Shame on Canada! re: Propaganda and Canada's Support of Ethnic Cleansing.

[Logic 7]

Welcome back, Logic 7....I missed you.

Comic relief is so hard to come by in these Jew hater threads......

Taking palestians side is considered as jewish haters, is it surprising coming from a religious zealot like you are?

 

[Logic 7]

There are not millions who can not go home, only 800,000 left.

3.4 millions can't go back to Palestine since 1948, get your facts straight, mr magoo.

There were more Jews than that forced to leave Arab lands.......

If you read above, you'd know that, Dear.

You can read, can't you????

Of course, read what you just write, ARAB LANDS, not jewish land.

 

[Colpy]

Taking palestians side is considered as jewish haters, is it surprising coming from a religious zealot like you are?

No, when someone blames Jews for things they are obviously not responsible for - like the victory of the "no" side in the 1995 referendum - I conclude that they are either a) a Jew hater b) an idiot c) delusional psychotic or d) all of the above.

Your case is clearly a d).

 

[Logic 7]

No, when someone blames Jews for things they are obviously not responsible for - like the victory of the "no" side in the 1995 referendum - I conclude that they are either a) a Jew hater b) an idiot c) delusional psychotic or d) all of the above.

Your case is clearly a d).

You are a pretentious retarded, i said parizeau was right about the jews, who come in our land, doesnt learn our language, and doesnt learn our culture, but i never said it was their fault.


You are the kind of guy who carbonate from anti-semitism,however you didnt choose the right one.

 

[Colpy]

You are a pretentious retarded, i said parizeau was right about the jews, who come in our land, doesnt learn our language, and doesnt learn our culture, but i never said it was their fault.


You are the kind of guy who carbonate from anti-semitism,however you didnt choose the right one.

Thank you Logic!

That's the funniest thing I've read in weeks.

I'll try not to "carbonate from anti-semitism" any more.:lol::lol::lol::lol:

LOL Literally.

Hilarious!

 

[tracy]

Oh you mean like Israel--NEVER FORGET, Tracy?
????

There is a HUUUUUUUGGGGEEEE difference between never forgetting and not moving on. Israelis have moved on from the Holocaust, while they continue to remember. I don't see them trying to kill Germans out of revenge. Maybe it just didn't make the news, but when was the last time a Jew blew himself and a bunch of Germans up at a market or bus stop in Berlin? I went to Germany several times in the late 90s and it seemed very peaceful to me. Nice people, clean streets, great architecture, good food... no one seemed all that worried about a Jewish terrorist attack.

Even in my own personal life, I don't believe in hanging on to bitterness. It doesn't mean I forget hurtful things that have happened to me, it means I don't let them continue to control me.

 

[Logic 7]

Thank you Logic!

That's the funniest thing I've read in weeks.

I'll try not to "carbonate from anti-semitism" any more.:lol::lol::lol::lol:

LOL Literally.

Hilarious!

At least i make you laugh.:roll:

 

[EagleSmack]

I'll try not to "carbonate from anti-semitism" any more.:lol::lol::lol::lol:

Are you sure are willing to not charge or inject CO2 gas from anti-semitism now Colpy?

I do not think you are ready. It's a big step you know. :smile:

 

[Zzarchov]

So no one is able to explain why Israel has funded hamas in the firs place, why is that?


No one has heard the answer in the news????

They didn't, and thats so ignorant it makes my eyes bleed.

Hamas is a faction of the Muslim Brotherhood, the most powerful transnational Muslim Political Movement in the world.

It predates Israel by a good 20 years and has far more money at its disposal.


I suppose Israel had a time machine to go back and fund this group though. Seems like a waste of a Delorian though.

 

[earth_as_one]

EAO, please stop trying to read more into my posts than I actually wrote. "Screaming" simply means screaming. It doesn't have a negative value attached to it. It's like talking, only it's louder.

By your own clipped post, almost 9/10ths of the current refugees have never lived in Israel. So, why don't the places where they are born take more responsibility for them? You can demand all you want from Israel. Israel is never going to let 6.5 million Palestinians immigrate. It would amount to their country ceasing to exist. Whether that's fair or not isn't my point. I don't think it's fair, btw. It is simply the reality. That's why other countries should be stepping up. You can wait forever for Israel to allow them back. You might as well wait for pigs to fly. Time would be better spent improving their lot wherever they are or allowing them to move elsewhere.

IMO, the whole problem with the Middle East is people can't give up grudges and move on.

The answer to your questions were in Al Jazeera's FAQ regarding Palestinian refugees, I posted previously
Palestinian Refugees, Frequently Asked Questions

Technically Palestinians are recognized as a displaced "people", not displaced individuals. They are a unique situation, because:

1) UN resolutions specific to this issue

2) Israel's failure to respect international law

3) the UN's failure to impose sanctions on Israel for violating international law and ignoring UN resolutions

As a result, the UN has created and prolonged the Palestinian refugee situation.

I can't think of another situation where the UN was so directly responsible for creating a refugee problem.

Because the UN has a unique responsibility for the Palestinian refugee problem, they reaffirm annually the right of the Palestinian people to return home.
A/RES/3236 (XXIX) of 22 November 1974

"Right of Return" isn't an unknown concept to Israel. Israel already recognizes this right of a "people" to "return home". They just apply it to Jews and extend it to include Jews who may or may not have emigrated from this area hundreds of generations ago. Israel could extend this Jewish right to include non-Jews of only a few generations.

Another aspect is UN recognition of Israel. That recognition was conditional on Israel allowing Palestinians the right of return or compensation.
United Nations General Assembly Resolution 194 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Right of return is also about Israel upholding its conditions for UN recognition. If Israel chooses not to meet the conditions required for their UN recognition, they should withdraw from the UN.

 

[earth_as_one]

There is a HUUUUUUUGGGGEEEE difference between never forgetting and not moving on. Israelis have moved on from the Holocaust, while they continue to remember. I don't see them trying to kill Germans out of revenge. Maybe it just didn't make the news, but when was the last time a Jew blew himself and a bunch of Germans up at a market or bus stop in Berlin? I went to Germany several times in the late 90s and it seemed very peaceful to me. Nice people, clean streets, great architecture, good food... no one seemed all that worried about a Jewish terrorist attack.

Even in my own personal life, I don't believe in hanging on to bitterness. It doesn't mean I forget hurtful things that have happened to me, it means I don't let them continue to control me.

The justification for the existance of Israel as a Jewish state is the holocaust. If they became secular, then non-Jews could immigrate to Israel and the entire Palestinian refugee problem would be solved. As a result of not moving on, Israel continues to oppress and imprison millions of Palestinians.

 

[tracy]

I read that EAO. But you seem to be missing my point. You can demand all you want from Israel. They are not going to let 6.5 million Arab muslims immigrate. Period. The rightness or wrongness isn't the point. It would mean their country would cease to exist and they aren't going to let that happen, at least not peacefully. So the only solutions available are war or moving on. One would lead to more suffering and one could lead to prosperity.

 

[tracy]

The justification for the existance of Israel as a Jewish state is the holocaust. If they became secular, then non-Jews could immigrate to Israel and the entire Palestinian refugee problem would be solved. As a result of not moving on, Israel continues to oppress and imprison millions of Palestinians.

You ignore the clear difference between the Israelis and the Palestinians. Why is that? Jews who were abused during the Holocaust aren't trying to get back at Germany anymore. They aren't bombing them. They chose to create their own country instead. The Palestinians have the same options available to them. Many of them have chosen differently and look at what they've achieved.

 

[earth_as_one]

I read that EAO. But you seem to be missing my point. You can demand all you want from Israel. They are not going to let 6.5 million Arab muslims immigrate. Period. The rightness or wrongness isn't the point. It would mean their country would cease to exist and they aren't going to let that happen, at least not peacefully. So the only solutions available are war or moving on. One would lead to more suffering and one could lead to prosperity.

Another solution would be fair compensation and immigration to third countries. I'm sure many Palestinians just want a life, but because no country will accept them, they can't leave.

Either way, they are a product of ethnic cleansing and Israel should not be rewarded for committing war crimes and crimes against humanity.

If all the money Israel and the US spent imprisoning and killing Palestinians was instead spent on paying countries to accept these people as refugees, I'm sure the problem could have been solved a long time ago.

 

[earth_as_one]

You ignore the clear difference between the Israelis and the Palestinians. Why is that? Jews who were abused during the Holocaust aren't trying to get back at Germany anymore. They aren't bombing them. They chose to create their own country instead. The Palestinians have the same options available to them. Many of them have chosen differently and look at what they've achieved.

Yes look at what they've achieved. 4.5 million nationless refugees who suffer injustice and oppression. A war machine which is at constant war with its neighbors. A nation completely dependant on billions in annual foreign military and economic aid to survive and maintain its standard of living. I would not be proud.

Do Palestinians have the same options as European Jews? Where can they flee? They are stuck in refugee camps and no country will accept them.

Maybe I'm not understanding you. Are you saying Palestinians should immigrate to the holylands like the European Jews did and ethnically cleanse the land of its inhabitants? I don't see that leading to peace.

Or are you saying Palestinians should immigrate and ethnically cleanse another country like the Jewish refugees did? Maybe Albania for example? How would that solve the problem?

 

[tracy]

I'm saying they should go or stay wherever they can or want to be. Life isn't perfect. It isn't fair. That's reality. Most of them have never even lived in Israel. The fact that 2-3 generations have lived in refugee camps is insane. Should Israel have to kick in money to help resettle them? I'd say yes. But even if they don't, that's not the end all and be all of things. Sometimes life just sucks and you have to make a decision on how to move forward. Almost anything would be better than what they have now. I can't believe that the rest of the world is powerless to help these people. The complaints towards Israel are often justified, but they also provide the rest of the world with a nice distraction from the fact that they've mostly done NOTHING.

 

[tracy]

Yes look at what they've achieved. 4/quote]

I was talking about the Palestinians, not the Israelis. Honestly, I don't think I've ever had someone misinterpret my posts more than you:lol:

 

[Logic 7]

They didn't, and thats so ignorant it makes my eyes bleed.

Hamas is a faction of the Muslim Brotherhood, the most powerful transnational Muslim Political Movement in the world.

It predates Israel by a good 20 years and has far more money at its disposal.


I suppose Israel had a time machine to go back and fund this group though. Seems like a waste of a Delorian though.

You are a retarded moron or what???

According to
several current and former U.S. intelligence officials, beginning in the
late 1970s, Tel Aviv gave direct and indirect financial aid to Hamas over a
period of years.

Israel "aided Hamas directly -- the Israelis wanted to use it as a
counterbalance to the PLO (Palestinian Liberation Organization)," said Tony
Cordesman, Middle East analyst for the Center for Strategic Studies.

Israel's support for Hamas "was a direct attempt to divide and dilute
support for a strong, secular PLO by using a competing religious
alternative," said a former senior CIA official.

ISRAEL FUNDED HAMAS.

 

[ironsides]

Quote:
"According to several current and former U.S. intelligence officials, beginning in the late 1970s, Tel Aviv gave direct and indirect financial aid to Hamas over a
period of years."


1981987 — The establishment of Hamas
The acronym "Hamas" first appeared in 1987 in a leaflet that accused the Israeli intelligence services of undermining the moral fiber of Palestinian youth as part of Mossad's recruitment of what Hamas termed "collaborators".


Nothing you say even has a ring of truth. :roll:

 

[Colpy]

Congrats, Logic 7, that is a VERY interesting piece.


By far the most valuable post you've made here.

Thanks.

I hope I can be forgiven for posting part of it here.....

ISRAEL FUNDED HAMAS



Analysis: Hamas history tied to Israel
By Richard Sale
UPI Terrorism Correspondent

From the International Desk, June 2002

​

...............Israel and Hamas may currently be locked in deadly combat, but, according to several current and former U.S. intelligence officials, beginning in the late 1970s, Tel Aviv gave direct and indirect financial aid to Hamas over a period of years.

Israel "aided Hamas directly -- the Israelis wanted to use it as a
counterbalance to the PLO (Palestinian Liberation Organization)," said Tony Cordesman, Middle East analyst for the Center for Strategic Studies.

Israel's support for Hamas "was a direct attempt to divide and dilute
support for a strong, secular PLO by using a competing religious
alternative," said a former senior CIA official.

According to documents United Press International obtained from the Israel-based Institute for Counter Terrorism, Hamas evolved from cells of the Muslim Brotherhood, founded in Egypt in 1928. Islamic movements in Israel and Palestine were "weak and dormant" until after the 1967 Six Day War in which Israel scored a stunning victory over its Arab enemies.

After 1967, a great part of the success of the Hamas/Muslim Brotherhood was due to their activities among the refugees of the Gaza Strip. The cornerstone of the Islamic movements success was an impressive social, religious, educational and cultural infrastructure, called Da'wah, that worked to ease the hardship of large numbers of Palestinian refugees, confined to camps, and many who were living on the edge.

"Social influence grew into political influence," first in the Gaza Strip, then on the West Bank, said an administration official who spoke on
condition of anonymity.According to ICT papers, Hamas was legally registered in Israel in 1978 by Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, the movement's spiritual leader, as an Islamic Association by the name Al-Mujamma al Islami, which widened its base of supporters and sympathizers by religious propaganda and social work.

According to U.S. administration officials, funds for the movement came from the oil-producing states and directly and indirectly from Israel. The PLO was secular and leftist and promoted Palestinian nationalism. Hamas wanted to set up a transnational state under the rule of Islam, much like Khomeini's Iran.

What took Israeli leaders by surprise was the way the Islamic movements began to surge after the Iranian revolution, after armed resistance to Israel sprang up in southern Lebanon vis-?-vis the Hezbollah, backed by Iran, these sources said.

"Nothing provides the energy for imitation as much as success," commented one administration expert.

A further factor of Hamas' growth was the fact the PLO moved its base of operations to Beirut in the '80s, leaving the Islamic organization to grow in influence in the Occupied Territories "as the court of last resort," he said.

When the intifada began, Israeli leadership was surprised when Islamic groups began to surge in membership and strength. Hamas immediately grew in numbers and violence. The group had always embraced the doctrine of armed struggle, but the doctrine had not been practiced and Islamic groups had not been subjected to suppression the way groups like Fatah had been, according
to U.S. government officials.

But with the triumph of the Khomeini revolution in Iran, with the birth of Iranian-backed Hezbollah terrorism in Lebanon, Hamas began to gain in strength in Gaza and then in the West Bank, relying on terror to resist the Israeli occupation.

Israel was certainly funding the group at that time. One U.S. intelligence source who asked not to be named said that not only was Hamas being funded as a "counterweight" to the PLO, Israeli aid had another purpose: "To help identify and channel towards Israeli agents Hamas members who were dangerous terrorists."

In addition, by infiltrating Hamas, Israeli informers could only listen to debates on policy and identify Hamas members who "were dangerous
hard-liners," the official said. In the end, as Hamas set up a very comprehensive counterintelligence system, many collaborators with Israel were weeded out and shot. Violent acts of terrorism became the central tenet, and Hamas, unlike the PLO, was unwilling
to compromise in any way with Israel, refusing to acquiesce in its very existence..............
​

Please note the areas I emphasized by Italics......

It sounds like Israel funded social programs for Palestinians through a Islamic religious organization ...........and yes, their intelligence (?) people thought they had it thoroughly penetrated to identify dangerous extremists.

So, qa move that helped the Palestinian people because Israel had some trust, and some hope in a Muslim religious group as a counter-balance to the terrorists of Fatah.......

It seems to me their biggest sin was trusting an Islamic organization........says bad things about Hamas (who accepted Israel's money), and good things about Israel (who gave money for social work in the occupied territories).