Panic in Ottawa after one drastic change in Canadian monetary policy

Cliffy

Standing Member
Nov 19, 2008
44,850
193
63
Nakusp, BC
I was eating breakfast with my 10-year old Granddaughter and I asked her, "What day is tomorrow?"

Without skipping a beat she said, "It's Prime Minister Day!"

She's smart, so I asked her "What does Prime Minister Day mean?"

I was waiting for something about Harper or one of the past Prime Ministers.

She replied, "Prime Minister Day is when the Prime Minister steps out of the House of Commons, and if he sees his shadow, we have 4 more years of bull ****."

You know, it hurts when hot coffee spurts out your nose!
 

mentalfloss

Prickly Curmudgeon Smiter
Jun 28, 2010
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Is Canada Headed For Another Recession? Eight Troubling Signs

Here are eight of the most troubling indicators of a downturn and more signs to watch for over the coming months.

1. GDP shrank in November, before the massive drop in oil prices that is expected to hit the economy in the first half of 2015. It would take five more months of negative growth to put the country into official recession.

November’s decline was broad-based and not just a result of the limp oil sector.

Weakness in the mining and manufacturing sectors took economy watchers by surprise. However, as Doug Porter points out, it is not at all rare to have a few months of negative growth in a year and economists don’t read much into one month of bad numbers. “It’ s very unfortunate that we got that report after a string of weak numbers but I wouldn’t take it that seriously unless we had two or three months in a row of declining GDP,” Porter said.

bmo exports chart

2. The manufacturing sector fell in November, a time when the U.S. economy was booming and the loonie was falling.

The 1.9-per-cent decline in manufacturing in November was the biggest monthly drop since the recession in 2009. However, there was strong growth in the previous two months and early indicators suggest production in the auto sector rebounded in December, though data from that month also suggested the prices for manufactured goods are dropping at the fastest rate in six years, since the end of the Great Recession.

“The crucial question is whether the export sector can step in and take over, whether it’s enough to offset the downturn in the oilpatch, which is a problem because we’ve put all our eggs in one basket,” Stanford said.

A monthly gauge of the health of the manufacturing sector reached hit its lowest level in nearly two years in January.

The loonie, which is declining on the back of lower oil prices, is expected to boost exports to help offset some of the slowdown in the oilpatch. But economist David Madani of Capital Economics wonders whether it will.

“While the further decline in the Canadian dollar to just below US$0.80 will support manufacturing, we still think that any boom there is unlikely to come to the rescue soon enough,” he said.

3. The Bank of Canada’s key interest rate is already so low, there is virtually nowhere else to go.

The central bank's surprise interest rate cut last month to 0.75 per cent is widely expected to be followed by another 0.25 per cent cut in March. That would put the central bank’s overnight lending rate so close to zero that if the economy hit a more serious rough patch, it would have virtually nowhere to go to stimulate growth.

Porter said that’s why he was not in favour of the January rate cut.

“I personally think it should have been saved for a time when the economy is in very dire straits ...That’s one of my concerns that they basically don’t have a lot of dry powder at this point to help support the economy if it gets into really heavy weather.”

4 . The Canadian economy has yet to see a full economic recovery from the last recession, and is more vulnerable in the face of another slowdown.

The Great Recession was different from prior downturns because it originated in the financial sector, and economists believe the nature of the crisis meant that it would take longer than in a traditional recession for the economy to return to normal. Indeed, economic growth and the job market have yet to fully recover. A majority of Canadians say it feels like a recession already.

“We have not used the last few years of prosperity to put our economic house in order, preferring instead to coast on debt and the bounty of a resource boom,” Livio Di Matteo, an economics professor at Lakehead University, recently wrote in a column.

“When comparing our current slowdown with the last recession, the indications are we may be in for a much bumpier ride.”

This vulnerability is something Doug Porter has been concerned about for a couple years.

“Given that interest rates are already basically as low as they can go, there really isn’t too much policy makers can do if the economy were hit by some sort of outside shock,” he said.

5. Consumer debt loads already at an all time high -- and now borrowing is even cheaper.

Canadians’ average debt-to-income ratio continues to climb ever closer toward 163 per cent. That means we owe $1.63 for every dollar we earn. Economists chalk this up to consumers being inspired by historically low interest rates brought in to spur the economy out of recession.

However, with uncertainty persisting, that low rate environment was already making some observers uncomfortable even before the central bank lowered the rate again. The IMF recently warned that the economy relies too heavily on consumer debt, and that the kind of debt Canadians are taking on is riskier than it used to be. The share of subprime mortgages in Canadian markets has hit a record high. With consumers so overstretched already, it is hard to see how much more debt they can take on in the name of sparking economic growth.

bmo house prices chart

6. A sudden downturn could be the pinprick that bursts the housing bubble.

Economists have been warning for years about Canada’s sky-high housing prices, sparking speculation that the market is in bubble territory, just as the U.S. was before the 2008-2009 crisis that sparked a global financial downturn.

The IMF has predicted Canada’s housing markets are headed for a “cooling” this year, a good sign because the organization also estimates house prices are overvalued by anywhere from seven to 20 per cent. The Bank of Canada recently estimated some markets overvalued as much as 30 per cent.

However, many have said that a housing crash only happens when there is some big precipitating factor. Could the shock of lower oil prices be that impetus? Even one of the country’s biggest real estate firms is making the connection.

7. The big banks’ prospects are dimming.

The outlook for Canadian banks, once seen as a bastion of stability in the face of a global financial downturn, was recently downgraded by at least one investment firm.

Barclays analyst John Aiken said he expects banks to do worse than previously thought due to a larger-than-expected slowdown in consumer spending and borrowing — and his prediction was made after the Bank of Canada lowered interest rates. Banks have been reluctant to pass on all of the most recent central bank cuts to consumers because it would eat into their profit margins. Because of their proximity to the ups and downs of spending and borrowing, the banking sector is often seen as a bellwether for the economy.

8. Our labour situation is depressing.

Canada is starting off the year on a dour note after Statistics Canada slashed its estimates for job growth in 2014 by a third.

In November alone, employment dropped by the most in five years, since just after the last recession. Job growth was already expected to be slow during at least the opening months of the year following a weak hand-off from 2014. Add to that the shuttering of oil rigs and layoffs in the oil patch, and a loss of 17,600 jobs at Target Canada alone, and we can expect a massive hit on jobs in the near future.

The jobs report numbers are the biggest indicator to watch because the consumer sector is most important to economic growth, said economist Bill Adams.

“If the Canadian economy is adding jobs or the job growth is trending in the same direction then the Canadian economy at its core will probably do alright.”

Is Canada Headed For Another Recession? Eight Troubling Signs
 

MHz

Time Out
Mar 16, 2007
41,030
43
48
Red Deer AB
It is more than Canada heading for financial destruction.

With the ECB now shutting off direct funds to Greece, today one of the greats in the business warned King World News that all hell is now breaking loose in Europe. He also warned that the situation is spiraling out of control and deteriorating quite rapidly.
Eric King: “The ECB has now shut off direct funds to Greece. The ECB is now playing hardball with the Greek negotiators.”
John Hathaway: “This is just a sign that things are spiraling out of control and in a much worse direction than central planners had expected. That’s what spooked the markets late Wednesday. I was amazed to see the Dow give up all of its gains in the space of half an hour….

Read more at All Hell Is Now Breaking Loose In Europe: Massive massive bank withdraws in Greece, 3 of Greece banks have tapped emergency funding!
 

damngrumpy

Executive Branch Member
Mar 16, 2005
9,949
21
38
kelowna bc
Actually there is something going on and some fear its the other shoe from 2008
with no more money for bailouts. Things are getting tighter and the government
may be looking for an early election that will be the sign of a more serious problem.
Cabinet Ministers will start to resign and not run if they think the government will
fall. The reason? Pensions if you are a Cabinet Minister and you go before the
writ the pay scale is way higher than a normal MP so watch who cuts and runs next.
I don't know how serious but there is some shaky ground out there.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
75,301
548
113
Vernon, B.C.
Actually there is something going on and some fear its the other shoe from 2008
with no more money for bailouts. Things are getting tighter and the government
may be looking for an early election that will be the sign of a more serious problem.
Cabinet Ministers will start to resign and not run if they think the government will
fall. The reason? Pensions if you are a Cabinet Minister and you go before the
writ the pay scale is way higher than a normal MP so watch who cuts and runs next.
I don't know how serious but there is some shaky ground out there.

Actually I think many of us have predicted things can't continue on the same on many fronts. However if you are able to be independent and have a few survival skills and a bit of savvy you'll come through it. A lot of people still continue to live fairly high on the hog and they might be the ones in for the biggest shock.
 

mentalfloss

Prickly Curmudgeon Smiter
Jun 28, 2010
39,817
471
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Is the Canadian economy unraveling?

'Canadian dollar is tanking and sinking fast, much faster than anyone had predicted': Economics professor

Will 2015 be the year the Canadian economy recovers, or unravels completely?

The stakes are high for Prime Minister Stephen Harper in this election year — it’s sink or swim.

While Harper must have an election this year, to win he needs to put all his best economic cards forward. The problem, however, is that there just does not seem to be any good economic news left.

Here is a breakdown of the overall Canadian economy.

Economic growth

In 2014, the Canadian economy had a lacklustre year. And now, we learn that real GDP declined by 0.2 per cent in November, mainly as a result of a weak manufacturing sector. This is the economy’s worst performance in almost a year.

Our economy is slowly sliding in the wrong direction.

http://www.cbc.ca/m/news/canada/manitoba/is-the-canadian-economy-unraveling-1.2945683
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
75,301
548
113
Vernon, B.C.
Dollar and oil were both up yesterday. Seems like chicken little has been foiled once again.

Yep, TSX has been soaring into new territory too. While I'm still making money sitting on my A$$, Harper can be as much of a dictator as he likes. He might just be doing something right! :)
 

MHz

Time Out
Mar 16, 2007
41,030
43
48
Red Deer AB
Dollar and oil were both up yesterday. Seems like chicken little has been foiled once again.
Do a futures buy on chicken feathers, I smell something in the wind.

Out of curiosity, what would actually go down if Murphy from Murphy's Law actually won a lottery?
 

mentalfloss

Prickly Curmudgeon Smiter
Jun 28, 2010
39,817
471
83
McJobs


Canadian economy adds jobs in January but most are part-time | Business | Reuters

OTTAWA (Reuters) - The Canadian economy added 35,400 jobs in January, far more than forecast, though the gains came on the back of more part-time positions, data from Statistics Canada showed on Friday.

The increase brought the unemployment rate down to 6.6 percent from December's 6.7 percent. Economists had forecast that just 4,500 jobs would be added in January, following two months of hefty declines.

But the details of the report were less strong, with employers cutting 11,800 full-time jobs, but adding 47,200 part-time positions.

"That takes a little bit of the shine off of what, on the surface, looks to be a pretty good number," said Doug Porter, chief economist at BMO Capital Markets, of the rise in part-time jobs.

The Canadian dollar weakened slightly against the greenback after the data. In the United States, job growth rose solidly last month, putting a mid-year interest rate hike back on the table.

The recent downturn in oil prices also made itself felt, with the natural resources sector shedding 8,800 jobs last month. Work in oil, gas and support activities make up about 60 percent of the natural resources segment, the agency said.

The labor participation rate, which is closely watched by the Bank of Canada, held steady at 65.7 percent, the lowest since 2000. Continued...

Canadian economy adds jobs in January but most are part-time | Business | Reuters
 

MHz

Time Out
Mar 16, 2007
41,030
43
48
Red Deer AB
Those lists would make for an interesting read.

"But the details of the report were less strong, with employers cutting 11,800 full-time jobs, but adding 47,200 part-time positions."
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
75,301
548
113
Vernon, B.C.
McJobs


Canadian economy adds jobs in January but most are part-time | Business | Reuters

OTTAWA (Reuters) - The Canadian economy added 35,400 jobs in January, far more than forecast, though the gains came on the back of more part-time positions, data from Statistics Canada showed on Friday.

The increase brought the unemployment rate down to 6.6 percent from December's 6.7 percent. Economists had forecast that just 4,500 jobs would be added in January, following two months of hefty declines.

But the details of the report were less strong, with employers cutting 11,800 full-time jobs, but adding 47,200 part-time positions.

"That takes a little bit of the shine off of what, on the surface, looks to be a pretty good number," said Doug Porter, chief economist at BMO Capital Markets, of the rise in part-time jobs.

The Canadian dollar weakened slightly against the greenback after the data. In the United States, job growth rose solidly last month, putting a mid-year interest rate hike back on the table.

The recent downturn in oil prices also made itself felt, with the natural resources sector shedding 8,800 jobs last month. Work in oil, gas and support activities make up about 60 percent of the natural resources segment, the agency said.

The labor participation rate, which is closely watched by the Bank of Canada, held steady at 65.7 percent, the lowest since 2000. Continued...

Canadian economy adds jobs in January but most are part-time | Business | Reuters

Before being able to comment on this it would be helpful if we knew how many people are looking for full time jobs and how want part time jobs.
 

darkbeaver

the universe is electric
Jan 26, 2006
41,035
201
63
RR1 Distopia 666 Discordia
It's Feb. The so called 8800 "lost jobs" were winter slow down. They go back to work after break up

LIA remember, what breakup?
 

mentalfloss

Prickly Curmudgeon Smiter
Jun 28, 2010
39,817
471
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It's Feb. The so called 8800 "lost jobs" were winter slow down. They go back to work after break up

You said the same thing last year and there were full time jobs that were lost the whole year through.
 

petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
118,620
14,563
113
Low Earth Orbit
You said the same thing last year and there were full time jobs that were lost the whole year through.

Where were they lost? Trades?

It's fact. 2200 tradesmen goto work in March on one project. There are several other projects gobbling up red seal tradesmen getting under way this spring. There is a reason they are called "journeymen".

We still need 500,000 journeypersons on the Prairie and fast or we'll fall behind.