Time To Kick The USA When It's Down, End Hyphenated Americanism

[dumpthemonarchy]

Found this while I was looking for Mr, Monarch's info:

BC's children's rep says government failed baby by refusing help to parents - Yahoo! Canada News

Yep. Progress.

Then there's this bit:

Highlights from the Report of the Royal Commission on Aboriginal Peoples

That is a tragic case and mistakes are made by the govt. However, I think the govt does much more good than harm in child care cases.

From the first page of the RCAP report, it states

The relationship between Aboriginal and non-Aboriginal people evolved through four stages:

• There was a time when Aboriginal and non-Aboriginal people lived on separate continents and knew nothing of one another.
• Following the years of first contact, fragile relations of peace, friendship and rough equality were given the force of law in treaties.
• Then power tilted toward non-Aboriginal people and governments. They moved Aboriginal people off much of their land and took steps to 'civilize' and teach them European ways.
• Finally, we reached the present stage - a time of recovery for Aboriginal people and cultures, a time for critical review of our relationship, and a time for its renegotiation and renewal.

On the second point, when the first English settlers came to Virginia in the early 17th century, from 1608-1625, there was an uneasy peace for a few years and decades, but by 1630 the new colonies were safe basically. And this was without largescale support by English soldiers. There was no intermarriage to speak of, except with Pocahontas, and just growth after that.

From this time, where are the treaties? These were business ventures and colonies failed beforehand in the 16th century. The French were different, but the English ignored Indians as much as they could from the start. This English-Virginia mentality persists I believe in Canada as UELs came north after the American Revolution and were key in making Canada as we know it today.

 

[AnnaG]

Look, all I am saying is that progress at the beginning wasn't too bad, natives benifited mostly from what Europeans had to offer. But then, when Europeans conned and cajoled natives into trying to adopt European culture, it clashed. Progress was not good. Europeans brought along with them this "time" thing, and the only sense of "time" natives had was time to eat, sleep, or put the liner in the tipi to keep out the cold for winter. Then there was booze. That was big bad news. Natives trapped and got furs for clothing and to trade stuff with people that couldn't get furs. Along came Europeans and fashion, and next thing you know, hardly any beaver left. The bison thing was a disaster. Natives never massacred bison by the hundreds of thousands. One bison was enough to feed an entire village for a season. Natives didn't pave over the best land for growing things.They didn't fish the Grand Banks till only a small fraction of fish stocks were left. Commerce was stable till the Europeans brought their version over.
Sorry, I got going and forgot to finish my point:
not everything about technology and progress is all that great.

 

[Niflmir]

In regard to the OP:

Most people cannot deal with ambiguity. For this reason I really enjoy flirting with (some of) my male colleagues. Only the ones with a sense of humour. Some of them actually get the joke.

Similarly, I propose we stop using left and right to refer to directions. Before I know which direction is right, I need to know which direction is forward and which direction is up. That's just too ambiguous. Especially when mirrors are involved. I mean, if I lay down in front of a mirror with my head on the right and my feet on the left, when I raise my head, why doesn't my reflection raise it's feet?

 

[eh1eh]

Oh. Niflmir, I think you've encapsulated the essence of this thread in only two paragraphs.

I would like to suggest you were thorough.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

Look, all I am saying is that progress at the beginning wasn't too bad, natives benifited mostly from what Europeans had to offer. But then, when Europeans conned and cajoled natives into trying to adopt European culture, it clashed. Progress was not good. Europeans brought along with them this "time" thing, and the only sense of "time" natives had was time to eat, sleep, or put the liner in the tipi to keep out the cold for winter. Then there was booze. That was big bad news. Natives trapped and got furs for clothing and to trade stuff with people that couldn't get furs. Along came Europeans and fashion, and next thing you know, hardly any beaver left. The bison thing was a disaster. Natives never massacred bison by the hundreds of thousands. One bison was enough to feed an entire village for a season. Natives didn't pave over the best land for growing things.They didn't fish the Grand Banks till only a small fraction of fish stocks were left. Commerce was stable till the Europeans brought their version over.
Sorry, I got going and forgot to finish my point:
not everything about technology and progress is all that great.

Since we're talking about continental American culture that includes Spain, the Spanish forced the peasant Indians in Mexico and Peru to adopt European culture by forcing them to become Catholics. Spain sent many soldiers over to conquer Mexico and Peru in about 40 years.

However, if you mean the English settlers in Virginia, these people ignored Indians, they wanted nothing to do with them as they were farmers and wanted more land. The French were farmers too but they were into the fur trade and had much more equitable relations. Although the French encroached on their land too, but at a much slower rate.

The world changes and Indians don't or can't adjust. The slow Indian world of old reminds me of the fed govt today, no rush, we'll talk forever. Meanwhile, the world changes at breakneck speed.

 

[mt_pockets1000]

We are able to hurl people through the air in a metal canister and land them at the nearest McDonald's. And we call that progress.

That's a reasonable facsimile of a comment I found on the web some time back and found it to be very profound.

Depends on what you call progress. Yes, the computer is a valuable tool in our lives today but we are sorely lacking in other areas...like human communication.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

Today Harper spoke in Mexico about "the hemisphere". This hemisphere where we live, obviously the Western Hemisphere. But where are the hemisphereans? And who are they? None of us think we are hemisphereans. Just geographic trash talking. Useful but meaningless words because nobody considers Mexicans to be North Americans like us Canadians and Americans. Not very inclusive here ladies and germs

We all know Mexicans are Latin Americans like Brazilians, Argentineans and Chileans etc.

 

[AnnaG]

Today Harper spoke in Mexico about "the hemisphere". This hemisphere where we live, obviously the Western Hemisphere. But where are the hemisphereans? And who are they? None of us think we are hemisphereans. Just geographic trash talking. Useful but meaningless words because nobody considers Mexicans to be North Americans like us Canadians and Americans. Not very inclusive here ladies and germs

We all know Mexicans are Latin Americans like Brazilians, Argentineans and Chileans etc.

I guess you're right. CTV news tonight said the 3 leaders of North America were meeting. Scuse me but there are more than 3 countries in North America. But what can you expect from CTV reporters? Intelligence? lmao
Did Harpy mean the northern hemisphere or the western hemisphere? I wonder if he knows the difference.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

I guess you're right. CTV news tonight said the 3 leaders of North America were meeting. Scuse me but there are more than 3 countries in North America. But what can you expect from CTV reporters? Intelligence? lmao
Did Harpy mean the northern hemisphere or the western hemisphere? I wonder if he knows the difference.

For Harpo, its hemisphere schemisphere. Bunch of irritating foreigners from who knows where who keep bugging us. They ought to be grateful we give them the time of day.

 

[AnnaG]

For Harpo, its hemisphere schemisphere. Bunch of irritating foreigners from who knows where who keep bugging us. They ought to be grateful we give them the time of day.

lol Foreigners to me are those who live east of the Rockies.

 

[Downhome_Woman]

Actually the Irish were probably here first - check out the Navigatio of St Brendan - or read Tim Severin's book, 'The Brendan Voyage'.
Columbus? Feh.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

Actually the Irish were probably here first - check out the Navigatio of St Brendan - or read Tim Severin's book, 'The Brendan Voyage'.
Columbus? Feh.

Let's not get too sidetracked here. There may have been people who crossed the ocean before Columbus and did some things here. Some came like the Norse to L"Anse Aux Meadows. The Norse like all the others who came, made no long term impact and were forgotten by their contempories. Only after Columbus, in the service of the Spanish crown, did things change forever.

In the business section and articles Mexico is often referred to as "overseas". Because psychologically, that is how we feel so that is where they are in our minds. Or rather, how easterners feel. Many in BC and Western Canada drive south to California and go to Tijuana and shop. In BC the perspective is a little different but the eastern mentality, because they are the majority, prevails.

The Spanish sailed off the BC coast, not off Quebec or the Maritimes.

 

[AnnaG]

Actually the Irish were probably here first - check out the Navigatio of St Brendan - or read Tim Severin's book, 'The Brendan Voyage'.
Columbus? Feh.

Yeah, James Adovasio wrote about a few people that were here long before my ancestors. And others have written about peoples before then, too. People like Thomas Dillehay and Tom Koppel.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

Getting back to the topic, because of Columbus' trip, the continent we live on is called America. It should have been named after Columbus, but a mistake was made here. In part because he would not acknowledge he was on a new continent, due to his compensation. So much occurred so fast after he came that events overtook everyone.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

We are able to hurl people through the air in a metal canister and land them at the nearest McDonald's. And we call that progress.

That's a reasonable facsimile of a comment I found on the web some time back and found it to be very profound.

Depends on what you call progress. Yes, the computer is a valuable tool in our lives today but we are sorely lacking in other areas...like human communication.

Sure technical advances are not everything, and they may be coming too fast, but they somehow seem inevitable. I think with the settlement of America by Europeans, the industrial revolution was speeded up by centuries.

We don't give a rat's backside about tradition, we want progress, immediately, if not sooner. Most other countries aren't like that. Our relatively classless wants more and more faster and faster. What have we got to save? We're the Borg and we seem to be winning. Although I'd rather have a Tuborg.

 

[ironsides]

Getting back to the topic, because of Columbus' trip, the continent we live on is called America. It should have been named after Columbus, but a mistake was made here. In part because he would not acknowledge he was on a new continent, due to his compensation. So much occurred so fast after he came that events overtook everyone.

Where the name America came from is very confusing.

Americas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[EagleSmack]

Getting back to the topic, because of Columbus' trip, the continent we live on is called America. It should have been named after Columbus, but a mistake was made here. In part because he would not acknowledge he was on a new continent, due to his compensation. So much occurred so fast after he came that events overtook everyone.

Then we would just call ourselves Columbians as we would be the United States of Columbia. There would be the North Columbia and South Columbia continents and just below Texas and north of South Columbia would be a region known as Central Columbia.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

Where the name America came from is very confusing.

Americas - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Considering it took months for messages to cross the Atlantic in those days, what we know about the origin of the name America is fairly thorough all things considered. It came down to Columbus or America, most likely. Had Columbus worried about being famous after he died by insisting his name be use, this problem would be solved.

 

[dumpthemonarchy]

Then we would just call ourselves Columbians as we would be the United States of Columbia. There would be the North Columbia and South Columbia continents and just below Texas and north of South Columbia would be a region known as Central Columbia.

In Briitsh Columbia, we're already Columbians, sort of. But whether its Columbus or America the name problem to have the US as America is unanswered.

i think the early confusion on what to call the new continent lingers on whether we live on one or two continents. This means Europe, Asia and Africa apparently didn't give much thought to this new place. Sure the academics were keen, but the mass of people in the 16-17-18th centuries couldn't read or write, saw hardly any maps of the world, and only got vague ideas of this new land. And who traveled there? Very few. And who came back, even fewer. America was out in left field for the illiterate masses.