Gun Control is Completely Useless.

[TenPenny]

Yep, it's a society problem, not a gun problem.

 

[Colpy]

so back in the 70s gun control started to increase and crime has decreased

did you not dispute this?

In Canada?

Quite correct.

But one had absolutely nothing to do with the other.

The proof?

In the United States, they have radically eased gun laws since the 1980s, and crime has decreased there as well..

i wish i had read this starting out

you think some gun control is useful but other gun control is not.

I think some gun control is rational, like background checks and licensing. I am also quite willing to accept classification (if simplified) and bans on full auto weapons. As well, I think it fits the "as allowed by law" caveat in our recognized right to keep arms.

As I said, the mass of Canadian law beyond that is simply harassment.

 

[bluebyrd35]

In Canada?

Quite correct.

But one had absolutely nothing to do with the other.

The proof?

In the United States, they have radically eased gun laws since the 1980s, and crime has decreased there as well..



I think some gun control is rational, like background checks and licensing. I am also quite willing to accept classification (if simplified) and bans on full auto weapons. As well, I think it fits the "as allowed by law" caveat in our recognized right to keep arms.

As I said, the mass of Canadian law beyond that is simply harassment.

https://globalnews.ca/news/2378037/...ers-how-america-canada-and-the-world-compare/

Tell me why we should adopt the US's gun laws again: I am not sure where you get your stats from but gun homicides are not down, and massacres are up. This year will beat last year, just as last year beat 2014.

 

[MHz]

The part you are missing is the events would have been shut down sooner rather than later if the public had more members packing a pistol.

 

[JamesBondo]

Tell me why we should adopt the US's gun laws again: I am not sure where you get your stats from but gun homicides are not down, and massacres are up. This year will beat last year, just as last year beat 2014.

There are initiatives in the USA that caused their trends to improve twice as fast as Canada. Obviously, making smart decisions is not your strong point.

 

[DaSleeper]

In Canada?

Quite correct.

But one had absolutely nothing to do with the other.

The proof?

In the United States, they have radically eased gun laws since the 1980s, and crime has decreased there as well..



I think some gun control is rational, like background checks and licensing. I am also quite willing to accept classification (if simplified) and bans on full auto weapons. As well, I think it fits the "as allowed by law" caveat in our recognized right to keep arms.

As I said, the mass of Canadian law beyond that is simply harassment.

https://globalnews.ca/news/2378037/...ers-how-america-canada-and-the-world-compare/

Tell me why we should adopt the US's gun laws again: I am not sure where you get your stats from but gun homicides are not down, and massacres are up. This year will beat last year, just as last year beat 2014.

Not answering your stupid post......leaving that for Colpy

Just fixing the stupid quotes.....screwed-up for two pages....

 

[TenPenny]

Hey, I grew up in the same place as Colpy, even seen him driving around. He can't be bad. People around here go hunting. some shoot targets. I know lots of them.


I think the problem is not 'guns', the problem is that no community should have more than 100,000 people in it. Too many people, too many problems. Smaller place, you can weed out the bad elements.

 

[bluebyrd35]

The part you are missing is the events would have been shut down sooner rather than later if the public had more members packing a pistol.

Now that is rather a dumb statement. The Las Vegas shooter had 23 guns( Rifles) at least which he brought in to a high rise hotel, some of which were felt to be modified and he was firing down on a crowd of people. So how do a few people with pistols firing upward at a sniper end it sooner? More people would have been killed by those bullets returning to earth,

There are initiatives in the USA that caused their trends to improve twice as fast as Canada. Obviously, making smart decisions is not your strong point.

Well I guess my logic is better than yours. Check the dates on Colpy's stats and then check recent years i.e. after 2014 when a central organization was again given the responsibly of collecting the gun stats for the whole country, not state by state when and if they felt like it.

Not answering your stupid post......leaving that for Colpy

Just fixing the stupid quotes.....screwed-up for two pages....

LOL And exactly what does fixing the screw up in posting have to do with the accuracy of what I point out. Those long posts were not mine as you well know.

You may take outdated material that proves what you want to see but most people prefer up to date and accurate information.

Hey, I grew up in the same place as Colpy, even seen him driving around. He can't be bad. People around here go hunting. some shoot targets. I know lots of them.


I think the problem is not 'guns', the problem is that no community should have more than 100,000 people in it. Too many people, too many problems. Smaller place, you can weed out the bad elements.

Where did I say Colpy was bad. He just looks mighty hard for stats that support his view and I would bet they come from those fighting to keep no reasonable gun laws. Simply that he had to look long and hard to find those that conform to his viewpoint.

 

[taxslave]

It's kind of mean to the animal to start nibbling on him while it's still alive, also rather awkward while it's still moving!

Especially if it is like a moose

Now that is rather a dumb statement. The Las Vegas shooter had 23 guns( Rifles) at least which he brought in to a high rise hotel, some of which were felt to be modified and he was firing down on a crowd of people. So how do a few people with pistols firing upward at a sniper end it sooner? More people would have been killed by those bullets returning to earth,


Well I guess my logic is better than yours. Check the dates on Colpy's stats and then check recent years i.e. after 2014 when a central organization was again given the responsibly of collecting the gun stats for the whole country, not state by state when and if they felt like it.


LOL And exactly what does fixing the screw up in posting have to do with the accuracy of what I point out. Those long posts were not mine as you well know.

You may take outdated material that proves what you want to see but most people prefer up to date and accurate information.


Where did I say Colpy was bad. He just looks mighty hard for stats that support his view and I would bet they come from those fighting to keep no reasonable gun laws. Simply that he had to look long and hard to find those that conform to his viewpoint.

The problem that you can't or won't grasp is that we already have unreasonable gun laws and they are not preventing crime. I suggest you read the rules for keeping a long gun in your home. Handgun rules are even worse. They have little logical to do with crime prevention and everything to do with politics. In fact our gun laws are actually designed to make criminals out of upstanding taxpayers most probably with the intent to make them give up their guns in frustration.

 

[JamesBondo]

Now that is rather a dumb statement. The Las Vegas shooter had 23 guns( Rifles) at least which he brought in to a high rise hotel, some of which were felt to be modified and he was firing down on a crowd of people. So how do a few people with pistols firing upward at a sniper end it sooner? More people would have been killed by those bullets returning to earth,

Explain to us how Canadian style gun laws would have prevented that. You can't.

Well I guess my logic is better than yours.

Your logic is absolutely inferior. You claim that the x is better than x accomplished in half the time.

LOL And exactly what does fixing the screw up in posting have to do with the accuracy of what I point out. Those long posts were not mine as you well know.

What accuracy? The accuracy of when you declare that canadian laws are awesome when in fact they are trending and showing less progress than the screwed up americans.

You may take outdated material that proves what you want to see but most people prefer up to date and accurate information.

What on earth are you blathering about? every time you post information on this thread it is debunked.

Where did I say Colpy was bad. He just looks mighty hard for stats that support his view and I would bet they come from those fighting to keep no reasonable gun laws. Simply that he had to look long and hard to find those that conform to his viewpoint.

the guy has industry experience and you are just a house wife. Ofcourse it looks like he works hard to get his information when in fact he just knows more about it that you do.

 

[Bar Sinister]

Okay.

As for rights, the state can only deny your rights, it does not create them. Clearly, to anyone that knows anything about human history, the right to self-defense and the means to same is paramount, and has existed since we crawled out of the trees. To anyone that can read, that right exists throughout English common law. Unfortunately, the turdheads that make up the SCC can't read.

If your case is that the availability of guns are what causes murder, explain the following:

1. 13% of the US population is African-American. They commit slightly over 50% of the murders. How does that work?

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2015/crime-in-the-u.s.-2015/tables/table-43

2. The USA has the highest level of gun ownership by far, but a murder rate well below the international average. In fact, the USA ranks mid-point in the hierarchy of murderous countries. (Rates per 100,000 World Average 6.2, USA 4.9)

3. Indeed, if you compare the list of countries by homicide rate, and the list of countries by gun ownership, you will find that there is no easy correlation, and if there is a correlation, it is a negative one.

Voila:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estimated_number_of_guns_per_capita_by_country

Explain.

4. In the last 25 years, the United States has eased gun laws to the point where well over 40 states must issue a permit to carry a handgun concealed to any citizen that passes a background check, and takes a basic course. In the same time, the assault weapons ban has died, and gun sales have reached record highs.

And the murder rate has fallen. Radically.

https://www.infoplease.com/us/crime/homicide-rate-1950-2014

Explain.

Once again, I suggest that you back yourself up with more than touchy-feely BS if you want to be taken seriously.

Address the issue.

Quite frankly, Colpy I am tired of your straw-grasping arguments. I compare the USA to Canada and nations like Canada; not some disfunctional developing nation. And I don't buy the argument that Blacks in the US are the problem. After all they must get their guns from somewhere; could it be from the Whites who own gun shops? In any case, you have just made a case for gun control. After all you don't want a bunch of armed African Americans taking matters into their own hands do you?

 

[Tecumsehsbones]

Now that is rather a dumb statement. The Las Vegas shooter had 23 guns( Rifles) at least which he brought in to a high rise hotel, some of which were felt to be modified and he was firing down on a crowd of people. So how do a few people with pistols firing upward at a sniper end it sooner? More people would have been killed by those bullets returning to earth,

You don't know it, but the fact that he had 23 guns was a good thing, as well as proof that he was a noob and an idiot.

Ever seen a soldier with more than one rifle and one pistol? You never will. All the weight of those 22 extra guns (let's call it four kilograms apiece, making a total of 88 kg) could have been used for more ammo.

I mean, seriously, who the hell packs around 23 guns? You can't shoot but one at a time.

What a moron.

 

[DaSleeper]

LOL And exactly what does fixing the screw up in posting have to do with the accuracy of what I point out. Those long posts were not mine as you well know.

.

You still babbling and rambling to hear your own voice?

 

[Colpy]

https://globalnews.ca/news/2378037/...ers-how-america-canada-and-the-world-compare/

Tell me why we should adopt the US's gun laws again: I am not sure where you get your stats from but gun homicides are not down, and massacres are up. This year will beat last year, just as last year beat 2014.

As I have shown over and over and over again, gun death stats are absolutely irrelevant to the conversation.

You have to show gun control prevents murder.

The two are not the same.

 

[bluebyrd35]

Especially if it is like a moose



The problem that you can't or won't grasp is that we already have unreasonable gun laws and they are not preventing crime. I suggest you read the rules for keeping a long gun in your home. Handgun rules are even worse. They have little logical to do with crime prevention and everything to do with politics. In fact our gun laws are actually designed to make criminals out of upstanding taxpayers most probably with the intent to make them give up their guns in frustration.

Ah it is not crime but killing we are preventing. Compare US;s deaths, to Canada:s with firearms. Per hundred thousand population ...no comparison .The point is Humans are violent creatures to start with. Adding easy access to a weapon gives an immediate outlet to violence. If a weapon is a little tougher to get to, it gives a space for some semblance of sanity to re-emerge.

As far as gun laws go, our system is not draconian simply preventive as far as possible while allowing those who like to kill an outlet on what is referred to as "Wild" Now that is a joke because the worse wild animal is man.

 

[Hoid]

You have to show gun control prevents murder.

You mean that he has to show that the gun control you personally do not agree with has to prevent murder.

Obviously those gun control measures that you happen to agree with prevent murders or you would not believe in them.

So I guess that's the answer to all this quibbling. Just show us how those background checks you believe in prevent murder.

 

[Colpy]

You mean that he has to show that the gun control you personally do not agree with has to prevent murder.

Obviously those gun control measures that you happen to agree with prevent murders or you would not believe in them.

So I guess that's the answer to all this quibbling. Just show us how those background checks you believe in prevent murder.

Sigh

In Canada 80% of firearms deaths are suicide.

4. Firearm Suicides - Firearms, Accidental Deaths, Suicides and Violent Crime: An Updated Review of the Literature with Special Reference to the Canadian Situation

In the USA over 60% of firearms deaths are suicide.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States

Are you seriously suggesting that my rights be truncated because somebody voluntarily sticks a gun in his mouth and tries to pull the trigger twice?

And how, exactly, would you prevent that.

I'm still waiting for something of substance from you.

 

[JLM]

The biggest tragedy about guns is the chronic and habitual obsession about them by people who have little knowledge of the subject!

Sigh

In Canada 80% of firearms deaths are suicide.

4. Firearm Suicides - Firearms, Accidental Deaths, Suicides and Violent Crime: An Updated Review of the Literature with Special Reference to the Canadian Situation

In the USA over 60% of firearms deaths are suicide.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States

Are you seriously suggesting that my rights be truncated because somebody voluntarily sticks a gun in his mouth and tries to pull the trigger twice?

And how, exactly, would you prevent that.

I'm still waiting for something of substance from you.

Those stats tell me that Canadians are even more f**ked up than Americans!

 

[DaSleeper]

It might even help a few in this forum :lol:

How A Gunshot Wound Cured One Man's OCD - KnowledgeNuts

 

[Colpy]

It might even help a few in this forum :lol:

How A Gunshot Wound Cured One Man's OCD - KnowledgeNuts

Hey now!

I'm the local poster boy for Obsessive Compulsive Disorder, and shooting myself in the foot repeatedly never helped me.