What does it mean to hate Christ?

damngrumpy

damngrumpy

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Ya and just think, wasn't it Christ who praised the humble?
These clerics are the most self serving people on the planet.
 
MHz

MHz

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damngrumpy said:
Encouraged by this lets get a big tent, a band and a large collection plate.
Wait I can't sing.
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NP, you can keep the donation plate full so the Church can donate to the poor. With the honor system in place they will take only a little more than they really need.

JLM said:
It's not so much that we hate Trudeau as his arrogant ways and what he did, running up huge debt wasn't the least of it. -:)
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How humble can you be in this world when LaFarge is a Tonka Toy for you?
 
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cj44

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Sep 18, 2013
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Motar said:
"Whoever hates me hates my Father as well. If I had not done among them the works no one else did, they would not be guilty of sin. As it is, they have seen, and yet they have hated both me and my Father. But this is to fulfill what is written in their Law: ‘They hated me without reason." (John 15:23-25)

In the subject verses above, cj, Jesus is referencing a particular hate-group when He says: "But this is to fulfill what is written in their Law: 'They hated me without reason."

In this context, what group Jesus is identifying? Why did they hate Him? How is this group represented in our day?
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Motar: I thought within the context of the chapter, Jesus is referring to the "world" those that do not believe they need a redeemer. Or is the "hate group" the pharisees - those that do the "works of the law" (or at least think they do). I think 400 plus years ago, those in unwittingly in opposition to Jesus were likely adhering to a set of rituals, ceremonies, good works. They would call themselves Christians, but since they trusted in "works", they denied Christ. Now, I think things have changed in that there are few who are cognizant of sin. Consciences are no longer terrorized. (not that I think one should be terrorized!) So many do not recognize sin or even think to confess sin to God. Does that constitute "hate" toward Jesus. Will look forward to your thoughts.

damngrumpy said:
Encouraged by this lets get a big tent, a band and a large collection plate.
Wait I can't sing.
The problem is not Christ its the hypocrites that claim to represent him.
Most of the religious crowd don't follow the teachings of anything except
what they personally think. Most don't think they follow the dogma of the
faith and therein lies the problem.
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Grumpy: What specifically are the hypocrites saying or doing or not saying/doing? What should they be doing if they were truly Christian?

Sleeper: I thought I posted on the Christian/Philosophy forum so it was ok to discuss Christ related topics. Aren't you even curious about Jesus saying: "But this is to fulfill what is written in their Law: ‘They hated me without reason.’" I like to ponder things. What does this mean? Think about it. Here this guy did all sorts of miracles - major miracles - gave sight to the blind, healed many infirmities, and what about all those loaves. Then he says people hate him without reason. This is a curious matter. Why did they hate him without reason????
 
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Cliffy

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DaSleeper

DaSleeper

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talloola said:
no one should hate anyone, and when someone hates someone who is dead, that is disturbing.
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What about hating a religion so much that you study the book in depth simply so you can find things wrong with it, while the followers simply scan parts of it for inspiration.......:roll:
 
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Cliffy

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DaSleeper said:
What about hating a religion so much that you study the book in depth simply so you can find things wrong with it, while the followers simply scan parts of it for inspiration.......:roll:
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Funny that you should think that hate would be the only motivation for reading books on religion. I think that says more about you.
 
DaSleeper

DaSleeper

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That's what atheists do.................................You forgot to read what I said followers do...and I meant the silent majority who's religion is a personal thing and don't spend all their time trying to convert others......
 
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Cliffy

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DaSleeper said:
That's what atheists do.................................You forgot to read what I said followers do...and I meant the silent majority who's religion is a personal thing and don't spend all their time trying to convert others......
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I wouldn't be surprised if the percentage of those into converting others is about the same on both sides. One side wants to save others while the other is trying to save themselves from the converters. I can understand why atheists are being defensive (and sometime offensive) to counter what they see as a threat by the religious right who are trying to take control of the political agenda. The religious right is a threat to all people, religious or not.
 
DaSleeper

DaSleeper

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Cliffy said:
I wouldn't be surprised if the percentage of those into converting others is about the same on both sides. One side wants to save others while the other is trying to save themselves from the converters. I can understand why atheists are being defensive (and sometime offensive) to counter what they see as a threat by the religious right who are trying to take control of the political agenda. The religious right is a threat to all people, religious or not.
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For the last 26 years I have lived less than 200 meters from the church I sometimes go to (next street over) and not once has the pastor of that church ever come knocking on my door. If I would ever feel the need .....I would go to him.
Which doesn't mean I have never read the Bible or the Quran or other religious books, I just don't put great effort or delve in them as the fanatics of all kind, whether they be bible thumpers, islam apologists, or atheists.
Those that post religious or anti-religious crap on a forum have a perfect right to do so, just as I have a perfect right to mock it.
 
Motar

Motar

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Jun 18, 2013
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cj44 said:
Motar: I thought within the context of the chapter, Jesus is referring to the "world" those that do not believe they need a redeemer. Or is the "hate group" the pharisees - those that do the "works of the law" (or at least think they do). I think 400 plus years ago, those in unwittingly in opposition to Jesus were likely adhering to a set of rituals, ceremonies, good works. They would call themselves Christians, but since they trusted in "works", they denied Christ. Now, I think things have changed in that there are few who are cognizant of sin. Consciences are no longer terrorized. (not that I think one should be terrorized!) So many do not recognize sin or even think to confess sin to God. Does that constitute "hate" toward Jesus. Will look forward to your thoughts.

I would concur, cj, that the hate group in this context is the religious establishment of Jesus' earthly day. The Pharisees were one of the politico-religious groups opposed to the message and ministry of Christ. On a political level, He was a threat to their political-religious system and would undermine their authority among the people:

"Jesus entered the temple courts, and, while he was teaching, the chief priests and the elders of the people came to him. “By what authority are you doing these things?” they asked. “And who gave you this authority?” (Matthew 21:23)

On a personal plane, Jesus imposed upon the religious leaders' sense of self-righteousness:

"On one occasion an expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. “Teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life?” “What is written in the Law?” he replied. “How do you read it?” He answered, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind’; and, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’” “You have answered correctly,” Jesus replied. “Do this and you will live.” But he wanted to justify himself, so he asked Jesus, “And who is my neighbor?” (Luke 10:25-29)

In our day, organized religion can still be a hindrance to the cause of Christ. The media does a good job of pointing out examples of this fact on a regular basis.

So, how are Christians distinguished from this?
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Cliffy

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DaSleeper said:
For the last 26 years I have lived less than 200 meters from the church I sometimes go to (next street over) and not once has the pastor of that church ever come knocking on my door. If I would ever feel the need .....I would go to him.
Which doesn't mean I have never read the Bible or the Quran or other religious books, I just don't put great effort or delve in them as the fanatics of all kind, whether they be bible thumpers, islam apologists, or atheists.
Those that post religious or anti-religious crap on a forum have a perfect right to do so, just as I have a perfect right to mock it.
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And so do those who mock religion and the religious.
 
captain morgan

captain morgan

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Self-righteousness doesn't need religion to exist... In fact, it's even more amplified and obnoxious amongst those that claim to have no faith at all.... Just like ex-smokers, they are crusaders and the biggest pain-in-the-azs going
 
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