful rhetoric loud screaming & vile language. They were repeatedly asked to "calm down" say what they came to say in a more dignified way & to stop swearing but they refused to shut the F up! Finally, there were a couple or so that were forcefully removed so that the rest of us could hear what the panel had to say AND others who attended had to say what their concerns were. I attended to get more information & also to find out what others thought. It's truly disturbing that one can't have an actual conversation or debate on these things. Why is that?
My way or the highway .
 

Ron in Regina

"Voice of the West" Party
Apr 9, 2008
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Regina, Saskatchewan
I was at a town hall last night about this very issue & the misinformation is staggering. It seems those who don't "approve" of a referendum have decided to spew falsehoods with the hope of not having a referendum at all. Apparently, they feel we're too stupid to make our own decisions & would prefer that THEY make decisions for us. The NDP (I'm assuming) were in full force last night & it was embarrassing to hear them spew their garbage with hateful rhetoric loud screaming & vile language. They were repeatedly asked to "calm down" say what they came to say in a more dignified way & to stop swearing but they refused to shut the F up! Finally, there were a couple or so that were forcefully removed so that the rest of us could hear what the panel had to say AND others who attended had to say what their concerns were. I attended to get more information & also to find out what others thought. It's truly disturbing that one can't have an actual conversation or debate on these things. Why is that?
Were you at this?
 

Dixie Cup

Senate Member
Sep 16, 2006
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Were you at this?
I was struck by how vulgar & uncivil the people who opposed the Townhall were. At the beginning of the session, it was emphasized that this was the opportunity to DISCUSS & DEBATE CIVILY the issues that were going to be discussed. Most of us who were there were agreeable but those who for whatever reason were against everything being discussed were rude, vulgar & loud and actually didn't have anything of consequence to say. In other words, they had absolutely no argument that made any sense whatsoever. Maybe if they were civil, they had good points but we'll never know. Yelling isn't a great way to make your point.

They were calling names to everyone who didn't agree with them, telling them to F off!! - needless to say, I was appalled at the interaction. You can't reason with these people and their arguments don't make sense. Some made valid points but were lost in the screaming & yelling. I don't know how they expect anyone to answer whatever their issues were because you simply can't get them to calm down enough to actually have a decent conversation.

Fortunately, most people there were calm, & had excellent questions. Most of us were there to get information, challenge some issues so that the panel could put forth their ideas. I agreed with most, I admit but I'm on the fence for at least 2 other issues that were discussed.

Premier Smith is probably the ONLY Premier that is willing to put herself out there, to LISTEN (which those who were yelling weren't doing) and admitted when someone brought up something the UCP were doing, said she'd look into. Her administration is the most transparent of all Premiers and I respect her for that, even tho' I don't agree with some of the things they're contemplating. But isn't that what democracy is all about? It's not about screaming at one another. I suspect most of the ones there were NDP'ers which is fine. They have their POV's that should be listened to but when they're screaming at you, using vulgar language, why would you want to even listen to what they're saying? Why can't we have a civil discourse anymore? What's happened to us?

Again, I was appalled at these people. They were given a chance to ask questions & instead stood there & simply screamed that everyone on the panel were liars; that Smith was encouraging Albertans to vote separation (which is totally a lie - she's NEVER said that) and called her names. I admire Smith in that she took in all in stride. The whole situation was rather distressing but also, in a weird way, funny because they were so emotional, they really didn't make much sense. A few of us had a chuckle because they were being so silly/immature/intolerant/stupid et al.

Anyway, that's my take on the Town hall. It was eye opening if nothing else. Civil discourse has gone by the wayside it seems. And I thought it was just in the U.S. - wrong!!!!
 

Taxslave2

Senate Member
Aug 13, 2022
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Maybe a bit of warning to the West.

Or maybe this is just what the West wants and should just bend over for it, eh?


"Just as it seemed the 51st state talk from south of the border had cooled off, Courtenay-Comox MLA Brennan Day says he received a letter from a Maine State Senator suggesting Western provinces join the U.S.


“Honestly, I couldn’t believe it’s legitimate, but we reached out to his office. It is a legitimate memo,” said MLA Day in an interview with 1130 NewsRadio.

“I’m not entirely sure why it was sent or who it was sent to, but I assume other elected officials across the country got it as well.”


Day says that the letter, penned by Republican Senator Joseph E. Martin from Maine, is concerning as it oversteps his position as a state-level senator.


“He is a state-level senator, so he has way overstepped his boundaries here, speaking for the country. And I certainly know most Americans I know don’t share his feelings,” explained Day.


Day said that the letter “reads like a recruitment brochure for a political ideology, not a sincere offer to neighbours.”"


The "letter" in question

View attachment 30597

View attachment 30598


And Day's reply.




If you are Canadian and this arrogance and bullshit doesn't piss you off then I'd question your status as a Canadian.
If you were a real Canadian, you would see the possibilities in this. No more sending Billions of dollars to the welfare provinces every year. No more having French rammed down our throats. No more tanker ban off our coast. No more supply management forcing our farmers to dump milk on the ground. Probably no more softwood lumber duties. The potential for making deals with our federal government are endless.
 
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Serryah

Hall of Fame Member
Dec 3, 2008
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If you were a real Canadian,

More real than you, Taxy.

you would see the possibilities in this.

I thought the consensus was "Alberta isn't leaving"? Now it is?

No more sending Billions of dollars to the welfare provinces every year.

Does that include Alberta?

No more having French rammed down our throats.

LOL - French isn't "rammed down your throat" Tax. That only happens in Quebec.

No more tanker ban off our coast.

Alberta has no coast.

BC on the other hand does, and a lot of it is ecologically sensitive.

I know you don't give a shit but there are people who make a living off those coasts who'd like to continue such.

No more supply management forcing our farmers to dump milk on the ground.

I DO agree that Canada needs to stop this practice, yes. The easiest way would be reduction in the amount of milking cows which reduces the production and thus there's less milk out there so what's produced is all used.

Or whatever other ideas can be made of it.

BTW, US dairy ALSO dumps milk, due to demand (which is like why they do so in Canada) so I guess... you don't resolve the issue after all.

Probably no more softwood lumber duties.

Sure; because if BC and Alberta went to the US with their softwood lumber now being part of the country, your woods would be stripped in no time. I guess money DOES grow on(from) trees!

The potential for making deals with our federal government are endless.

You know if certain provinces didn't vote against their best interests, they wouldn't have issues "making deals".

As it is, it's only Alberta and Saskatchewan - or rather, certain select idiots of their population - that are Maple MAGA enough to hate Canada and want to be American. And if you-they want that, just leave already, stop bitching and go.
 

Tecumsehsbones

Hall of Fame Member
Mar 18, 2013
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If you were a real Canadian, you would see the possibilities in this. No more sending Billions of dollars to the welfare provinces every year. No more having French rammed down our throats. No more tanker ban off our coast. No more supply management forcing our farmers to dump milk on the ground. Probably no more softwood lumber duties. The potential for making deals with our federal government are endless.
I'd suggest that the basic "real Canadian" qualification would be "If you're a real Canadian, you don't want to secede from Canada."
 

Taxslave2

Senate Member
Aug 13, 2022
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I'd suggest that the basic "real Canadian" qualification would be "If you're a real Canadian, you don't want to secede from Canada."
And if you are being forced out, or being forced to limit your potential because certain more populated provinces make rules that are deliberately made to limit your economic activity? It's a two-way street. Would you stay in a marriage where you are clearly not wanted?
 

Tecumsehsbones

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And if you are being forced out, or being forced to limit your potential because certain more populated provinces make rules that are deliberately made to limit your economic activity? It's a two-way street. Would you stay in a marriage where you are clearly not wanted?
So. . . your lack of loyalty to your country is all their fault? You sound like one of them "the Sahth we-ull rahz agin!" morons.
 

IdRatherBeSkiing

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May 28, 2007
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And if you are being forced out, or being forced to limit your potential because certain more populated provinces make rules that are deliberately made to limit your economic activity? It's a two-way street. Would you stay in a marriage where you are clearly not wanted?
That is fine, you are allowed to be frustrated and want out. You just can't call yourself a good or loyal Canadian or even Canadian. From a Canadian perspective, you become a treasonous traitor. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
 
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Tecumsehsbones

Hall of Fame Member
Mar 18, 2013
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That is fine, you are allowed to be frustrated and want out. You just can't call yourself a good or loyal Canadian or even Canadian. From a Canadian perspective, you become a treasonous traitor. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
Sure you can. Just declare Westernesse the REAL Canada, demand that the capital be Moose Balls, Saskabertatoba, and whine like a basset hound with PMS that that everything east of Winnipeg is obligated to find a new name and flag.
 

Taxslave2

Senate Member
Aug 13, 2022
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That is fine, you are allowed to be frustrated and want out. You just can't call yourself a good or loyal Canadian or even Canadian. From a Canadian perspective, you become a treasonous traitor. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
If we take our cake, there won't be a Canada.
At different times there has been talk of a new WEST called Cascadia. That would be the western provinces and western states, except California. Seems no one wants them. Haven't heard much about this in the last few years. Could have something to do with Washington and Oregon trying to out left California.
 
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Ron in Regina

"Voice of the West" Party
Apr 9, 2008
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Regina, Saskatchewan
Sure you can. Just declare Westernesse the REAL Canada, demand that the capital be Moose Balls, Saskabertatoba, and whine like a basset hound with PMS that that everything east of Winnipeg is obligated to find a new name and flag.
Ok, I don’t necessarily agree with what you’re saying, but that’s just freaking hilarious!!😁