Wal-Mart Is Facing Latest Salvo From Union

[captain morgan]

They are pretty handy at creating their own work using pension capital. It has saved many a plant closure that would have otherwise decimated a town or small city. If you look into what CPP is investing and what Unions are investing in and it is very much parallel.

Great.. Then if the unions are so all-seeing, why on Earth would they want the corp entity investing pension dollars on their behalf? On that note, take a moment and compare what the private sector invests on a daily basis via the public markets or through private investment.

The bottom line is that unions can not exist with out private capital to fuel the core business.

Did you get a chance to review some of the investments Unions have made into urban development. How many Union pension funds are invested in the very things that are keeping the economy going?

Sure, and that's great.. That said, what kind of cash is the union paying to their long-standing members that have retired?.. Based on the last go-around, the CAW/UAW had over a billion in cash to keep GM afloat... Where did that money come from to begin with and why wasn't it redistributed to the union members?

All company shareholders are union and management pension funds, representing Canadian workers. They are the strength behind Concert's success and take great pride in our achievements.

Some of the company shareholders are union... But that takes us back to an earlier question; What is this union investment fund doing for its members?... I'm guessing that it is simply a capital fund to line the pockets of the organizers.

Pension plans that invest in Concert are:

• Boilermakers' Pension Trust Fund
• Bricklayers and Masons Pension Plan
• Carpentry Workers' Pension Plan of B.C.
• Ceramic Tile Workers' Pension Plan
• Local 213 Electrical Workers Pension Plan
• Floorlayers' Industry Pension Plan
• Heat & Frost Local 118 Union Pension Plan
• IWA - Forest Industry Pension Plan
• B.C. Labourers' Pension Plan
• Marine and Shipbuilders Local 506 Pension Plan
• Operating Engineers' Pension Plan
• Piledrivers, Divers, Bridge, Dock & Wharf Builders Pension Plan
• The Plumbers Union Local 170 Pension Plan
• The Pulp and Paper Industry Pension Plan
• Shopworkers Industrial Union Local 1928 Pension Plan
• Teamsters (Local 213) Pension Plan
• Teamsters Canadian Pension Plan
• Telecommunication Workers Pension Plan

Care to list the privately funded investment funds that spur the economy?

That's ****ing hillarious! Unions are all over the planet. Majority of investment has been coming from European UNION.

The EU is an example of a trade union in your eyes?

Talk about f*cking hilarious.

Wages were never an issue. They bascially got a handful of peanuts which barely covers inflation and that was fine by them.

Wages in addition with benefits plans have made North American unions obsolete.. There is no way that N.American labour can compete with Asian labour.

Labour cost have never been a issue. Like I asked out of $500k how much was labour and materials for New Holland? I paid shipping and dealer set-up costs ontop of the purchase price as well. What are their profits per unit @ a cost of $250K

Get a hold of their balance sheet and you can tell me.

Really. Guess what sunshine. Harper, the US and Mexico are working out deals for labour mobility. If you have your Red Seal and are a Yank. Canada awaits. Harper is a Socialist because NAU is going to be Socialist.

An NAU, if it actually happens will force the uncompetitive unions to be competitive in the market. As it stands, N.American unions rely on tariffs and protectionist policy just to exist in the global market.

 

[petros]

Wages in addition with benefits plans have made North American unions
obsolete.. There is no way that N.American labour can compete with Asian
labour.

Did you notice the overwhelming increase in their export prices when China introduced a minimum wage? Why are our streets flooded with Japanese and Korean Union made cars, electronics, clothings etc etc etc?

An NAU, if it actually happens will force the uncompetitive unions to be competitive in the market. As it stands, N.American unions rely on tariffs and protectionist policy just to exist in the global market.

IF? IF?

Am I the only guy who reads the news instead of just argueing left/right and missing the point?

Leaked U.S. cable lays out North American ?integration? strategy | News | National Post

Maybe I'll run for the prairie region and sit as the NAMP in Denver. What do you think?

 

[captain morgan]

Did you notice the overwhelming increase in their export prices when China introduced a minimum wage? Why are our streets flooded with Japanese and Korean Union made cars, electronics, clothings etc etc etc?

... And?

It is still cheaper. In fact, both the US and Canadian gvts have recently slapped import duties on drill pipe in excess of 400% on pipe that comes in from Asia. Considering that the commodity price is the same for all and the Chinese mfgrs have to incorporate transportation into their equation, where do you think that the difference in price is rooted.

IF? IF?

Is it a fact yet or are "leaked wiki cables" proof of such?

 

[petros]

... And?

It is still cheaper. In fact, both the US and Canadian gvts have recently slapped import duties on drill pipe in excess of 400% on pipe that comes in from Asia. Considering that the commodity price is the same for all and the Chinese mfgrs have to incorporate transportation into their equation, where do you think that the difference in price is rooted.



Is it a fact yet or are "leaked wiki cables" proof of such?

If the empty lot across the street has a guy come by and dig a hole, then a crew shows up to lay piping and then a forming crew shows and then trucks drop off a few lifts of studs, sheeting and floor joists what do you think they might be doing across the street?

Do you need to read a blueprint to know what they are doing?

 

[captain morgan]

And exactly how does this justify the fed gvts need to apply a 400% duty on Chinese drill pipe?

 

[petros]

And exactly how does this justify the fed gvts need to apply a 400% duty on Chinese drill pipe?

It's called a trade war. You haven't realized we are in the middle of one right now? Why do you think we've been blowing flying Chinese built oil projects to bits in Libya?

Where did all the steel go from the "Cash for Clunker" program? It's now your drill pipe.

If the empty lot across the street has a guy come by and dig a hole, then a crew shows up to lay piping and then a forming crew shows and then trucks drop off a few lifts of studs, sheeting and floor joists what do you think they might be doing across the street?

Do you need to read a blueprint to know what they are doing?

Well? What do you think they are building across the street? Pianos?

 

[captain morgan]

It's called a trade war. You haven't realized we are in the middle of one right now? Why do you think we've been blowing flying Chinese built oil projects to bits in Libya?

... Or, the other option is that the respective federal gvts want to earn a couple of points with the unions by quadrupling the price of foreign goods in order to float the inefficient and costly union base.

Where did all the steel go from the "Cash for Clunker" program? It's now your drill pipe.

And even with the cost of the raw materials being next to nothing (thanks cash-for-clunkers), the US Steel makers still can't compete... I wonder why?

 

[petros]

... Or, the other option is that the respective federal gvts want to earn a couple of points with the unions by quadrupling the price of foreign goods in order to float the inefficient and costly union base.





And even with the cost of the raw materials being next to nothing (thanks cash-for-clunkers), the US Steel makers still can't compete... I wonder why?

Well here is a great example why.

The United States Steel Corporation (NYSE: X), more commonly known as U.S. Steel, is an integrated steel producer with major production operations in the United States, Canada, and Central Europe. The company is the world's tenth largest steel producer ranked by sales (see list of steel producers). It was renamed USX Corporation in 1991 and back to United States Steel Corporation in 2001 when the shareholders of USX spun off its steel-making assets following the acquisition of Marathon Oil in 1982. It is still the largest domestically owned integrated steel producer in the United States, although it produces only slightly more steel than it did in 1902.[2]

The Bethlehem Steel Corporation (1857–2003), based in Bethlehem, Pennsylvania, was once the second-largest steel producer in the United States, after Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania-based U.S. Steel. After a decline in the U.S. steel industry and management problems leading to the company's 2001 bankruptcy, the company was dissolved and the remaining assets sold to International Steel Group in 2003. In 2005, ISG merged with Mittal Steel, ending U.S. ownership of the assets of Bethlehem Steel.

Bethlehem Steel was also one of the largest shipbuilding companies in the world and one of the most powerful symbols of American industrial manufacturing leadership. Bethlehem Steel's demise is often cited as one of the most prominent examples of the U.S. economy's shift away from industrial manufacturing, its inability to compete with cheap foreign labor, and its traits of business management that value short-term benefit over long-term strategy.

The site of the company's former main plant, in Bethlehem, PA, is now home to an arts and entertainment district called SteelStacks. The plant's 5 blast furnaces have been left standing and serve as the back drop for this new campus. The site currently features a contemporary performing arts center, called the ArtsQuest Center, at the west end and the Sands Casino Resort Bethlehem, to the east of the site. Future attractions include a free music pavilion, Levitt Pavilion SteelStacks.



ArcelorMittal the world's largest steel producer is a Union shop in Luxembourg and you are trying to say labour is cheaper in Europe? Go ****ing figure! Their South Korean plant...UNION...Japan? UNION...South America? UNION

Looks like **** happens when Europeans buy out your steel industry and shut it down. IPSCO is now Euro owned Evraz and they are making a killing on carbon credits because it is 100% recycled materials and NAU pipelines. Steel Workers UNION make it makes OODLES of money.

How can a giant like Hyundai be UNION and be as big as they are?

 

[captain morgan]

I don't see the argument you are making.

The decisions made by US Steel and Bethelem identify the labor component as being an issue and that goes straight to the heart of teh argument that I am making... It is the cost and quality of labor that have impacted both companies.

As far as ArcelorMittal is concerned, their website suggests that the HO is in Luxembourg and I saw no reference to mfg operations that were highlighted in that nation.. You can get an idea about the company philosophy here: ArcelorMittal Cuts Costs All The Way To Mongolia - Great Speculations - Buys, holds, and hopes - Forbes

In terms of companies shutting down operations, did you ever wonder why they'd do that?

 

[petros]

I don't see the argument you are making.

The decisions made by US Steel and Bethelem identify the labor component as being an issue and that goes straight to the heart of teh argument that I am making... It is the cost and quality of labor that have impacted both companies.

As far as ArcelorMittal is concerned, their website suggests that the HO is in Luxembourg and I saw no reference to mfg operations that were highlighted in that nation.. You can get an idea about the company philosophy here: ArcelorMittal Cuts Costs All The Way To Mongolia - Great Speculations - Buys, holds, and hopes - Forbes

In terms of companies shutting down operations, did you ever wonder why they'd do that?

ArcelorMittal: Unions praised by industrialist
Lakshmi Mittal, owner of ArcelorMittal, praises flexible role of unions in responding to the global financial crisis.

CHINA: Lakshmi Mittal, owner of the steel giant ArcelorMittal, used the annual conference of the World Steel Association held on October 12 in Beijing, to praise trade unions for the part they had played in helping the company adapt to the recent global economic crisis.

Mr Mittal took the opportunity to thank steel employees, customers, shareholders and governments for the "flexibility and patience they have shown in enabling us to find solutions to surmount the crisis". Adding, "In particular the unions: who have realized the importance of flexibility to help chart a way through these difficult waters."

"This difficult year has served to demonstrate that the steel industry is now able to absorb some very large shocks. The situation would no doubt have been considerably worse had the industry not significantly restructured over the past decade," Mr Mittal said.

IMF general secretary Jyrki Raina met with Mr Mittal and General Management Board members of the company in September to discuss areas of strategic concern for steelworkers, such as climate change, trade policy and sustainability. Raina commented that, "It does not surprise me that the unions have been recognised in this way, the same could be said by many companies it's just that Mr Mittal is bold enough to say it, that's what sets this company apart."

In June 2008, IMF and ArcelorMittal signed a global agreement to improve health and standards throughout the company. Since then a joint company and union global committee on health and safety meets regularly to find ways for improvement at all sites around the world. The IMF is also continuing to negotiate with the company to look at expanding the agreement into an international framework agreement.Oct 20, 2009 – Rob Johnston

 

[captain morgan]

ArcelorMittal: Unions praised by industrialist
Lakshmi Mittal, owner of ArcelorMittal, praises flexible role of unions in responding to the global financial crisis.

I highlighted the key word for you. I also imagine that the dynamic that forced the union's hand was the same that caused the UIAW/CAW to invest over a billion into the company that they helped destroy.

On that note, this press release does nothing in explaining why US Steel sold out and Bethelem Steel went titters.

 

[petros]

You're clutching at straws.

Do you want that translated?

Flexible in ways like Hey...can I borrow some of your pension money while I set up a Global Steel Union since I'm the largest employer and together we can expand and grow together?"

Welcome to Global Socialism and LEVELLING.

And here is why the EU is able to pull the carpet from underneath Nor Am producers. They've got another market to play with for serious capital.

ArcelorMittal, Lafarge Have Biggest CO2 Surpluses, Sandbag Says

By Ewa Krukowska - Jun 20, 2011 5:33 AM CTMon Jun 20 11:33:42 GMT 2011

ArcelorMittal (MT), the world’s largest steelmaker, has a carbon-permit surplus worth about 1.7 billion euros ($2.4 billion), the largest excess in the European Union’s emissions trading system, environmental lobby Sandbag said.

ArcelorMittal holds around 97.2 million excess allowances from the period from 2008 to 2010, which can be used in the years ahead, Sandbag said in an e-mailed statement. Paris-basedLafarge SA (LG), the world’s biggest cement producer, ranks second with a surplus of 29.4 million permits, valued at about 501 million euros, according to Sandbag.

The 10 companies with the biggest excesses of allowances,“all of them steel and cement companies, share between them surplus carbon permits of 240 million tons, more than the annual carbon emissions of Austria, Denmark, Portugal and Latvia combined,” Sandbag said.

The EU emissions-trading system, the cornerstone of the region’s climate plan, imposes pollution limits on more than 11,000 utilities and manufacturers. Emitters that produce less carbon than their quota can sell surplus allowances. Those that exceed their limits can buy permits in the carbon market.

“This huge oversupply of permits is threatening to undermine the Emissions Trading Scheme,” Sandbag said.
While a growing number of businesses are calling on the European Union to adopt a stricter carbon-reduction goal, a few energy-intensive industries oppose this, according to Sandbag. The trade associations that the companies with the biggest surplus of permits belong to “are some of the most vociferous opponents to progress,” the environmental group said.

The group of 10 holders of the biggest surplus of permits also includes Tata Steel, ThyssenKrupp, Riva Group, Cemex, Holcim, Heidelberg Cement, Italcementi and Salzgitter, according to Sandbag.

To contact the reporter on this story: Ewa Krukowska in Brussels at ekrukowska@bloomberg.net

Nice....ArcelorMittal just gave a 6 year 45% wage jump to miners and processors in PQ.

Steelworkers Achieve Exemplary Labour Pact with ArcelorMittal in Québec

Some 2,000 iron ore miners and pellet-plant workers in northern Québec, members of four United Steelworkers (USW) locals, came to excellent wage, pension, and work terms with ArcelorMittal Mines Canada.

The six-year agreement, ratified by 75% of union members on 3 April, came after arduous bargaining dating to last November. A prior labour agreement in Québec between the USW and the world’s largest steelmaker expired in February.

The contract will give hard-rock miners and processing-plant workers a 45% pay increase over the six years, inclusive of enhanced bonuses and hefty improvements to the yearly cost-of-living adjustment. The hourly wage increase will average 4.1% per year, and 25.6% over the six years.


My goodness. How can they afford to do that?

 

[captain morgan]

You can post all of the supporting documentation you like, it still doesn't answer the question why NA mfgrs can't compete with overseas.

Relative economies go only so far, it boils-down to the cost of doing business in jurisdiction A vs B... If we can agree that teh commodities prices are equal to all participants, then there are only a couple of other components that matter.

 

[petros]

There are still North American owned manufacturers? I thought you said they all went else where to get away from unions that just happen to be world wide?

Ever think it's management?

 

[captain morgan]

There are still North American owned manufacturers? I thought you said they all went else where to get away from unions that just happen to be world wide?

Nope... You are saying that.

I am saying that the NA union labor can not compete on a cost basis with overseas labor... Further, I am also saying that the NA unions absolutely require gvt protection to shelter them from this issue.

Ever think it's management?

Sure it involves management, but you can change management a hell of a lot faster than trying to get a Titanic like a union turned around.

 

[TenPenny]

Sure it involves management, but you can change management a hell of a lot faster than trying to get a Titanic like a union turned around.

Like how GM's management has changed direction?

 

[petros]

Nope... You are saying that.

I am saying that the NA union labor can not compete on a cost basis with overseas labor... Further, I am also saying that the NA unions absolutely require gvt protection to shelter them from this issue.




Sure it involves management, but you can change management a hell of a lot faster than trying to get a Titanic like a union turned around.

Labour and materials always has and always will be be **** all in the cost of a product. If China didn't undervalue it's currency by 400% you wouldn't have to pay 400% tarriffs would you? It's not labour undervalueing their currency is it? Is it labour overinflating ours?

Government protection? Like what? 400% Tarriffs so a product is fairly market valued regardless where you buy from?

Take GM for example. Did labour make the products too expensive or did GMAC bet the company wad on magic beans?

Did Fiat take the Chrysler bail-out money from you and me to improve production in Nor Am and save jobs did they take the money and open the Tata plant in India and the Chery plant in China?

Isn't it nice Harpo Marx can use taxpayer money to help Europeans build and sell cars in India and China?

 

[captain morgan]

Labour and materials always has and always will be be **** all in the cost of a product. If China didn't undervalue it's currency by 400% you wouldn't have to pay 400% tarriffs would you? It's not labour undervalueing their currency is it? Is it labour overinflating ours?

Sorry, but claiming a currency differential still doesn't change the facts.

Government protection? Like what? 400% Tarriffs so a product is fairly market valued regardless where you buy from?

What a hoot.. Fair Market Value is determined by the Cdn and US feds?

Those tariffs are in place to preserve over-priced union labor. End of story.

Take GM for example. Did labour make the products too expensive or did GMAC bet the company wad on magic beans?

The labor component coupled with the benefits package made it uncompetitive.

 

[petros]

B U L L S H I T !!! GMAC was offering credit cards, credit lines and $5000 cash back bull**** and lost big time.

Their product went to **** due to lack of R&D reinvestment.

An under valued currency means nothing? If that stopped there wouldn't be a tarriff.

A basic 600ft hi-rise apartment in downtown Shanghai is $40K What does a basic hi-rise apartment sell for in Calgary? $160K?

 

[captain morgan]

B U L L S H I T !!! GMAC was offering credit cards, credit lines and $5000 cash back bull**** and lost big time.

So, it's GMAC's fault then, is it?

Hell, there is a lot of support that the credit branch of GM was a big money-maker for a lot of years that would have more than compensated for any defaults associated with the most recent turn down... Hell, why do you think that the banks all want your credit business or why Visa/MC are still making money hand over fist?

But, getting back to the issue, the labor cost of GM producing a car in NA was far too expensive.. South Korea can produce a vehicle that is 1/2 the cost, pay through the nose to have it shipped, sell it for less in NA and still make money.

You tell me why this can happen.