Tim Farron is a Christian, so of course he’s not allowed an opinion

Blackleaf

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Farron’s enormous crime in the eyes of the establishment was to refuse to deny (for a while, at least) that he thought homosexual sex was a sin. Farron is a born-again evangelical Christian, so of course he thinks homosexual sex is a sin. My guess is that this view is shared by at least 50 per cent of the population and possibly more, although they might prefer the words ‘yucky’ or ‘vile’ or ‘a bit rum’ rather than ‘sin’.

Of course Farron was immediately castigated and, being a weak little weasel, he kind of recanted a bit...

Tim Farron is a Christian, so of course he’s not allowed an opinion


The Lib Dem leader’s views on gay sex are shared by many – much to the establishment’s horror


Rod Liddle




Liberal Democrats leader Tim Farron launches his party's general election campaign (Photo: Getty)

Rod Liddle
29 April 2017
The Spectator

Maybe I’m wrong about this, but I don’t remember the BBC running a documentary 100 days into Barack Obama’s first presidency and kicking him from pillar to post. Interviewing almost exclusively people who hated him, pouring scorn on his every utterance. They did it this week to Donald Trump, though, and even wheeled out Jeremy Paxman to present this travesty of a documentary. Because Jeremy was interviewing exclusively people with whom he wholeheartedly agreed, he didn’t get the chance to put on that famous supercilious expression we all used to love, back when he was good. Shame.

With Obama, as I remember, it was a very different approach. The studio floors were still awash with liberal ejaculate well after 100 days of his singularly inept presidency had elapsed. The establishment circle-jerking persisted right until the very end — and not just from the BBC, of course. The Nobel committee bunged Obama the Peace Prize in December 2009 for ‘reaching out to the Muslim world’ — a policy which has brought such wonderful dividends for us all. Frankly, the further you reach, the more likely you are to get your hand chopped off.

I have many reservations about The Donald, which I outlined here a couple of weeks ago — but when I see the establishment, the newish establishment, so apoplectic about his very existence, I kinda know what side I’m on. I can only hope French voters feel similarly repulsed by the multiple orgasms experienced in Brussels, Strasbourg, the BBC, by Obama and beyond, over the weirdo Manny Macron’s triumph in the presidential semi-finals. The establishment has once again banded together to tell French people how to vote in the final, and it would be truly French of the French to react by telling them to get stuffed and voting for Marine Le Pen.

If I had a vote I would have been torn between Le Pen and Mélenchon, much as I’d have been torn between Trump and Bernie Sanders. Instead, in France, the pretend anti-establishment candidate won. You can tell he’s pretend by the smirk of jubilation on the face of that arrogant and flatulent perpetually half-cut halfwit Jean-Claude Juncker. But I suppose at least Macron was savvy enough to understand that he had to present himself as anti-establishment. If you count the dupes who voted for him, more than two-thirds of the French voted for a candidate opposed to the liberal establishment, even if only nominally so in one case.

I mentioned before that with Brexit and the election of Trump and the rise of such European parties as the Front National (and Syriza and Five Star) that the old liberal (in the US sense) paradigm was in the process of being jettisoned. So it is, beyond all doubt. But the liberal establishment still has great power, if not anything remotely approaching hegemony. And so those who challenge its imprecations, its bovine shibboleths, whether from left or right, will find themselves vilified. A weight will come down, propelled by an outrage at the presumption that such a challenge could be mounted at all. Even as the establishment politicians modify their language on such stuff as immigration and Islam, so that they sound a little closer to the views of the ordinary citizen, there is still plenty of stuff which they simply cannot countenance in any form.

One of these, in this country particularly, is the dissing of homosexuality — as the Liberal Democrat leader Tim Farron discovered recently. Farron’s enormous crime in the eyes of the establishment was to refuse to deny (for a while, at least) that he thought homosexual sex was a sin. Farron is a born-again evangelical Christian, so of course he thinks homosexual sex is a sin. My guess is that this view is shared by at least 50 per cent of the population and possibly more, although they might prefer the words ‘yucky’ or ‘vile’ or ‘a bit rum’ rather than ‘sin’.

Of course Farron was immediately castigated and, being a weak little weasel, he kind of recanted a bit (Thank you, Lord Jesus!). What was interesting to me was the point-blank refusal even to consider that his view might be allowable — a view shared, to a greater or lesser degree, by a great many people. A chap called David Shariatmadari, writing in the Guardian, tried to be kind. He said we liberals should all give Timbo a break: ‘I don’t care what he considers sinful, so long as it doesn’t translate into policy. For that reason, however, he should be watched like a hawk for any hint of discriminatory law-making.’

He can think what he likes, then (for which many thanks, Mr Shariatmadari), but he should not be allowed to let this deep-rooted belief inform his politics. Instead, it is Mr Shariatmadari’s views, rather than the views of the Holy Bible, which should inform Tim Farron’s politics. This is because Mr Shariatmadari, like the rest of the liberal establishment, believes that his views count for a lot more than the Holy Bible — indeed his views are inviolable. They are all that count. And if anybody dares to disagree, they will be watched ‘like a hawk’. I don’t know what kind of hawk. Maybe a goshawk.

And yet the reason people go into politics is to articulate their points of view and convince the public of the rectitude of them. In a normal society, that would even include people who have views which differ from those of Mr Shariatmadari — they would be allowed to speak too. And enact legislation based upon those views, assuming the majority of people agreed with them. Such as on gay adoptions, for example. My guess is that if you asked in an opinion poll what the best environment would be in which to bring up a child, a huge majority would choose ‘a mother and father’. I suspect Tim Farron thinks this too. But for the liberal establishment, it is not even a question. It contravenes a shibboleth which simply cannot be challenged.

https://www.spectator.co.uk/2017/04...tian-so-of-course-hes-not-allowed-an-opinion/
 

Bar Sinister

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Maybe I’m wrong about this, but I don’t remember the BBC running a documentary 100 days into Barack Obama’s first presidency and kicking him from pillar to post. Interviewing almost exclusively people who hated him, pouring scorn on his every utterance. They did it this week to Donald Trump, though, and even wheeled out Jeremy Paxman to present this travesty of a documentary.

That could well be because every president for the last century of so has exuded a sense of competence. The Dumpster has done nothing that would give anyone in his right mind a sense of confidence.

And who gives a damn if Farron's outmoded views are shared by 50% of the population. If I remember correctly slavery, torture, and wife-beating, had those numbers of supporters at one time.
 

damngrumpy

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Every time I hear the Christians whining about persecution I can't help but laugh.
Christians throughout history have persecuted more people for not believing
what they believe than any other group. They went on murderous rampages
across the Holy Land and conducted witch trials all over Europe and North
America. When religion conflicts with the law of discrimination the law of the land
should apply. We should not allow religion to be exempt from hate crime status
 

Blackleaf

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That could well be because every president for the last century of so has exuded a sense of competence. The Dumpster has done nothing that would give anyone in his right mind a sense of confidence.

Wasn't Obama the most unpopular president ever who did nothing worthwhile during his term in office?

And who gives a damn if Farron's outmoded views are shared by 50% of the population. If I remember correctly slavery, torture, and wife-beating, had those numbers of supporters at one time.
They're "outmoded" only in your opinion. They're not outmoded in the opinion of a good swathe of the population.

Every time I hear the Christians whining about persecution I can't help but laugh.
Christians throughout history have persecuted more people for not believing
what they believe than any other group. They went on murderous rampages
across the Holy Land and conducted witch trials all over Europe and North
America. When religion conflicts with the law of discrimination the law of the land
should apply. We should not allow religion to be exempt from hate crime status

Christianity is the most persecuted religion on Earth.
 

Curious Cdn

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Christianity is the most persecuted religion on Earth.


Zoroastrianism is probably the most persecuted religion on Earth. It's much older than Christianity or even Judaism. The homeland of Zoroastrianism is Iran. Imagine the fate of non-muslims, there.
 

Blackleaf

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Zoroastrianism is probably the most persecuted religion on Earth. It's much older than Christianity or even Judaism. The homeland of Zoroastrianism is Iran. Imagine the fate of non-muslims, there.

Christianity is the most persecuted religion on Earth, with Muslims being huge contributors to that:

Christians continued to be the most persecuted group across the globe in 2016, according to a study. The upcoming report from Italian-based Center for Studies on New Religions determined that 90,000 Christians were killed for their beliefs worldwide last year and nearly a third were at the hands of Islamic extremists like ISIS. Others were killed by state and non-state persecution, including in places like North Korea.

“U.S. policy has not had a strategy for specifically addressing the persecution of Christians,” Ryan Mauro, national security analyst for the Clarion Project, told FoxNews.com “For example, very few people are even aware that Iraqi Christians began organizing to defend themselves and needed our help."

The study also found that as many as 600 million Christians were prevented from practicing their faith in 2016.

Expand / Contract August 17, 2014: People hold crosses and signs during a rally organized by Iraqi Christians living in Germany denouncing what they say is repression by the Islamic State militant group against Christians living in Iraq, in Berlin. Some of the signs read "Stop ISIS, save the Christians" and "Stop all shipment of weapons into the Middle East.” (REUTERS/Thomas Peter )

The findings continue a disturbing trend from the previous year in which Christians around the world endured horrific acts of persecution, including imprisonment and beheadings.

“These numbers underscore what we already know," Robert Nicholson of the Philos Project said to Foxnews.com. "There are many places on earth where being a Christian is the most dangerous thing you can be.

"Those who think of Christianity as a religion of the powerful need to see that in many places it’s a religion of the powerless. And the powerless deserve to be protected.”

While the situation is most dire in the Middle East, Christianity is under assault in Africa and Asia, too, according to an Aid to the Church in Need study of incidents in 2015. It cited persecution at the hands of Islamist terror groups such as Boko Haram in Nigeria and other extremists in Sudan, Kenya, Tanzania and other parts of the continent.

Islamic State militants lead what are said to be Ethiopian Christians along a beach in Wilayat Barqa, in this still image from an undated video made available on a social media website on April 19, 2015. (REUTERS)

Asia's Christians have been targeted by nationalist religious movements -- Muslim, Hindu and Buddhist -- in such countries as Pakistan, India and Myanmar. Many of these groups increasingly view Christianity as a foreign, "colonial" import, and believe its practitioners are doing the bidding of the West, say experts.

While Christians continue to be under siege from ISIS radicals in Syria and Iraq, the religion is being targeted throughout the region with members of the faith also under increasing pressure in Iran, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and other Gulf nations.

The Christian population in Iraq alone has plummeted from 1.5 million in 2003 to current estimates of 275,000 and could be gone for good within just a few years, according to activists. The dwindling numbers are due to genocide, refugees fleeing to other countries, those who are internally displaced, and others hiding in plain sight and not allowing their faith to be publicly known.


Christians the most persecuted group in world for second year: Study | Fox News
 

Bar Sinister

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Wasn't Obama the most unpopular president ever who did nothing worthwhile during his term in office?

They're "outmoded" only in your opinion. They're not outmoded in the opinion of a good swathe of the population.

Oh, I didn't know you supported torture, slavery, and wife beating. As for Obama's popularity I only have your word for that. Do you have any proof? You might also consider that the Dumpster is being compared month by month to Obama. Let's see where he sits at Obama's lowest showing in the polls.

Historically Truman, Nixon, and both Bushes all had ratings below 30% at one time in their careers. Obama's lowest rating was 38%, but not until he'd been in power for three years.

Presidential Approval Ratings | Gallup Historical Statistics and Trends
 

JLM

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Oh, I didn't know you supported torture, slavery, and wife beating. As for Obama's popularity I only have your word for that. Do you have any proof? You might also consider that the Dumpster is being compared month by month to Obama. Let's see where he sits at Obama's lowest showing in the polls.

Historically Truman, Nixon, and both Bushes all had ratings below 30% at one time in their careers. Obama's lowest rating was 38%, but not until he'd been in power for three years.

Presidential Approval Ratings | Gallup Historical Statistics and Trends


Isn't it the 100 days before the election that counts far more than the 100 days after the election? :)
 

gopher

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Every time I hear the Christians whining about persecution I can't help but laugh.
Christians throughout history have persecuted more people for not believing
what they believe than any other group. They went on murderous rampages
across the Holy Land and conducted witch trials all over Europe and North
America. When religion conflicts with the law of discrimination the law of the land
should apply. We should not allow religion to be exempt from hate crime status



I certainly cannot speak for the UK or Canada but in the USA those pols who most often criticize gays usually turn out to be closeted gays.
 

Bar Sinister

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Isn't it the 100 days before the election that counts far more than the 100 days after the election? :)


Well, as the six presidents I mentioned found out, if your popularity drops too low you lose the support of Congress and then become a lame duck. The Dumpster appears to be heading in that direction at a record speed.
 

Danbones

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...and yet ANOTHER another prediction from the hillary will win crew
 

JLM

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Well, as the six presidents I mentioned found out, if your popularity drops too low you lose the support of Congress and then become a lame duck. The Dumpster appears to be heading in that direction at a record speed.


Maybe the "Dumpster" is more concerned with pleasing the people than with pleasing Congress. :)
 

Serryah

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British guy can think however he likes about anything.

The moment he takes what he believes in a religious way and tries to push that faith/belief onto others... that's where most people have the issue.

Yes, he should be watched like a hawk, because if his religion is going to influence his decisions, then that could cost people money and lives.

Hey Blackleaf - would you feel the same if the guy was a Muslim?
 

Tecumsehsbones

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British guy can think however he likes about anything.

The moment he takes what he believes in a religious way and tries to push that faith/belief onto others... that's where most people have the issue.

Yes, he should be watched like a hawk, because if his religion is going to influence his decisions, then that could cost people money and lives.

Hey Blackleaf - would you feel the same if the guy was a Muslim?
And please note that he's "allowed" to say and do whatever he wants. Nobody's "prohibiting" anything.

For the whimpering right, people disagreeing with them is oppression.

Well, as the six presidents I mentioned found out, if your popularity drops too low you lose the support of Congress and then become a lame duck. The Dumpster appears to be heading in that direction at a record speed.
That's not what "lame duck" means.
 

Danbones

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a lame commentaryist
:)

Zoroastrianism is probably the most persecuted religion on Earth. It's much older than Christianity or even Judaism. The homeland of Zoroastrianism is Iran. Imagine the fate of non-muslims, there.

The Iranian jews won't leave Iran to go to Israel, even for bribes
;)
must be terrible in Israel

Christians Discriminated Against by Israel
http://ifamericaknew.org/history/rel-christians.html
 

Cliffy

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This for Blackhead and his fascination with his reptilian queen (cuz I couldn't find an appropriate thread for it):

 

Bar Sinister

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Jan 17, 2010
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Maybe the "Dumpster" is more concerned with pleasing the people than with pleasing Congress. :)

I suspect that what the people who voted for him want is for him to keep at least one of his major promises. Signing executive orders might be fine, but they can be reversed in a day by the next president. He needs to get a few bills passed and right now the number of bills passed is zero.

...and yet ANOTHER another prediction from the hillary will win crew

And another comment from the "Trump is going to reform everything crew."
 

JLM

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I suspect that what the people who voted for him want is for him to keep at least one of his major promises. Signing executive orders might be fine, but they can be reversed in a day by the next president. He needs to get a few bills passed and right now the number of bills passed is zero.


I'm not sure everything he accomplishes depends on Executive Orders. Look at all the manufacturing he's brought back in a couple of months. Ford factories for one.