Israel...

[earth_as_one]

I've stated that Palestinian rockets attacks are war crimes, despite their limited effectiveness.

I still don't see any statement from you that its unjust to demolish people's homes.

Perhaps you can comment about the point that Palestinian house demolition combined with Jewish only settlement expansion makes this war about ethnic cleansing.

March 9, 2008 by Agence France Presse
Israel Okays Expansion of West Bank Settlement


JERUSALEM - Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert has approved the construction of hundreds of new housing units at a Jewish settlement in the occupied West Bank, the housing ministry said on Sunday.



“After a series of consultations with the prime minister, Housing Minister Zeev Boim has approved the relaunching of construction in Givat Zeev,” the ministry said in a statement.The move was swiftly denounced as hampering efforts to advance faltering peace talks that Israelis and Palestinians revived to much fanfare under US stewardship in late November, but that have been stagnant since.
“We condemn in the harshest terms this decision,” senior Palestinian negotiator Saeb Erakat told AFP.
“We consider that with this decision, Israel wants to demolish the peace process and demolish the international efforts to advance the peace process,” he said.
“We ask the American administration to… pressure Israel to reverse this decision.”
The head of Israel’s main anti-settlement group Peace Now, Yariv Oppenheimer, echoed the sentiment.
“This is a scandalous decision that will affect the negotiations with the Palestinians,” he told AFP. “This government, which has pledged to dismantle settlements, has done nothing but reinforce them.”

http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/03/09/7573/

Combined with indiscriminate killing of unarmed civilian with impunity:

Israeli soldiers tell of indiscriminate killings by army and a culture of impunity

Whistleblowers' testimony shows desire for revenge on Palestinians

Conal Urquhart in Tel Aviv The Guardian, Tuesday September 6, 2005 Article history

From a distance of 70 metres and through the sight of his machine gun, Assaf could tell that the Palestinian man was aged between 20 and 30, unarmed and trying to get away from an Israeli tank. But the details didn't matter much, because Assaf's orders were to "fire at anything that moved".

Assaf, a soldier in the Israeli army, pressed the trigger, firing scores of bullets as the body fell to the ground. "He ran and I started shooting for a few seconds. He fell. I was a machine. I fire. I leave and that's that. We never spoke about it afterwards."

It was the summer of 2002, and Assaf and his armoured unit had been ordered to enter the Gaza town of Dir al Balah following the firing of mortars into nearby Jewish settlements. His orders were, he told the Guardian, "'Every person you see on the street, kill him'. And we would just do it."

It was not the first time that Assaf had killed an innocent person in Gaza while following orders, but after his discharge he began to think about the things he did.

"The reason why I am telling you this is that I want the army to think about what they are asking us to do, shooting unarmed people. I don't think it's legal."

Assaf is not alone. In recent months dozens of soldiers, including the son of an an Israeli general, all recently discharged, have come forward to share their stories of how they were ordered in briefings to shoot to kill unarmed people without fear of reprimand....

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2005/sep/06/israel

Does this sound just?

Israeli Officer:
I was Right to Shoot 13-Year-Old Child

Radio exchange contradicts army version of Gaza killing

CHRIS McGREAL / The Guardian (UK) 24nov04

[more below]​

Jerusalem — An Israeli army officer who repeatedly shot a 13-year-old Palestinian girl in Gaza dismissed a warning from another soldier that she was a child by saying he would have killed her even if she was three years old. The officer, identified by the army only as Captain R, was charged this week with illegal use of his weapon, conduct unbecoming an officer and other relatively minor infractions after emptying all 10 bullets from his gun's magazine into Imam al-Hamas when she walked into a "security area" on the edge of Rafah refugee camp last month.

Record of a shooting
Watchtower:
'It's a little girl. She's running defensively eastward'
Operations room:
'Are we talking about a girl under the age of 10?'
Watchtower:
'A girl of about 10, she's behind the embankment, scared to death'
Captain R (after killing the girl):
'Anything moving in the zone, even a three-year-old, needs to be killed'


A tape recording of radio exchanges between soldiers involved in the incident, played on Israeli television, contradicts the army's account of the events and appears to show that the captain shot the girl in cold blood....

more here:
http://www.mindfully.org/Reform/2004/Imam-al-Hamas24nov04.htm

 

[lone wolf]

Evacuate ... or knock it down because it's abandoned? Which do you want to stand behind? Does this mean there had better be someone sitting in Israeli cars at all times because if it's vacant it's up for grabs?

 

[Just the Facts]

Evacuate ... or knock it down because it's abandoned? Which do you want to stand behind? Does this mean there had better be someone sitting in Israeli cars at all times because if it's vacant it's up for grabs?

Oh yeah, you're the guy who walks away with Johnny-On-The-Spots. :lol:

 

[lone wolf]

Oh yeah, you're the guy who walks away with Johnny-On-The-Spots. :lol:

I suppose I better give one back. Sounds like you may be in desperate need....:lol:

J/K

Woof!

 

[earth_as_one]

Is the above just?

How about this, would you rather live as a nationless Muslim living in Israel and the occupied territories or an Iranian Jew?

Iran's Jews reject cash offer to move to Israel· Expats offer families £30,000 to emigrate

· Our identity is not for sale, say community leaders

Robert Tait in Tehran guardian.co.uk, Thursday July 12, 2007
Article history

The following correction was printed in the Guardian's Corrections and clarifications column, Saturday July 28 2007

In the article below we reported that last year President Ahmadinejad said (quoting the late Ayatollah Khomeini) that Israel should be "wiped off the map". A more literal translation of the statement he made in 2005, at The World without Zionism conference in Tehran, is "the regime occupying Jerusalem must vanish from the page of time".


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Iran's Jews have given the country a loyalty pledge in the face of cash offers aimed at encouraging them to move to Israel, the arch-enemy of its Islamic rulers.


The incentives — ranging from £5,000 a person to £30,000 for families — were offered from a special fund established by wealthy expatriate Jews in an effort to prompt a mass migration to Israel from among Iran's 25,000-strong Jewish community. The offers were made with Israel's official blessing and were additional to the usual state packages it provides to Jews emigrating from the diaspora.


However, the Society of Iranian Jews dismissed them as "immature political enticements" and said their national identity was not for sale.


"The identity of Iranian Jews is not tradeable for any amount of money," the society said in a statement. "Iranian Jews are among the most ancient Iranians. Iran's Jews love their Iranian identity and their culture, so threats and this immature political enticement will not achieve their aim of wiping out the identity of Iranian Jews."


The Israeli newspaper Ma'ariv reported that the incentives had been doubled after earlier offers of £2,500 a head failed to attract any Iranian Jews to leave for Israel.


Iran's sole Jewish MP, Morris Motamed, said the offers were insulting and put the country's Jews under pressure to prove their loyalty.


"It suggests the Iranian Jew can be encouraged to emigrate by money," he said. "Iran's Jews have always been free to emigrate and three-quarters of them did so after the revolution but 70% of those went to America, not Israel."


Iran's Jewish population has dwindled from around 80,000 at the time of the 1979 Islamic revolution but remains the largest of any country in the Middle East apart from Israel. Jews have lived in Iran since at least 700BC.


Hostility between Iran's Islamic government and Israel means Iranian Jews are often subject to official mistrust and scrutiny. In 2000 10 Jews in the southern city of Shiraz were jailed for spying for Israel, which Iran refuses to recognise.


A Jewish businessman, Ruhollah Kadkhodah-Zadeh, was hanged in 1998, apparently for allegedly helping Jews to emigrate.


Jews generally avoid political controversy, but Mr Motamed wrote a letter of protest to Iran's president, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, last year after he called the Holocaust "a myth". Mr Ahmadinejad had earlier said that Israel should be "wiped off the map".


Jews are free to practise their religion and have their own schools, although they are forced to open on Saturdays, the Jewish sabbath.

Despite the absence of diplomatic ties with Israel, Iranian Jews frequently go there to visit relatives.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2007/jul/12/israel.iran

Sounds to me like they have more reasons to stay than to leave.

 

[Just the Facts]

I've stated that Palestinian rockets attacks are war crimes, despite their limited effectiveness.

I still don't see any statement from you that its unjust to demolish people's homes.

Demolishing a person's home for no reason would be unjust, yes. Demolishing of homes that don't meet code or were built without permits happens even here in our fair land.

Demolishing homes of suicide bombers may not be just, but is a reaction of desperation by a people who want to stop being killed.

Injustice does not come in a bottle. It floats around all over the place. You have to consider everything. You can't give lip service to the injustice against people being blown up by kassams, then shrug it off and pretend that Israel demolishes Palestinian homes just for sport.

Perhaps it would be just to fire crude rockets back at the Palestinians in response to Kassam attacks. It wouldn't be a big deal, due to their limited effectiveness, right? Think of all the homes that would be saved. What's a few dead and maimed to save hundreds of homes.

 

[Just the Facts]

I suppose I better give one back. Sounds like you may be in desperate need....:lol:

J/K

Woof!

Unlike so many others who relieve themselves all over these forums!! :lol:

 

[Just the Facts]

Sounds to me like they have more reasons to stay than to leave.

Did you actually read the article?

"Iran's Jews have always been free to emigrate and three-quarters of them did so after the revolution but 70% of those went to America, not Israel."

A Jewish businessman, Ruhollah Kadkhodah-Zadeh, was hanged in 1998, apparently for allegedly helping Jews to emigrate.

Looks like their "reason to stay" is so their friends and family don't get hung.
No, I don't think Morris Motamed is playing the good Dhimmi with his comments. Not at all.

 

[earth_as_one]

Demolishing a person's home for no reason would be unjust, yes. Demolishing of homes that don't meet code or were built without permits happens even here in our fair land.

Demolishing homes of suicide bombers may not be just, but is a reaction of desperation by a people who want to stop being killed.

Injustice does not come in a bottle. It floats around all over the place. You have to consider everything. You can't give lip service to the injustice against people being blown up by kassams, then shrug it off and pretend that Israel demolishes Palestinian homes just for sport.

Perhaps it would be just to fire crude rockets back at the Palestinians in response to Kassam attacks. It wouldn't be a big deal, due to their limited effectiveness, right? Think of all the homes that would be saved. What's a few dead and maimed to save hundreds of homes.

You believe that demolishing homes for no reason would be unjust. Doesn't sound like you believe that happens. Sounds to me like you believe Palestinian war crimes justify Israel's actions. Are Israel's actions war crimes?

Sounds to me like you believe that Israel demolishes Palestinian homes in response to Palestinian rocket attacks. Israel has been demolishing Palestinian homes since its creation in 1948. The terrorists which later became the IDF started even earlier. When did Palestinians begin firing rockets at Israel?

 

[Just the Facts]

When did Palestinians begin firing rockets at Israel?

Ummm....1948.

 

[earth_as_one]

Did you actually read the article?

"Iran's Jews have always been free to emigrate and three-quarters of them did so after the revolution but 70% of those went to America, not Israel."

A Jewish businessman, Ruhollah Kadkhodah-Zadeh, was hanged in 1998, apparently for allegedly helping Jews to emigrate.

Looks like their "reason to stay" is so their friends and family don't get hung.
No, I don't think Morris Motamed is playing the good Dhimmi with his comments. Not at all.

We both agree that Iranian Jews do not have justice. The person you reference was apparently hanged without due process. Persian Jews face official and unofficial discrimination. Iran is a severe country. Belonging to any religious minority in Iran would be unpleasant.

But you never answered my hypothetical question. Would you rather be a nationless Palestinian living in Israel and the Occupied Territories or an Iranian Jew?

 

[earth_as_one]

Ummm....1948.

Link please! I'm talking about Palestinian militant groups, not foreign armies.

When did Hamas, Islamic Jihad and the other Palestinian militant groups begin firing rockets at Israel?

 

[dancing-loon]

Hallo, Earth-As-One;
I'm not sure, if you already presented the following article to the Israel defenders. If you did, I apologize. Anyway, I'm quoting part of it.

Yossi Wolfson, Economic Warfare in Gaza NO MORE LIES or twisted tongues. Israel is saying at last what, in the past, it always refused to acknowledge: its war is against the Palestinian population. Until now, in discussions about the separation wall, closures, blockades, house demolition, and other sorts of collective punishment, the State Attorney’s Office lacked the gumption to admit in court that the aim of such measures is to harm civilians. It always came up with convoluted security claims in order to present some vital military necessity for the sake of the War against Terror. Harm to the population was described as a regrettable side effect.
But now a Rubicon has been crossed. This happened after ten human-rights organizations petitioned the High Court on October 28, 2007 against cuts in the supply of electricity and gasoline to Gaza. The petitioners claimed that the cuts amount to collective punishment, which is forbidden under international law. The State might have answered that the cuts are a necessary military measure aimed at stopping the production of Qassam rockets. Or it might have tried some other tongue twister. But no. In their response to the petition, Dana Briskman and Gilad Shirman from the State Attorney’s Office announced openly, without blinking an eye, that the cuts’ main purpose is to exert pressure on the economy as a way of influencing Hamas.
Thus the State clamps the arteries of life for 1.5 million Gazans and describes its action as an economic war. Here it infringes a basic principle of the international laws concerning warfare, which distinguish between the civilian population and the armed forces.

Read the full article here:

http://peoplesgeography.com/2008/01/21/yossi-wolfson-on-gaza/
------------------------------------------------------------------------
It has been known for some time, at least I have heard or read it, Israel wants all of Palestine!
They already have most of it anyway. Look at these maps!

http://www.ifamericansknew.org/history/maps.html

 

[Zzarchov]

1.) My bad, JTF not ITN, I meant JTF if it helps.

2.) I also agree its wrong to demolish homes.

I might actually just set up an automated system that automatically fires rockets into Gaza if rockets come out (its automated so as long as rockets don't go one way they don't go the other), and just let them know a week in advance (let everyone know via dropped flyers if needed) when it goes operational.

Beyond that I would just remove all Israeli supplied power and electricity to Gaza, seal all Israeli border crossings (with plenty of mines) and tell them "Egypt is that way if you want to contact the outside world because you aren't dealing with us"

West Bank has some options to be a viable state, or part of Israel (with full citizenship to those in it, much as happened to West Bank when Jordan annexed it)


But alot of my views deal with not wanting to use kid gloves on Palestinians. They are not a race of subhumans, they are people like everyone else.

And they know like everyone else they have made serious mistakes in their actions if this is not the situation they want to live in.

with non-violent resistance they were offered their own state and half of Jerusalem (which shouldn't be ever be part of Palestine, either ownership through conquest is ok and its Israeli or ownership through conquest is not ok and it should be international)

Palestinians have not suffered more than everyone else on this planet, they have suffered far less than alot of people who have peace settlements that are far less than the palestinians have been offered.

Yes, the Palestinians are not rolling in candy and dancing in the streets, but in the grande scheme of ****ty places to be in the world, there are alot worse places than Palestine.

 

[earth_as_one]

Z, Is a Jewish neighborhood in Iran a worse place than Palestine? Also are you aware that collective punishment of civilians is a war crime?

Thanks for the link DL

 

[earth_as_one]

Z, You reference mistakes made by Palestinians. Perhaps you could explain the steps the majority of Palestinians who are unarmed and peaceful civilians could have taken to avoid home demolitions, ethnic cleansing, indiscriminate killings and the other war crimes and crimes against humanity they have suffered?

When Zionist terrorist organizations were slaughtering entire villages like Deir Yassin during the lead up to the 1948 war, what should the unarmed Palestinians do in the remaining villages do when the same terrorists show up at their village. Should they stay in their homes like the innocent civilians that used to live in Deir Yassin or run for their lives? What was their mistake?

When Israeli bulldozers show up at your house and announce its demolition, should you stay in your house or run for your life?

Should unarmed Palestinians who only want to live in peace (the majority) report Palestinians who resort to violence to the IDF? Would that make them safer?

What should an unarmed Palestinian do when the IDF smashes down their door, puts a gun to their head and then forces them to walk in front of them as a human shield as they exchange gunfire with armed militants?

Should peaceful Palestinians continue waiting for the world to intervene on their behalf. Is waiting for 60 years without resorting to violence long enough?

There are about 1,400,000 people in Gaza. One of my links above estimates that the number of Palestinians involved in firing rockets into Israel from Gaza was about 300. So I'm referencing the other 1,399,700 people. What should these people do? I'd like to know what mistakes they made and how they could have avoided being the victims of ethnic cleansing, war crimes and crimes against humanity.

 

[earth_as_one]

Other perspectives on this conflict

Nobel Peace Laureate Desmond Tutu

Jewish Voice for Peace

Waging Peace: Archbishop Desmond Tutu Delivers Sabeel Conference Keynote Address

By Michel Gillespie and Betsy Mayfield in the Washington Report on Middle East Affairs.

ARCHBISHOP DESMOND Tutu thrilled a thousand attendees of the Friends of Sabeel-North America (FOSNA) conference at Boston’s Old South Church on Oct. 27. Sabeel is an ecumenical grassroots liberation theology movement among Palestinian Christians. In his speech, Tutu made a stirring appeal to Jews to reject Israeli oppression of Palestinians and to negotiate in good faith a just resolution of the world’s largest, longest running, and most destabilizing refugee and human rights crisis.

The Nobel Peace Laureate placed Israel’s occupation of Palestine squarely in the context of the Hebrew prophetic and Jewish ethical traditions, comparing the struggle of Palestinians with that against apartheid in South Africa.

“God vindicated us,” Tutu declared. “Apartheid’s rulers bit the dust as all oppressors have done always, for this is a moral universe; right and wrong matter.

“Mine is a cri de coeur,” he continued, “a cry of anguish from the heart, an impassioned appeal to my spiritual relatives, the offspring of Abraham like me—please hear the call of your noble scriptures, of our scriptures.”

Tutu, 76, achieved worldwide acclaim as a leading opponent of apartheid in South Africa during the 1980s and received the Nobel Peace Prize in 1984. He serves as the Patron of Sabeel International.

Tutu urged Jews to “deal with the oppressed, the weak, the despised compassionately, caringly, remembering what happened to you in Egypt and much more recently in Germany. Remember and act appropriately. If you reject your calling, you may survive for a long time, but you will find that it is all corrosive inside and one day you will implode.”...

http://www.jewishvoiceforpeace.org/publish/article_982.shtml

The world's largest prison camp.

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]August 16, 2005[/FONT]​

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]by the Independent (UK) [/FONT]​

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The World's Largest Prison Camp[/FONT]​

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]It seems that Israel wants to lock up Gaza and throw away the key[/FONT]​

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]by Paul McCann[/FONT]​

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]There is a Bedouin village - breezeblock shanties built on sand dunes - in the north of the Gaza Strip that has been overlooked by the army watchtowers of the Jewish settlement of Nisanit. On most nights during the intifada, soldiers in these watchtowers fired down into the alleys of the village, keeping everyone hemmed into their homes at night. On occasion, children, disorientated and panicked by the firing, had been known to run out of their shacks and into the line of fire. [/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]There were many randomly-firing watchtowers surrounding the Israeli settlements in Gaza. They have killed hundreds of Palestinians, both militant and innocent, and are hated by the local population. Their removal this week, along with the settlements themselves, will rightly be a moment of celebration. But just because the most visible and oppressive signs of the Israeli occupation will be gone, no one should be under the illusion that Gaza will cease to be the world's largest prison camp.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Last week, the Israeli cabinet has decided that it would maintain troops on the border between Gaza and Egypt for the foreseeable future - along the so-called Philadelphia corridor. It was from a watchtower on this border that peace activist Tom Hurndall was shot in 2003. The same cabinet meeting also decided that Israel must continue to control who enters and exits Gaza through Egypt and proposed a new border crossing at Kerem Shalom where Israel, Gaza and Egypt meet. This busy cabinet meeting also decided that it would allow Gaza to have three miles of territorial waters - after that Israel would control the sea. It had already been decided that Israel will continue to control Gaza's airspace.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Earlier this year, the International Committee of the Red Cross, the guardian of international humanitarian law, sent the Israeli government a confidential position paper making clear that the removal of the Israeli troops and settlers from Gaza will not end the occupation. The paper stated: "Israel will retain significant control over the Gaza Strip, which will enable it to exercise key elements of authority. Thus ... it seems at this stage the Gaza Strip will remain occupied for the purposes of international humanitarian law."...[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0816-25.htm[/FONT]

Legally Gaza remains occupied by Israel and responsible for living conditions.

Israel uses that control to collectively punish 1.4 million people with malnutrition and disease.

Oxfam

May 2, 2008 12:01 AM
After almost a year of siege Gaza closer than ever to total breakdown


Agencies challenge Mid-East Quartet to break its collective complacency over Gaza's suffering

...The agencies, including Oxfam, Christian Aid, CARE International UK, CAFOD and Medecins du Monde UK, said that the stranglehold on Gaza's borders has made life for ordinary people in Gaza intolerable, and the work of the UN and other humanitarian agencies has been made virtually impossible. Only a trickle of medicine, food, fuel and other goods is being allowed in. It has made people highly dependent on food aid, and brought the health system and basic services such as water and sanitation near to collapse.

Two months ago, the agencies released a detailed report saying conditions in Gaza were the worst since 1967. Now it is worse still. The United Nations Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA) last week was forced to temporarily suspend the distribution of food aid to 650,000 people due to lack of fuel and has reported that 300,000 people only have drinking water for 4 hours every 4 days...

..."Peace will not be achieved by locking 1.5 million people into a prison of spiralling poverty and misery. Strong leadership is needed from within the Quartet to convince Israel of the need to chart a new direction on Gaza," said Geoffrey Dennis, Chief Executive of CARE International UK...

http://www.oxfam.org.uk/applications/blogs/pressoffice/2008/05/after_almost_a_year_of_siege_g.html

Define crime against humanity?

 

[Just the Facts]

We both agree that Iranian Jews do not have justice. The person you reference was apparently hanged without due process. Persian Jews face official and unofficial discrimination. Iran is a severe country. Belonging to any religious minority in Iran would be unpleasant.

But you never answered my hypothetical question. Would you rather be a nationless Palestinian living in Israel and the Occupied Territories or an Iranian Jew?

A Palestiian living in Israel, hands down.

 

[earth_as_one]

That's funny

Satire can be dangerous when it comes to Israel:

Uri Avnery's Column

Worse than a Crime

26/01/08


IT LOOKED like the fall of the Berlin wall. And not only did it look like it. For a moment, the Rafah crossing was the Brandenburg Gate.

It is impossible not to feel exhilaration when masses of oppressed and hungry people break down the wall that is shutting them in, their eyes radiant, embracing everybody they meet - to feel so even when it is your own government that erected the wall in the first place.

The Gaza Strip is the largest prison on earth. The breaking of the Rafah wall was an act of liberation. It proves that an inhuman policy is always a stupid policy: no power can stand up against a mass of people that has crossed the border of despair.

That is the lesson of Gaza, January, 2008.

ONE MIGHT repeat the famous saying of the French statesman Boulay de la Meurthe, slightly amended: It is worse than a war crime, it is a blunder!

Months ago, the two Ehuds - Barak and Olmert - imposed a blockade on the Gaza Strip, and boasted about it. Lately they have tightened the deadly noose even more, so that hardly anything at all could be brought into the Strip. Last week they made the blockade absolute - no food, no medicines. Things reached a climax when they stopped the fuel, too. Large areas of Gaza remained without electricity - incubators for premature babies, dialysis machines, pumps for water and sewage. Hundreds of thousands remained without heating in the severe cold, unable to cook, running out of food.

Again and again, Aljazeera broadcast the pictures into millions of homes in the Arab world. TV stations all over the world showed them, too. From Casablanca to Amman angry mass protest broke out and frightened the authoritarian Arab regimes. Hosny Mubarak called Ehud Barak in panic. That evening Barak was compelled to cancel, at least temporarily, the fuel-blockade he had imposed in the morning. Apart from that, the blockade remained total.

It is hard to imagine a more stupid act.

THE REASON given for the starving and freezing of one and a half million human beings, crowded into a territory of 365 square kilometers, is the continued shooting at the town of Sderot and the adjoining villages.

That is a well-chosen reason. It unites the primitive and poor parts of the Israeli public. It blunts the criticism of the UN and the governments throughout the world, who might otherwise have spoken out against a collective punishment that is, undoubtedly, a war crime under international law.

A clear picture is presented to the world: the Hamas terror regime in Gaza launches missiles at innocent Israeli civilians. No government in the world can tolerate the bombardment of its citizens from across the border. The Israeli military has not found a military answer to the Qassam missiles. Therefore there is no other way than to exert such strong pressure on the Gaza population as to make them rise up against Hamas and compel them to stop the missiles.

The day the Gaza electricity works stopped operating, our military correspondents were overjoyed: only two Qassams were launched from the Strip. So it works! Ehud Barak is a genius!

But the day after, 17 Qassams landed, and the joy evaporated. Politicians and generals were (literally) out of their minds: one politician proposed to "act crazier than them", another proposed to "shell Gaza's urban area indiscriminately for every Qassam launched", a famous professor (who is a little bit deranged) proposed the exercise of "ultimate evil".

The government scenario was a repeat of Lebanon War II (the report about which is due to be published in a few days). Then: Hizbullah captured two soldiers on the Israeli side of the border, now: Hamas fired on towns and villages on the Israeli side of the border. Then: the government decide in haste to start a war, now: the government decided in haste to impose a total blockade. Then: the government ordered the massive bombing of the civilian population in order to get them to pressure Hizbullah, now: the government decided to cause massive suffering of the civilian population in order to get them to pressure Hamas.

The results were the same in both cases: the Lebanese population did not rise up against Hizbullah, but on the contrary, people of all religious communities united behind the Shiite organization. Hassan Nasrallah became the hero of the entire Arab world. And now: the population unites behind Hamas and accuses Mahmoud Abbas of cooperation with the enemy. A mother who has no food for her children does not curse Ismail Haniyeh, she curses Olmert, Abbas and Mubarak.

SO WHAT to do? After all, it is impossible to tolerate the suffering of the inhabitants of Sderot, who are under constant fire.

What is being hidden from the embittered public is that the launching of the Qassams could be stopped tomorrow morning.

Several months ago Hamas proposed a cease-fire. It repeated the offer this week.

A cease-fire means, in the view of Hamas: the Palestinians will stop shooting Qassams and mortar shells, the Israelis will stop the incursions into Gaza, the "targeted" assassinations and the blockade.

Why doesn't our government jump at this proposal?

Simple: in order to make such a deal, we must speak with Hamas, directly or indirectly. And this is precisely what the government refuses to do.

Why? Simple again: Sderot is only a pretext - much like the two captured soldiers were a pretext for something else altogether. The real purpose of the whole exercise is to overthrow the Hamas regime in Gaza and to prevent a Hamas takeover in the West Bank.

In simple and blunt words: the government sacrifices the fate of the Sderot population on the altar of a hopeless principle. It is more important for the government to boycott Hamas - because it is now the spearhead of Palestinian resistance - than to put an end to the suffering of Sderot. All the media cooperate with this pretence.

IT HAS been said before that it is dangerous to write satire in our country - too often the satire becomes reality. Some readers may recall a satirical article I wrote months ago. In it I described the situation in Gaza as a scientific experiment designed to find out how far one can go, in starving a civilian population and turning their lives into hell, before they raise their hands in surrender.

This week, the satire has become official policy. Respected commentators declared explicitly that Ehud Barak and the army chiefs are working on the principle of "trial and error" and change their methods daily according to results. They stop the fuel to Gaza, observe how this works and backtrack when the international reaction is too negative. They stop the delivery of medicines, see how it works, etc. The scientific aim justifies the means....

http://zope.gush-shalom.org/home/en/channels/avnery/1201278309/

 

[Just the Facts]

That's funny

Satire can be dangerous when it comes to Israel:

Yeah it's hilarious. Especially this part:

It is impossible not to feel exhilaration when masses of oppressed and hungry people break down the wall

in light of:

In a shopping spree that was both festive and frenzied, Gazans cleared out stores in an Egyptian border town, buying up everything from TV sets to soft drinks to cigarettes.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22794305/


Hello cognitive disonance. All those starving and oppressed people dragging TV sets home. Where ARE their priorities?!

As David Letterman would say, "them TV sets are good eatin'!!"