Israel - The Right to exist as a State?

[darkbeaver]

If the Mormon's developed separatist ambitions, would you then advocate blowing up Mormon children, on the grounds of freedom fighting, and resisting Mormon imperialism? Why aren't we blowing up Quebec separatists and calling ourselves freedom fighters resisting Francophone imperialism? Then when the Quebecers defend themselves we can accuse them of genocide.



Ummm, how does that not happen all the time already? Kosovo? Northern Nigeria? Ivory Coast? East Timor? Southern Sudan?



lol It's been fascinating to see this history evolve just in the 6 years or so that I've been involved in this forum. 500-600k Arabs left Israel in 1948, (saying 10% of those by force would be generous) has now become the genocide of millions. Stay tuned.



lol an open air prison of disease and malnutrition where life expectancy exceeds that of the rest of the middle east, and has an obesity problem.

Give it up, these are lies plain and simple, demonstrated as lies repeatedly. Even most leftists have dropped this argument, because it's so obviously false and so easily proven so.

Kosovo Northern Nigeria Ivory Coast East Timor Southern Sudan all infested with Zionist carpet baggers and Mossad dogs. It has always been very generous to define your contributions as Just The Facts. Hasbara facts are not really facts at all. Of course no one should be surprised by the constant lies of a zionist.

 

[CDNBear]

Israel restricts the flow of humanitarian aid to Gaza, not the West Bank. These are two different places and two different situations. A study regarding three specific areas in the West Bank (very likely the three most prosperous areas in the West Bank.) has no relevance to the situation in Gaza.

It's all Palestine EAO. The WHO, a far better Global organization then HRW, AI and in my books, the Red Cross, as you use them, cites the obesty rates in Gaza and the West Bank at, 8th and 9th, respectively.

 

[earth_as_one]

As you can see, Gaza and the West Bank are two different places:

 

[CDNBear]

As you can see, Gaza and the West Bank are two different places:

I'm well awar eof that EAO.

So why is it one is prospering and the other isn't?

Why is there an aid crisis in a country about to begin exporting food stuffs?

Do you deny the inconsistency in that logic?

 

[Machjo]

I'm curious. Who are the 6 who voted that Israel has no right to exist as a state? To say that it should retreat back to within its legally recognized borders is one thing. But to say it has not right to exist? On what grounds? Clearly not legal grounds since legally it does have a right to exist.

Religious grounds? yes, I'm well aware of the Bible saying that the Messiah must come first. But who's to say he hasn't? Who's to impose a particular interpretation of the Bible?

Moral grouds? If so, then what moral grounds, and how do you intend to change international laws to reflect your morality?

I'm just surprised that some in fact voted 'no'.

 

[ironsides]

I'm curious. Who are the 6 who voted that Israel has no right to exist as a state? To say that it should retreat back to within its legally recognized borders is one thing. But to say it has not right to exist? On what grounds? Clearly not legal grounds since legally it does have a right to exist.

Religious grounds? yes, I'm well aware of the Bible saying that the Messiah must come first. But who's to say he hasn't? Who's to impose a particular interpretation of the Bible?

Moral grouds? If so, then what moral grounds, and how do you intend to change international laws to reflect your morality?

I'm just surprised that some in fact voted 'no'.

 

[earth_as_one]

The World Health Organization renews a call to allow for the unimpeded access into the Gaza Strip of life-saving medical supplies, including equipment and medicines, as well as more effective movement of people in and out of the territory for medical training and the repair of devices needed to deliver appropriate healthcare.

Hundreds of items of equipment have been waiting to enter Gaza for up to a year, procured by WHO and other organizations, says Mr Tony Laurance, head of WHO's office for Gaza and the West Bank. These items include CT scanners, x-rays, fluoroscopes, infusion pumps, medical sterilization gasses, laboratory equipment, UPS (uninterrupted power supply) batteries, and spare parts for support systems like elevators.

"It is impossible to maintain a safe and effective healthcare system under the conditions of siege that have been in place now since June 2007,"...

http://www.emro.who.int/palestine/reports/advocacy_HR/advocacy/WHO -Press statement-June2010.pdf

According to the World Health Organization:
2. Fifteen of the 27 hospitals were damaged during the three-week assault, and at least 43 primary
health centres were damaged or destroyed (24 were fully or partly closed during the three weeks of
attacks). Al Quds Hospital was heavily damaged, with one ward totally destroyed and other areas
partly destroyed. Five hundred civilians who had sought refuge in the hospital and some 50 patients
had to be evacuated onto the street...
http://apps.who.int/gb/ebwha/pdf_files/A62/A62_24Add1-en.pdf

 

[CDNBear]

II'm just surprised that some in fact voted 'no'.

Really?

Proven Joo haters. Proven supporters of neo Nazi regimes. And you're actually surprised that some of these clowns would deny Israel's right to exist?

The World Health Organization renews a call to allow for the unimpeded access into the Gaza Strip of life-saving medical supplies, including equipment and medicines, as well as more effective movement of people in and out of the territory for medical training and the repair of devices needed to deliver appropriate healthcare.

Hundreds of items of equipment have been waiting to enter Gaza for up to a year, procured by WHO and other organizations, says Mr Tony Laurance, head of WHO's office for Gaza and the West Bank. These items include CT scanners, x-rays, fluoroscopes, infusion pumps, medical sterilization gasses, laboratory equipment, UPS (uninterrupted power supply) batteries, and spare parts for support systems like elevators.

"It is impossible to maintain a safe and effective healthcare system under the conditions of siege that have been in place now since June 2007,"...

http://www.emro.who.int/palestine/reports/advocacy_HR/advocacy/WHO -Press statement-June2010.pdf

According to the World Health Organization:
2. Fifteen of the 27 hospitals were damaged during the three-week assault, and at least 43 primary
health centres were damaged or destroyed (24 were fully or partly closed during the three weeks of
attacks). Al Quds Hospital was heavily damaged, with one ward totally destroyed and other areas
partly destroyed. Five hundred civilians who had sought refuge in the hospital and some 50 patients
had to be evacuated onto the street...
http://apps.who.int/gb/ebwha/pdf_files/A62/A62_24Add1-en.pdf

Yep, and I agree with that call.

But it has nothing to do with the fact that Gaza, a city under siege, supposedly, where malnutrition and starvation is rampant, is about to export food.

How can that be EAO?

Can you answer that in your own words?

 

[CUBert]

You can ignore the fact that Gaza is poised to start exporting crops if you want. But maintaining ignorance in the face of undeniable fact, only proves that you are a Joo hater.

Really? You know what I read do you?
Please cite the post in which I made that claim.

I can provide an article from the Ecomist in 2004, in which WHO stats on obesity are shown, Gaza and the West Bank, ranked 8th and 9th. In fact, since I am nothing like you and your ilk. I can cite the actual study that that info is taken from. In fact, I think I still have the PDF on my puter.

That's called research, you should try it sometime.

What will you provide to counter that?

A "Shut the **** up"?

A wikiality article?

The pics were posted on a Palestinian website. You'll have to take that up with them.


Dude, that coming from you is beyond funny!!!

What's your excuse then?

In your Cuba thread you believed Fidel left his country to get medical attention, you never even specified what country nor did you provide a link backing your claim up. You were proven false.
This is undoubtedly just one of the long list of erroneous claims you've made. Your research doesn't seem to be up to par, :lol:

 

[Just the Facts]

It's all Palestine EAO. The WHO, a far better Global organization then HRW, AI and in my books, the Red Cross, as you use them, cites the obesty rates in Gaza and the West Bank at, 8th and 9th, respectively.

See Bear, what we need to understand is that Israel really really hates the Arabs of Gaza, but the Arabs of the West Bank, they're OK with.

 

[CDNBear]

In your Cuba thread you believed Fidel left his country to get medical attention, you never even specified what country nor did you provide a link backing your claim up. You were proven false.

Not that that has anything to do with the topic at hand, I'll allow the diversion, if only to show how lost you really are.

I concede, I erred in my assertion that he left the country. My memory betrayed me. When in fact, a Doctor was flown in to perform a minor operation on him, because the Cuban health care system is so much better then that of the US's.

This is undoubtedly just one of the long list of erroneous claims you've made.

Prove it. I've punched holes the size of trucks in every thing you've posted.

Regardless of whether or not Castro left Cuba, the end point is the exact same. Thus another giant holes in the stupidity that fills your posts.

Your research doesn't seem to be up to par, :lol:

It's not perfect, but at least I know how to.

See Bear, what we need to understand is that Israel really really hates the Arabs of Gaza, but the Arabs of the West Bank, they're OK with.

They're a more Jewy kinda Arab I guess.

 

[ironsides]

The World Health Organization renews a call to allow for the unimpeded access into the Gaza Strip of life-saving medical supplies, including equipment and medicines, as well as more effective movement of people in and out of the territory for medical training and the repair of devices needed to deliver appropriate healthcare.

Hundreds of items of equipment have been waiting to enter Gaza for up to a year, procured by WHO and other organizations, says Mr Tony Laurance, head of WHO's office for Gaza and the West Bank. These items include CT scanners, x-rays, fluoroscopes, infusion pumps, medical sterilization gasses, laboratory equipment, UPS (uninterrupted power supply) batteries, and spare parts for support systems like elevators.

"It is impossible to maintain a safe and effective healthcare system under the conditions of siege that have been in place now since June 2007,"...

http://www.emro.who.int/palestine/reports/advocacy_HR/advocacy/WHO -Press statement-June2010.pdf

According to the World Health Organization:
2. Fifteen of the 27 hospitals were damaged during the three-week assault, and at least 43 primary
health centres were damaged or destroyed (24 were fully or partly closed during the three weeks of
attacks). Al Quds Hospital was heavily damaged, with one ward totally destroyed and other areas
partly destroyed. Five hundred civilians who had sought refuge in the hospital and some 50 patients
had to be evacuated onto the street...
http://apps.who.int/gb/ebwha/pdf_files/A62/A62_24Add1-en.pdf

The WHO just have to show the Grinch that they like him.

The answer is simple, disarm the Palestinians. Israel will not defy the UN who I am sure will only be to happy to maintain the peace.

 

[CDNBear]

The WHO just have to show the Grinch that they like him.

The answer is simple, disarm the Palestinians. Israel will not defy the UN who I am sure will only be to happy to maintain the peace.

I'd even support an attack on Israel, if they were to breach said peace with a disarmed Palestine.

But then again, I actually support a two State solution, in which the lines are brought back to 67 and made concrete at that point.

 

[selin]

YouTube - Naci en Palestina - Amel Mathlouthi

if the video doesn't touch your feelings, then enjoy the music...

 

[ironsides]

I'd even support an attack on Israel, if they were to breach said peace with a disarmed Palestine.

But then again, I actually support a two State solution, in which the lines are brought back to 67 and made concrete at that point.

You showing that map brought up a good question Gaza and Palestine would be separated. Three State solution?

I'm not against Palestine becoming a state, but they must be disarmed and Jerusalem must be an open city belonging to Israel (Israel will not accept anything less). I know a lot of trust has to be built up by both sides before either side can mention that. We must not forget that just about every piece of land Israel has returned in the past had to be retaken in another war.


The big problem is maintaining a peace with force if need be. The UN sure stepped aside when Egypt crossed the Suez during operation Badr in 1973. I cannot blame anybody for not stopping the 1967 war, there were no serious negotiations going on before it happened.

 

[Just the Facts]

YouTube - Naci en Palestina - Amel Mathlouthi

if the video doesn't touch your feelings, then enjoy the music...

You're preaching to the choir, selin. We're all against war. That's why we keep imploring Hamas, the PLO, and Hezbollah to stop insisting on it with Israel. It's far beyond time to lay down arms and get on with a future for Arabs and Jews of Palestine.

 

[CDNBear]

You showing that map brought up a good question Gaza and Palestine would be separated. Three State solution?

That was EAO's map. No, two. With free passage like between Washington and Alaska.

I'm not against Palestine becoming a state, but they must be disarmed and Jerusalem must be an open city belonging to Israel (Israel will not accept anything less). I know a lot of trust has to be built up by both sides before either side can mention that. We must not forget that just about every piece of land Israel has returned in the past had to be retaken in another war.

I'd be ok with that.

The big problem is maintaining a peace with force if need be. The UN sure stepped aside when Egypt crossed the Suez during operation Badr in 1973.

Yep, just the beginning in a long list of stupid UN moves.

I cannot blame anybody for not stopping the 1967 war, there were no serious negotiations going on before it happened.

True, but if you and all your buddies professed my death, then amassed around my house. I wouldn't wait for the first molotov to fly from the curb.

 

[Machjo]

You showing that map brought up a good question Gaza and Palestine would be separated. Three State solution?

I'm not against Palestine becoming a state, but they must be disarmed and Jerusalem must be an open city belonging to Israel (Israel will not accept anything less). I know a lot of trust has to be built up by both sides before either side can mention that. We must not forget that just about every piece of land Israel has returned in the past had to be retaken in another war.


The big problem is maintaining a peace with force if need be. The UN sure stepped aside when Egypt crossed the Suez during operation Badr in 1973. I cannot blame anybody for not stopping the 1967 war, there were no serious negotiations going on before it happened.

Actually, Jerusalem never belonged fully to either Israel or any Arab state. It was in fact to be under direct UN supervision:

United Nations Partition Plan for Palestine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Seeing that this is the plan to which the state of Israel owes its legal leitimacy, certainly both sides ought to submit to the original plan. However, the Arab states aren't al innocent either. They should have accepted the plan too. No, it's not totally fair, but that is what the international community agreed on and so that's what we should uphold: the original partition plan.

Now seeing that the UK is also very responsible for this mess, the least it could do is also grant citizenship to any Palestinian who wants to immigrate to the UK. After all, there was no Israel until the British decided to establish it.

 

[Goober]

Quote: Originally Posted by CUBert

Israel is a serious problem and detrimental to peace in the middle east.

construct some sort of sci-fi dome structure over the Gaza strip and west bank capable of withstanding the heat of a thousand suns and cleanse the Zionist cockroaches from the face of the earth with nuclear fire


Ok, I don't know what's going on in this post.. Firstly you make up a lie that I want all Jews nuked... Even if I was vehemently anti-jewish , to nuke all jews would be suicide as jews are scattered all over the world... And anyways, i'm not anti-jewish.... then after that erroneous accusation of racism you've bestowed upon me, you actually begin spewing racist rhetoric !!!!!

My Post with no answer as of yet
That makes you
1 - A Racist

2- A NAZI

3- And No morals, no personal character outside of pure unadulterated Racism & Hatred.

So please explain where I am lying -

I also noted that those that hate Israel, EAO for example never raised a word of outrage - Even those that pretend to be even handed, and hate killing, etc and more such BS

Yet if a Poster that is pro Israel - Anti Hamas/Hezbollah based upon their clearly believing are Terror Organizations whose sole goal is the destruction of Israel and all Jews made such a statement or even the forcible removal of Hamas from Gaza prisons why we would be genocidal murderous freaks and part of the Jewish Controlled Media, as EAO stated - Why people would be all over that poster like stink on a fart.

So the post about Nuking Israel- Can you explain that one. I have asked yet you scurry away.

 

[gerryh]

I figured that, hence why it was tripe.

You can troll so much better then that. You let yourself go dude.

I wasn't trolling. This thread is a troll. Stupid question asked for the sole purpose of trolling for the anti-Israeli and anti-american camps. Isreal has been a recognised state since 1947, therefore it is a moot point as to whether or not there are some that feel that it doesn't have a "right" to exist.