Where to get money to fix problems on reserves?

[Machjo]

I'm happy the government is finally starting to deal with the problem of First Nations having access economic justice. However, unless we find a stable source of revenue for this extra funding, we'll be right back at square twenty years from now when some future government has to cut funding to them owing to lack of government revenue and pressure to balance the debt again.

So, what are we prepared to sacrifice to make this funding sustainable in the long run?

Personally, I'd say revise official language policy. I'm sure that keeps alot of indigenous Canadians from accessing government jobs too anyway.

I might be willing to pay more in taxes as long as I know the money is spent wisely... hmmm...

Anyway, here's for starters. Any other ideas?

 

[The Old Medic]

They get the money from all of the natural resources that the government has stolen from the reserves.

 

[lone wolf]

...as if Government ever steals

 

[PoliticalNick]

I'm betting that if all the natives paid their taxes like the rest of us there would be plenty of extra cash to fund these farcical programs and a few more.

 

[lone wolf]

Not likely.... MPs would vote themselves raises and reverse any cuts to their pensions

 

[JLM]

I'm happy the government is finally starting to deal with the problem of First Nations having access economic justice. However, unless we find a stable source of revenue for this extra funding, we'll be right back at square twenty years from now when some future government has to cut funding to them owing to lack of government revenue and pressure to balance the debt again.

So, what are we prepared to sacrifice to make this funding sustainable in the long run?

Personally, I'd say revise official language policy. I'm sure that keeps alot of indigenous Canadians from accessing government jobs too anyway.

I might be willing to pay more in taxes as long as I know the money is spent wisely... hmmm...

Anyway, here's for starters. Any other ideas?

Money is the secondary problem, I.M.H.O. More education is what is needed and that can be obtained formally or through the "school of hard knocks". We have to get away from the concept of "we fixing other people's problems", we should be "there" to give guidance or render help when absolutey necessary, but perhaps some members of the first nations community need more incentive to "take the bull by the horns" themselves. There is a wealth of brain power and muscle there!

I'm betting that if all the natives paid their taxes like the rest of us there would be plenty of extra cash to fund these farcical programs and a few more.

That might happen Nick, AFTER ALL the white people paid their taxes like they are supposed to! (Damn, there's another dangling preposition, doing that a lot lately) -

I'm betting that if all the natives paid their taxes like the rest of us there would be plenty of extra cash to fund these farcical programs and a few more.

That might happen Nick, AFTER ALL the white people pay their taxes like they are supposed to! (Damn, there's another dangling preposition, doing that a lot lately) -

Money is the secondary problem, I.M.H.O. More education is what is needed and that can be obtained formally or through the "school of hard knocks". We have to get away from the concept of "we fixing other people's problems", we should be "there" to give guidance or render help when absolutey necessary, but perhaps some members of the first nations community need more incentive to "take the bull by the horns" themselves. There is a wealth of brain power and muscle there!






That might happen Nick, AFTER ALL the white people pay their taxes like they are supposed to! (Damn, there's another dangling preposition, doing that a lot lately) -

****

 

[petros]

Is there not enough being transfered or is what is being transfered managed piss poorly?

I have my doubts that in many cases those handling the money have the skills or qualifications to do so.

 

[Machjo]

They get the money from all of the natural resources that the government has stolen from the reserves.

That's vague. I can certainly agree with giving reserves jurisdiction over their land. If that's what you mean, why not say that? Or if not, can you clarify?

I'm betting that if all the natives paid their taxes like the rest of us there would be plenty of extra cash to fund these farcical programs and a few more.

actually, many natives do pay taxes. There are all kinds of cases where they pay taxes, such as if they live off reserve, they still pay GST, etc. etc. etc. But all that money goes to us, not them.

Money is the secondary problem, I.M.H.O. More education is what is needed and that can be obtained formally or through the "school of hard knocks". We have to get away from the concept of "we fixing other people's problems", we should be "there" to give guidance or render help when absolutey necessary, but perhaps some members of the first nations community need more incentive to "take the bull by the horns" themselves. There is a wealth of brain power and muscle there!

Even their primary schools are severely underfunded. Basic education helps, but you need money for that. And if resource industries pay taxes to us instead of to them, then that's an advantageous revenue stream they have no access to, and we spend that money according to our interests and priorities.

Is there not enough being transfered or is what is being transfered managed piss poorly?

I have my doubts that in many cases those handling the money have the skills or qualifications to do so.

Maybe, but according to one study, on a student-by-student basis, on-reserve schools are funded between 25 to 50% less than off-reserve on a per-pupil basis.

Add to that that indigenous peoples also need MORE funding than us on a person-by-person basis since many are still struggling with PTSD from teh residential school system. Remember, the last school closed only in 1999, and many indigenous kids are still being separated from their parents today as tehy're taken away by children's services since their parents don't always know how to parent properly; they never learnt that in residential school. That alone is an extra cost.

 

[petros]

Once the funding goes into their hands the Feds have no say in how it is spent.

More funding isn't going to fix mismanagement or even mr management.

Add to that that indigenous peoples also need MORE funding than us on a person-by-person basis since many are still struggling with PTSD from teh residential school system. Remember, the last school closed only in 1999, and many indigenous kids are still being separated from their parents today as tehy're taken away by children's services since their parents don't always know how to parent properly; they never learnt that in residential school.

Malarky! I know people who got their "a r s e money" long after FNs took over the residential schools as far back as 1972. One friend enjoyed the school so much he got an education degree so he could teach in one. For many the residential schools were an escape from home life and still are as the some of the schools never closed.

Indian Bands Begin Takeover Of Lebret Indian Residential School

 

[PoliticalNick]

Education may be a problem but it is not for lack of opportunity. They get all the free education they want including lots of college & trade school. They just don't seem to ever put it to use except for the odd few. They even built a native only college in the Cowichan valley where the campus of VIU is 60%+ native already.

They get billions in transfer payments and seem to open a new casino every other month so there is lots of revenue. If it's not enough then they should use that free education to get a job, then show up and work hard so they keep it.

As for their rights to resources....well I don't get anything but surface rights to my land so why should they get allodial rights to theirs?

Something else that pi$$es me off about this situation is they can get a band check every month and still collect full welfare. Where I am from in Cowichan that means they collect about $1500/mo for a single person in tax free money on top of a $900 welfare check (also tax free), and since a large portion of the city of Duncan sits on reserve land they don't pay GST or income tax (if they bother to work) and get a free home to boot.

Of course they all get free medical & free dental at taxpayer expense to go with that free post-secondary and all the other handouts.

Now we have them being media wh*res with fake hunger strikes and threatening to shut down highways. Well I'm sick of it all! I haven't done anything to any of them except help fund their free lifestyle of debauchery. It is time we put an end to it all. Collectively the "first nations" are a huge drain on our economy and country and as far as I'm concerned they can get with the program of living as Canadians in the 21st century or f*ck-off.

Now I know I may sound like I'm stereotyping here and there are some decent, hardworking, taxpaying individuals but after living on Vancouver Island right next to the Cowichan tribes for almost 20 years and observing their lifestyle at my expense I'm just so over it. I don't care what happened 400 years ago or 40 years ago, I didn't do any of it and I (nor my children) didn't sign any deals or agree to anything so just why the f*ck should we pay for it.

 

[damngrumpy]

Here is the problem we the people give money to the reserves without accountability
The word give is the problem here not the amount that is handed over.
We should be investing in the economic future of the reserves. That way a transition
could take place when the investments begin to pay their way.
For example the reserves could build refineries on their lands, along with casinos
there by providing cash. They could develop their own support industries in the
region where they live and that money would replace the hand outs.
Excess money could then go to smaller reserves to help the out of poverty in the same
manner until we had a system where handouts were no longer needed.
As per the constitution let them keep the tax free status, if we were no longer pumping
taxpayer money in, it would make not difference. At present there is tax free status
and we are pumping money into reserves.
Transition is required but first accountability has to be established. Money should only
be issued with receipt of accountability statements so we know where the initial money
was spent, on behalf of Canadians.

 

[L Gilbert]

Here is the problem we the people give money to the reserves without accountability
The word give is the problem here not the amount that is handed over.
We should be investing in the economic future of the reserves. That way a transition
could take place when the investments begin to pay their way.
For example the reserves could build refineries on their lands, along with casinos
there by providing cash. They could develop their own support industries in the
region where they live and that money would replace the hand outs.
Excess money could then go to smaller reserves to help the out of poverty in the same
manner until we had a system where handouts were no longer needed.
As per the constitution let them keep the tax free status, if we were no longer pumping
taxpayer money in, it would make not difference. At present there is tax free status
and we are pumping money into reserves.
Transition is required but first accountability has to be established. Money should only
be issued with receipt of accountability statements so we know where the initial money
was spent, on behalf of Canadians.

Bih ball of wax there, Grumpy. That could actually lead to us Canucks getting full accounts of where ALL gov't money goes. That'd scare the bejeeezez outta fed politicians.

 

[PoliticalNick]

The word give is the problem

You can say that again! We have done nothing but give them everything and they just want more & more. Time to cut off the gravy train completely and forever.

We should be investing in the economic future of the reserves.

No, they should be investing in themselves like I have to.

For example the reserves could build refineries on their lands

No friken way am I gonna trust a reserve with something so important as a refinery. Their track record of holding bridges & highways & ski resorts etc hostage when they don't get their way precludes them getting any important infrastructure IMO.

As per the constitution let them keep the tax free status

Screw that, if they want to use our infrastructure and be part of Canada they can pay like everyone else.

Transition is required but first accountability has to be established.

They need to be accountable for themselves in 21st century Canada. If they don't want to do that they can try to form their own country. Good luck to them fighting to claim Canadian soil.

Money should only be issued with receipt of accountability statements so we know where the initial money
was spent, on behalf of Canadians.

Actually money shouldn't be issued at all, let them go earn it like the rest of us!

 

[darkbeaver]

Well it's refineries or lawyers in either case you don't get to keep the money or save any. Oh did you think there was a solution that didn't involve your money? hahahahahhahahhahahahhahah There must be thousands and thousands of lawyers slavering at the thoughts of breaking and upholding treaties
. Just kiddin I'm sure something equitable will be arrived at. kiddin again hahahahahahhaha come on man a couple or three refineries at the most, it will be cheaper than permanent legal costs and the war of course

 

[taxslave]

That's vague. I can certainly agree with giving reserves jurisdiction over their land. If that's what you mean, why not say that? Or if not, can you clarify?



actually, many natives do pay taxes. There are all kinds of cases where they pay taxes, such as if they live off reserve, they still pay GST, etc. etc. etc. But all that money goes to us, not them.



They must pay income tax if living and working off rez but not GST. So if they want to buy a new car the rust pimp meets them on a rez to sign the papers and presto no tax. MY DIL just saved about 4G on a new Journey. i gotta speak to her about a new truck for me.