The Debate is better than I thought

Colpy

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 5, 2005
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I kinda like Layton.

Right up to the point he opens his mouth and starts talking policy.

It is like getting hit in the head with a nerf bat.....over and over and over and over. It IS kinda soft and fuzzy, but damn it gets irritating real quick!
 

In Between Man

The Biblical Position
Sep 11, 2008
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I kinda like Layton.

Right up to the point he opens his mouth and starts talking policy.

It is like getting hit in the head with a nerf bat.....over and over and over and over. It IS kinda soft and fuzzy, but damn it gets irritating real quick!

I like how he put Ignatieff in his place when Ignatieff snapped "At least we've been there!!!"(formed gov). That was an arrogant comment and Jack called him on it! Good job!
 

damngrumpy

Executive Branch Member
Mar 16, 2005
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kelowna bc
It is amazing how we all see things differently isn't it. I have a real problem because I just
can't support Harper and his type of conservatism. That leave two of three to vote for and
frankly I don't want any of them to get a majority. The Movie Title should be Four incompetent
men.
Harper stuck to his message but nothing new and people are tired of the same old, he did
better than I thought though.
Iggy he was on attack mode and like Harper he repeated the same old message the Liberals
are pushing.
Jack he actually had some great lines and was much more personable that the others
Doucepe he was a hard hitter tonight and despite the fact he doesn't count outside of Quebec
he will have influence on the Canadian map. I think he did well in securing votes from his
home province at the expense of the Tories mostly.

All in all most accomplished their goals tonight as I see it.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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I am not afraid to admit I wrote Harper off long before this election was called and long before the whole contempt issue arose. I think his fiscal and economic policy is fundementally flawed and he gives too much support to big businees and international corporations.

QUOTE]

Big business has to be well oiled if you want a healthy economy, we rely on business for a lot of our jobs- when business is stifled jobs are stifled................simple as that.
 

PoliticalNick

The Troll Bashing Troll
Mar 8, 2011
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See? That's called having a closed mind. It's called living in a fog. Preconceived notions that only serve your ill gotten philosophies.
If you even bothered to read my whole response I laid out exactly why I wouldn't vote for him. that is not a closed mind, it is an educated opinion (I have a degree in economics and commerce) his policies are fundementaly flawed. I can agree with some of his positions on ther issues but he is so far wrong in the economics I cannot support him. No fog there!

See how the other leaders kept doing that? A little dig here and there when then could? That's called a cheap shot and that's what little children who have no business running the country do. It's a cheap shot because it's "thrown in" as a side comment, midstream while answering the main topic. Cheap shot.
Hmmm, what did you expect ina leadership debate? A campfire and kumbyah?

Of course you don't because he stands for everything you don't believe in. You have a relative philosophy. Right is wrong, blue is black, a jar of piss is "art". Mr. Harper has the intelligence and has the self respect to never adhere to such nonsense.
What did you expect? Him to speak like the "messiah" Obama? "This is the moment that our oceans stopped rising and our planet began to heal!"
I could say the same about your support for him but I won't resort to demeaning your intelligence and integrity. Instead I will ask you to define which of his policies you support and why?

We don't need the greens and the commies getting representation unless the people mandate it. As it ever occurred to you that their platform, ideologies, and experience, aren't very strong and that's why the people aren't attracted to them?
The Greens had almost as many votes in the last election as the Bloc, 6% of the vote vs 7% yet the greens got 0 seats while the Bloc got 50. Do you think that is fair? Are you scared to let other opinions into our political system?

Also, I wouldn't say our system if broken. The green party has a candidate in every riding. Canadians could give them a majority if they wanted to. Leave it to free thought, don't manipulate the system give inexperienced people representation they don't deserve.
It is not about winning in a FPTP system we are talking about, is is about giving more people and their views direct representation in parliament. Harper formed the government last time with 37% of the vote, hardly a mandate of the will of the people. 63% wanted someone other than who was PM, think about that in relation to democracy for a moment.

See? So committed to the living in fog not even a cool hard million wouldn't budge you!
OK, for a cool million, untaxable, he can have my vote!

You would do well though to lower the demeaning tone of your posts and talk logically about the facts and issues, just a suggestion because continually repeating everyone who disagrees with Harper or your opinion is 'living in a fog' makes you look bad.;-)
 

Avro

Time Out
Feb 12, 2007
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Layton just scored a bunch of points (in my book) on health care - prevention, healthier eating, reducing salt, sugar etc. Now if he would just get it out of the public sector I might even vote for him. :smile:

Says the life long government employee.
 

PoliticalNick

The Troll Bashing Troll
Mar 8, 2011
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big business has to be well oiled if you want a healthy economy, we rely on business for a lot of our jobs- when business is stifled jobs are stifled................simple as that.
I have to disagree, if the people don't have enough income to go buy stuff it doesn't matter how well oiled business is, they will all close their door entirely. Conversely if there is a lot of disposable income with the people in an economy business will be good and will oil itself. Basically the law of supply and demand rule any economy, if you have no demand it doesn't matter how much incentive you give to create jobs there is no work to be done without the demand for what a business supplies. Harper is trying to fix a bottom-up problem from the top-down perspective and that is flawed.
 
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JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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Says the life long government employee.

Jeesus you can be f****g thick- I have absolutely no problem with public system employees, it's the system and the bureaucracy I have a problem with- the rank and file employees are excellent, some of the managers are questionable. You should open you friggn' door and take a look outside sometime AND GET RID OF THAT FAGGY AVATAR. :lol:

I have to disagree, if the people don't have enough income to go buy stuff it doesn't matter how well oiled business is, they will all close their door entirely. Conversely if there is a lot of disposable income with the people in an economy business will be good and will oil itself. Basically the law of supply and demand rule any economy, if you have no demand it doesn't matter how much incentive you give to vreate jobs there is no work to be done without the demand for what a business supplies. Harper is trying to fix a bottom-up problem from the top-down perspective and that is flawed.

Every time I go to town shopping be it the grocery store, the drug store, Home Depot, or the department stores they are all humming with customers- Canadian Tire is so busy you can't even get help in there. So what you are mentioning, Nick isn't even close to being a problem and I'm sure it won't be in my lifetime.
 

In Between Man

The Biblical Position
Sep 11, 2008
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Instead I will ask you to define which of his policies you support and why?

Management of the economy for one. Low taxes is a key element to your household surviving the recession. And low corporate taxes are key for job creation.
The Greens had almost as many votes in the last election as the Bloc, 6% of the vote vs 7% yet the greens got 0 seats while the Bloc got 50. Do you think that is fair? Are you scared to let other opinions into our political system?
If their platform is sound the people will elect them. What's wrong with working within our system? Do you think the NDP started out with 37 seats? No, they worked at it, gained experience, gained trust, they worked the system. Changing the electoral system would cost money in a time when we're pinching pennies. You do realize this right?

OK, for a cool million, untaxable, he can have my vote!
Typically leftie, selling out his principles for personal gain. :p:lol:

You would do well though to lower the demeaning tone of your posts and talk logically about the facts and issues, just a suggestion because continually repeating everyone who disagrees with Harper or your opinion is 'living in a fog' makes you look bad.;-)
I have no intention of being demeaning. Please realize that on this forum the unwritten rule is that you hit the ball as hard as you can.

Like my above quote "Typically leftie, selling out..." I'm just swinging as hard as I can. We are debating afterward. We cool?
 

PoliticalNick

The Troll Bashing Troll
Mar 8, 2011
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Every time I go to town shopping be it the grocery store, the drug store, Home Depot, or the department stores they are all humming with customers- Canadian Tire is so busy you can't even get help in there. So what you are mentioning, Nick isn't even close to being a problem and I'm sure it won't be in my lifetime.
That may be the case in the utopia of Kelowna but come to the Island for a visit and you will see a big difference. Go to northern BC and look, go to rural Ontario. And since you bring up the mega-big box stores, how is your little locally owned hardware store, how many small mom & pop businesses are doing well under the current situation. Who do you think deserves a break here? Home depot or your mom & pop locally owned harware store...if you still have one.
 

JLM

Hall of Fame Member
Nov 27, 2008
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That may be the case in the utopia of Kelowna but come to the Island for a visit and you will see a big difference. Go to northern BC and look, go to rural Ontario. And since you bring up the mega-big box stores, how is your little locally owned hardware store, how many small mom & pop businesses are doing well under the current situation. Who do you think deserves a break here? Home depot or your mom & pop locally owned harware store...if you still have one.

Vernon, man. Vernon- Who goes to Kelowna?

Actually there is a small hardware store downtown under the "Home Hardware" umbrella (and has no doubt been here 100 years) and is family operated, and per square foot they get more customers than Home Depot.
 

Durry

House Member
May 18, 2010
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I think after this debate, Harper has Majority in the bag.
All he has to do for the remainder of the campaine is to not have any more bad news items come up against his party.
 

In Between Man

The Biblical Position
Sep 11, 2008
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That may be the case in the utopia of Kelowna but come to the Island for a visit and you will see a big difference. Go to northern BC and look, go to rural Ontario. And since you bring up the mega-big box stores, how is your little locally owned hardware store, how many small mom & pop businesses are doing well under the current situation. Who do you think deserves a break here? Home depot or your mom & pop locally owned harware store...if you still have one.

They charge more at mom and pop stores! They can't compete! Get them out of here! It's called free enterprise! It's called progress!

Our population is growing too quickly and small stores can't serve the vast over consuming multitude of people you see out there. Have you been to Vancouver lately? There is too many people here and we need big business.

Times are changing. You don't leave your home unlocked anymore, you can't get milk delivered anymore, and you don't buy fishing hooks at Jerry's when you know damn well that you can get the exact product cheaper at Walmart. Plus you have to go there anyway to get socks, margarine, and toothpaste.

There will always be small mom and pop shops around, but their heyday is over. I'm a consumer and I want the best price, selection, and convenience.
 

PoliticalNick

The Troll Bashing Troll
Mar 8, 2011
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Edson, AB
Management of the economy for one. Low taxes is a key element to your household surviving the recession. And low corporate taxes are key for job creation.
After 4 years of studying the subject I disagree. Lower personal taxes and better wages increase spending power in the masses which in turn increases the demand that business relies on to justify creating more positions. If you lower corporate tax without increasing demand you just make the wealthy investors richer, and they don't change their spending habits.

If their platform is sound the people will elect them. What's wrong with working within our system? Do you think the NDP started out with 37 seats? No, they worked at it, gained experience, gained trust, they worked the system. Changing the electoral system would cost money in a time when we're pinching pennies. You do realize this right?
There are many other ways to pinch pennies that actually none of them would consider, the cost of running govt itself is a great place to start but try to get a politician to consider that. On this issue though I am willing to spend the dough to include more people's views into the democratic system, I think this is a worthwhile endeavor and would remove a lot of the disenfranchisement of a lot of the voters who don't even show up under our current system.

Typically leftie, selling out his principles for personal gain. :p:lol:
Not really, I live in a riding that traditionally votes about 75% NDP, my 1 vote wouldn't make a difference so for a million bucks, I'm in...LOL

I have no intention of being demeaning. Please realize that on this forum the unwritten rule is that you hit the ball as hard as you can.
Trying to hit hard is fine with me but the phrase 'living in a fog' is questioning a persons thinking ability and intelligence IMHO. Hit hard with facts and opinions and back it up with reason.

Like my above quote "Typically leftie, selling out..." I'm just swinging as hard as I can. We are debating afterward. We cool?
A sterotyped response is not a logical rational argument, nor is it based on fact, it is in fact a cheap shot like you refered to earlier but I get the drift of what you meant. We're cool, no worries. ;-)