Ontario Court rejects the right to wear niqab

Goober

Hall of Fame Member
Jan 23, 2009
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Moving
And yet that very same article says the following:



There is also, as I have mentioned before, the case of dying declarations. And as you have mentioned, the case of witnesses who are children. And even when the witness is a child and face-to-face confrontation is not allowed, the defence counsel is still permitted to cross-examine.

The Confrontation Clause is about the right to challenge the witness's statements and impeach the witness's credibility. In short, to cross-examine the witness. The exceptions demonstrate this.

But you go right ahead on cherry-picking your Wikipedia article. Everybody needs a hobby.

No cherry picking- The law does adapt as we have both pointed out. For children - declarations etc. We both have strong and differing opinions on confronting your accuser.
And cherry picking ain't a hobby of mine.
 

Mowich

Hall of Fame Member
Dec 25, 2005
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Gore never claimed to have invented the internet. Such statements are lies. Are you repeating them out of malice or ignorance? And which of those is more pathetic?

According to Snopes, you are absolutely right, Tec. What he said during an interview with Wolf Blitzer on March 9, 1999 was that 'he took the initiative in creating the internet.' As the article points out, his statement may have been 'clumsy' and 'perhaps self-serving' however, he was responsible in an 'economic' and 'legislative sense for fostering the technology that we now know as the Internet.'

snopes.com: Al Gore Invented the Internet

 

Jonny_C

Electoral Member
Apr 25, 2013
372
0
16
North Bay, ON
OK, I move we start with stupid-looking fishing hats and ugly plaid shirts.

Them's fightin' words, bub. :lol:

I think you still might have to take off your stupid fishing hat in court; plaid shirt probably passes the dress code.

By the way a stupid-looking "fishing hat" isn't really just a fishing hat. It's all purpose. :)
 

Elder

Electoral Member
Jan 15, 2011
195
3
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Comox BC Canada🇨🇦
I was under the impression that The beauty of Canada was that we where not a "melting pot".
That differences where cherished, a good thing, Something to preserve, a source of strength.

Or was that only because I had a French influenced upbringing?


That was the "ideal" when enacted 40+ years ago but, in my estimation, it has not been beneficial for all Canadians as a whole. I suggest we need to be Canadians only not: French C, or Iranian C, or Polish C, or Indo C, or Honduran C or Chinese C...and it goes on and on. It has created a patch work quilt of "special ethnic groups' many of whom want to, and do, re-create their cultures within Canada and not all of the customs/traditions are wonderful.

You should live here in Greater Vancouver and know about the Indo Canadians throwing acid in daughter and daughter in law's faces or families just right out murdering their women folk because that is how it is done where they come from if they decide the girls dishonoured their family. The murder rate has soared here in the past 30 years and much of these can be attributed (traced) to various immigrant and 1st generation ethnic groups who take pride in holding us near hostage with some very violent customs.


Before you say that not much of it happens, drive by shootings,extreme spousal abuse and more has increased radically, so much so we do not get excited anymore unless it is in our neighbourhood. No neighbourhood is exempt...all of GV gets it. This is not the land we lived in 30 years ago even. There are not enough filters.

One of the major reasons I live in Greater Vancouver is that the world comes here. I enjoy meeting, and be-friending, folk from all over the world. When we have a party it looks like it is in the UN: Chinese, Fijian, Iranian, English, French, Icelandic, Fillipino, Indian, Native Indian and more nations are represented here in our home. We really enjoy and value our differences, especially when it is a potluck dinner!! but we are all Canadian, together, in the end.

We need to just be Canadian together.

Off Topic: husband just arrived home with French beer. He had a bottle of :La Fin du Monde: and said it is the best ale he has ever had. I told him I was sending a message to a Frenchman so he wanted you to know he loves the French beer making.
 
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petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
117,406
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That was the "ideal" when enacted 40+ years ago but, in my estimation, it has not been beneficial for all Canadians as a whole. I suggest we need to be Canadians only not: French C, or Iranian C, or Polish C, or Indo C, or Honduran C or Chinese C...and it goes on and on. It has created a patch work quilt of "special ethnic groups' many of whom want to, and do, re-create their cultures within Canada and not all of the customs/traditions are wonderful.

You should live here in Greater Vancouver and know about the Indo Canadians throwing acid in daughter and daughter in law's faces or families just right out murdering their women folk because that is how it is done where they come from if they decide the girls dishonoured their family. The murder rate has soared here in the past 30 years and much of these can be attributed (traced) to various immigrant and 1st generation ethnic groups who take pride in holding us near hostage with some very violent customs.


Before you say that not much of it happens, drive by shootings,extreme spousal abuse and more has increased radically, so much so we do not get excited anymore unless it is in our neighbourhood. No neighbourhood is exempt...all of GV gets it. This is not the land we lived in 30 years ago even. There are not enough filters.

One of the major reasons I live in Greater Vancouver is that the comes here. I enjoy meeting, and sometimes be-friending, folk from all over the world. When we have a party it looks like it is in the UN: Chinese, Fijian, Iranian, English, French, Icelandic, Fillipino, Indian, Native Indian, We really enjoy and value our differences, especially when it is a potluck dinner!! but we are all Canadian, together, in the end.

We need to just be Canadian together.
Go on a ride along with the cops sometime. It's one domestic after another after another and race doesn't matter. It's alcohol, drugs and money behind the majority of the calls.
 

gopher

Hall of Fame Member
Jun 26, 2005
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Minnesota: Gopher State
Gopherland is called Turtle Island by Native Americans of this region.

Oh by the way, re the niqab, as we all know from my posts which quoted the Koran, a woman is not to wear one. And as you know the Koran refers to the Bible as the Book because it is considered sacred to Muslims.

In the Bible hiding of the face was not done by pious women but was done by prostitutes: Genesis 38: 14,15.


Therefore, pious Islamic women are not to wear niqabs!
 

Cliffy

Standing Member
Nov 19, 2008
44,850
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Nakusp, BC
Gopherland is called Turtle Island by Native Americans of this region.

Oh by the way, re the niqab, as we all know from my posts which quoted the Koran, a woman is not to wear one. And as you know the Koran refers to the Bible as the Book because it is considered sacred to Muslims.

In the Bible hiding of the face was not done by pious women but was done by prostitutes: Genesis 38: 14,15.


Therefore, pious Islamic women are not to wear niqabs!
North America is Turtle Island not your state.

Interesting about hiding the face, though.
 

Elder

Electoral Member
Jan 15, 2011
195
3
16
Comox BC Canada🇨🇦
Not anymore thank God.
Ok. I tried to find stats to back up my claim and was unable to do so. Demographics suggest that while immigrant women are more prone to domestic violence initially the rate of these crimes decrease later. I suspect I live too close to Surrey and Delta, both across the Fraser River from us, and was unduly influenced by reports. I will leave this alone due to the fact that I discovered I have no idea what I am talking about in this matter.
 
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petros

The Central Scrutinizer
Nov 21, 2008
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Drugs, alcohol, money.

What are the odds new, young immigrants who are struggling would fight over money, alcohol or drugs?

The problems are the same but the language is different.
 

Sal

Hall of Fame Member
Sep 29, 2007
17,135
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Interesting find that new immigrants suffer more abuse at the onset and then it declines.

Likely a combo of reasons for that such as high stress levels upon the men to find employment, coupled with that fact that the woman has no one to turn to while he abuses her.

His stress levels drop and she has people she can tell once they have been here for a bit. And he also learns it is not culturally acceptable and that she has legal recourse.
 

Tecumsehsbones

Hall of Fame Member
Mar 18, 2013
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That was the "ideal" when enacted 40+ years ago but, in my estimation, it has not been beneficial for all Canadians as a whole. I suggest we need to be Canadians only not: French C, or Iranian C, or Polish C, or Indo C, or Honduran C or Chinese C...and it goes on and on. It has created a patch work quilt of "special ethnic groups' many of whom want to, and do, re-create their cultures within Canada and not all of the customs/traditions are wonderful.
Are you sure you're not showing a bias? It seems to me that when you say "Canadian," you mean British Canadian.
 

Niflmir

A modern nomad
Dec 18, 2006
3,460
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Leiden, the Netherlands
Let us say a person was covered in bandages head to toe because of an acid attack. Would we force the person to risk infection and take them off so that an identification could be made? When did Canadians become so incapable of identifying a person without seeing their face?

This isn't even about religious freedom. What purpose does seeing the person's face serve? Once you have identified an individual, what difference does seeing their face make? Taking a person's right to "face" their accuser literally is patently absurd. This is just a case of a defense lawyer abusing a witness's compulsions to skirt justice.

Or was the judge actually so clueless that he couldn't tell who the woman was? Because unless he really couldn't identify the woman, I don't see what the point was.
 

Dixie Cup

Senate Member
Sep 16, 2006
6,313
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Edmonton
Since this is our second thread on the subject, I'll repeat my objections.

A woman raised to believe that her niqab is her modesty, is being forced to strip in front of men she is accusing of having assaulted her. I don't see the justice in that. Doubly so since they are men from her family, men who've perpetuated the niqab issue. It is by their pressure that it is normal to face a woman in a niqab. They do not deserve to have her stripped of it in court, and she does not deserve to be forced to do so.

My understanding from what I have read is that she has not always worn the niqab and that she isn't particularly religous. Having said that, we know that it's not a religious custom but cultural so the whole thing is moot!!

JMO