The Proudest Hour of the Prolife Movement.
- Thread starter SirJosephPorter
- Start date
SOME miscarriages are unplanned. Many are what are called 'induced miscarriages', which is often called...oh yeah, an abortion. I daresay you have a lot of opinions on a subject that you don't seem to know much about.
So do you plan to criminally investigate everyone who has a miscarriage? Because that's what used to happen before abortions became relatively available. Often, it was the local midwife who also knew easy ways to induce a miscarriage.
Edit - for those having trouble reading, I mean that induced miscarriages used to happen, not criminally investigating miscarriages. It's an example of a poorly written sentence with unclear meaning.
Quoting SirJosephPorter
No proof, Machjo, just my opinion. Hypocrisy comes naturally to many conservatives. There are so many examples in the public life. If leaders are like that, why would the followers be any different?
Only to conservatives? - Machjo
Let us face it, Machjo, hypocrisy is a human condition. It is much easier to tell others how to live their lives; it is much more difficult to live that way by oneself.
But conservatives are more guilty of hypocrisy, because they are constantly telling others how they should live their lives. Then if it turns out that conservatives themselves don’t follow their own rules (as often happens), they are exposed as hypocrites. Liberals rarely tell others how to live their lives, so liberal hypocrisy, while present, is less common.
Thus, if a prolife woman gets an abortion, she is guilty of hypocrisy, if a prochoice woman gets one, she is not. That is why Joan of Arc was exposed as a hypocrite (one of the reasons why her popularity went into the toilet in a short order). She wanted all the schools in USA to teach abstinence only education, she wanted to tell teenagers never to have sex until they are married. Then it turns out not only that her daughter was having sex before marriage, but that she was pregnant. Joan of Arc was accused of hypocrisy, that wouldn’t’ have happened if she has been a liberal politician.
No proof, Machjo, just my opinion. Hypocrisy comes naturally to many conservatives. There are so many examples in the public life. If leaders are like that, why would the followers be any different?
Only to conservatives? - Machjo
Let us face it, Machjo, hypocrisy is a human condition. It is much easier to tell others how to live their lives; it is much more difficult to live that way by oneself.
But conservatives are more guilty of hypocrisy, because they are constantly telling others how they should live their lives. Then if it turns out that conservatives themselves don’t follow their own rules (as often happens), they are exposed as hypocrites. Liberals rarely tell others how to live their lives, so liberal hypocrisy, while present, is less common.
Thus, if a prolife woman gets an abortion, she is guilty of hypocrisy, if a prochoice woman gets one, she is not. That is why Joan of Arc was exposed as a hypocrite (one of the reasons why her popularity went into the toilet in a short order). She wanted all the schools in USA to teach abstinence only education, she wanted to tell teenagers never to have sex until they are married. Then it turns out not only that her daughter was having sex before marriage, but that she was pregnant. Joan of Arc was accused of hypocrisy, that wouldn’t’ have happened if she has been a liberal politician.
Do all these people wo quote differently go to the same school?? one uses color code another uses "quotation marks"
When you quote such a post the entire post is in your quote, not just the persone you are quoting....
Anyone reading your post can easily become confused as to who said what.
CDNBear is going to have to start giving lessons on how to quote properly
Sarah Palin's daughter is NOT Sarah Palin you sick, sad little man....
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Well, it's not a alligator :lol:
The cells you spit out come from an individual. An embryo, that collection of cells, is an individual. It has it's own DNA, it's own metabolic needs, it has three germ layers, and is developing according to a plan. The plan is for a human.
The cells you spit out, are not going to ever become a human, without substantial laboratory techniques. They are not programmed for it. They are only programmed for a specific function as part of a human. That's a significant dichotomy in your analogy. There are similarities between the cells you spit out, and the developing embryo, but the differences are much larger.
What species is it? Is it an extension of the mother? It is in every way a human. All humans before us and after us will go through exactly the same sequence. An embryo is one stage, just as a butterfly must be without wings for part of it's life.
Not to a biologist
As to the morality, that's another ball of wax altogether.
TenPenny asked:
"So do you plan to criminally investigate everyone who has a miscarriage? Because that's what used to happen before abortions became relatively available. Often, it was the local midwife who also knew easy ways to induce a miscarriage."
No more so than I would like to launch an investigation about someone having the flu or the common cold.
"So do you plan to criminally investigate everyone who has a miscarriage? Because that's what used to happen before abortions became relatively available. Often, it was the local midwife who also knew easy ways to induce a miscarriage."
No more so than I would like to launch an investigation about someone having the flu or the common cold.
Tonignton, an embryo is not human; it has potential to become a human being. And society recognizes that. Thus when a woman has a miscarriage, the state does not record the miscarriage as the death of a person. A woman is not required to hold a funeral for the embryo. Death of an embryo (miscarriage) is treated in a totally different manner than death of a person. A woman on welfare cannot start drawing welfare for two the moment she becomes pregnant. When government carries out census, it does not count the fetuses among its population. There are many ways in which the state acknowledges that an embryo is not a person, a human being.
All that means (chromosome number etc.) is that by a lot of care, attention, nurture and plenty of luck (there is always miscarriage, accidents etc.) the embryo may turn into a human being (i.e. a baby).
But the fact that it has the full chromosome number doesn’t make it any more human than it makes an acorn same as an oak tree. An acorn has the same chromosome count as a fully mature oak tree. But it would be absurd to claim that an acorn is the same as an oak tree. It is the same with embryo and a baby.
Response to #289.
TenPenney, I may be totally wrong on this, but my understanding is that miscarriage occurs when a womans body, for whatever reason, by its own natural urges resists to support and then rejects an entity that may have become a human baby.
Again I may be wrong, but my impression and my admittedly limited knowledge is that abortion is forced activity, a total antithesis of nature and the contradiction of natural human reproduction. Let abortion rule and see humans go on the way of dinosaurs.
So, miscarriage is the same as abortion about as much walking is to riding in a car.
TenPenney, I may be totally wrong on this, but my understanding is that miscarriage occurs when a womans body, for whatever reason, by its own natural urges resists to support and then rejects an entity that may have become a human baby.
Again I may be wrong, but my impression and my admittedly limited knowledge is that abortion is forced activity, a total antithesis of nature and the contradiction of natural human reproduction. Let abortion rule and see humans go on the way of dinosaurs.
So, miscarriage is the same as abortion about as much walking is to riding in a car.
Of course not. What makes it human is the human DNA it carries. The DNA that directs the cell movements. The DNA that directs the development of the human body plan. The DNA that directs biochemical pathways.
Did you know that the embryo has a different form of hemoglobin? Without it, and the slightly different affinity for oxygen, the embryo would die from lack of oxygen. The oxygen passes over the blood barrier in the placenta because it is attracted to the altered 3-d shape of the globin protein.
That is a direct result of our DNA. It's not unique to humans, but it's definitely a human trait. We also have gill slits at one point in our development, a result of our DNA lineage.
That is what makes it a human. It is a developing human.
Edited to add:
As to the acorn and the oak tree, this is a difference in plants. You should look into the difference between the sporophyte, and gametophyte. They are two different generations. One is a haploid, the other is the diploid. I'll leave it to you to figure out.
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Nothing sinks into the mush between this guy's ears. Most people's pets can listen better. lmao
Is that better? I might need a lesson in block quoting multiple quotes myself! :lol:
Bull****. aPAULing Martin was always telling erveryone what Canadians want, what Canadians are, how Canadians live, how Candians should live, etc.
What the f**k are you talking about. Joan of Arc was French. She had nothing to do with the USA. Have another few lungfuls of gasoline vapors or glue, whatever your druthers are.
Better him than me. And you are dead right. lolDo all these people wo quote differently go to the same school?? one uses color code another uses "quotation marks"
When you quote such a post the entire post is in your quote, not just the persone you are quoting....
Anyone reading your post can easily become confused as to who said what.
CDNBear is going to have to start giving lessons on how to quote properly
Yeah, I don't really care about that, Y.J. just impressed me in that he spoke a truth, where he got it from I doesn't make any difference- very few of us speak anything original anyway. Contrast that with those who insist that a fetus isn't a live object.